Bodily Resurrection
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Hekuran
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Evidently the church in Corinth asked the same kind of questions. 1 Corinthians 15:36-44
But someone will ask, “How are the dead raised? With what kind of body will they come?” How foolish! What you sow does not come to life unless it dies. When you sow, you do not plant the body that will be, but just a seed, perhaps of wheat or of something else. But God gives it a body as he has determined, and to each kind of seed he gives its own body. Not all flesh is the same: People have one kind of flesh, animals have another, birds another and fish another. There are also heavenly bodies and there are earthly bodies; but the splendor of the heavenly bodies is one kind, and the splendor of the earthly bodies is another. The sun has one kind of splendor, the moon another and the stars another; and star differs from star in splendor.
So will it be with the resurrection of the dead. The body that is sown is perishable, it is raised imperishable; it is sown in dishonor, it is raised in glory; it is sown in weakness, it is raised in power; it is sown a natural body, it is raised a spiritual body.
TBH I'm not sure if that leaves me enlightened or more perplexed.
What can we say? God has it in hand. He'll work it out.
Beetow
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FAQ: Jesus' body was easy to restore to life because it was all in one place and still
intact. (Ps 16:8-10, Acts 2:25-32) How can a corpse be returned to life that's
been obliterated by a bomb, or eaten and digested by beasts, or cremated, or
rotted away due to lack of embalming?
REPLY: Not everyone sleeping in the dust per Dan 12:2 is doing so as a corpse. In
time, left to nature, everyone's body decomposes enough to disappear altogether.
But regardless of how someone's body is disposed, destroyed and/or disintegrated;
it can be rebuilt from scratch just as easily as Adam's body was built from scratch
in the beginning.
FAQ: Supposing some of the atoms that made my body go into making another
person's body after mine is dead and dissolved back to dust? How will God fully
restore both our bodies to life seeing as how He will have need of the atoms of each
of us to do so?
REPLY: The chemical constitution of the various natural atoms listed on the periodic
table are identical; it's not as if they're snowflakes; viz: if God needs some carbon
atoms to reconstruct your body, He could utilize carbon atoms from a Sequoia
cactus and they would work just fine without the slightest need for adjustment
because every carbon atom on earth is a precise duplicate of every other carbon
atom on earth; viz: all carbon atoms are just one kind of carbon atom, i.e. the
carbon atoms in your body are not unique.
So it isn't necessary for God to locate all your original carbon atoms in order to
reconstruct your original body; He just needs carbon atoms; and they are very
plentiful in nature: same with other kinds of atoms, e.g. iron, calcium, phosphorus,
sodium, magnesium, hydrogen, nitrogen, etc.
FAQ: Was Jesus' crucified dead body resurrected in a glorified form, or as it was
before the cross?
REPLY: Jesus predicted his body would be restored-- he didn't predict it would be
replaced and/or improved. (John 2:18-22)
FAQ: But wasn't his resurrected body able to do things that his normal body never
did; like pass thru closed doors and to suddenly appear and disappear?
REPLY: If Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego could walk thru fire in a normal body,
then I should think it not all that difficult for Jesus to pass thru walls in a normal
body.
And if Philip could be instantly transported in a normal body, they for sure Jesus
could too.
The properties of one's body do not determine what God can do with it, or cannot
do, viz: when analyzing miracles, I suggest we avoid differentiating between the
possible and the impossible. (cf. Luke 1:34-37)
_
FAQ: Jesus' body was easy to restore to life because it was all in one place and still
intact. (Ps 16:8-10, Acts 2:25-32) How can a corpse be returned to life that's
been obliterated by a bomb, or eaten and digested by beasts, or cremated, or
rotted away due to lack of embalming?
REPLY: Not everyone sleeping in the dust per Dan 12:2 is doing so as a corpse. In
time, left to nature, everyone's body decomposes enough to disappear altogether.
But regardless of how someone's body is disposed, destroyed and/or disintegrated;
it can be rebuilt from scratch just as easily as Adam's body was built from scratch
in the beginning.
FAQ: Supposing some of the atoms that made my body go into making another
person's body after mine is dead and dissolved back to dust? How will God fully
restore both our bodies to life seeing as how He will have need of the atoms of each
of us to do so?
REPLY: The chemical constitution of the various natural atoms listed on the periodic
table are identical; it's not as if they're snowflakes; viz: if God needs some carbon
atoms to reconstruct your body, He could utilize carbon atoms from a Sequoia
cactus and they would work just fine without the slightest need for adjustment
because every carbon atom on earth is a precise duplicate of every other carbon
atom on earth; viz: all carbon atoms are just one kind of carbon atom, i.e. the
carbon atoms in your body are not unique.
So it isn't necessary for God to locate all your original carbon atoms in order to
reconstruct your original body; He just needs carbon atoms; and they are very
plentiful in nature: same with other kinds of atoms, e.g. iron, calcium, phosphorus,
sodium, magnesium, hydrogen, nitrogen, etc.
FAQ: Was Jesus' crucified dead body resurrected in a glorified form, or as it was
before the cross?
REPLY: Jesus predicted his body would be restored-- he didn't predict it would be
replaced and/or improved. (John 2:18-22)
FAQ: But wasn't his resurrected body able to do things that his normal body never
did; like pass thru closed doors and to suddenly appear and disappear?
REPLY: If Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego could walk thru fire in a normal body,
then I should think it not all that difficult for Jesus to pass thru walls in a normal
body.
And if Philip could be instantly transported in a normal body, they for sure Jesus
could too.
The properties of one's body do not determine what God can do with it, or cannot
do, viz: when analyzing miracles, I suggest we avoid differentiating between the
possible and the impossible. (cf. Luke 1:34-37)
_
Beetow
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Below is a passage utilized as proof text to substantiate the belief that Jesus was
restored to life as an angel instead of the man he was on the cross.
"Christ also died for sins once for all, the just for the unjust, in order that he might
bring us to God, having been put to death in the flesh, but made alive in the spirit;
in which also He went and made proclamation to the spirits now in prison, who once
were disobedient, when the patience of God kept waiting in the days of Noah,
during the construction of the ark, in which a few, that is, eight persons, were
brought safely through the water." (1Pet 3:18 20)
It's true that Jesus today has a so-called glorified body. (Phil 3:21) And it's true
that one of his glorified body's properties is immortality. (Rom 6:9, 1Tim 6:14-15,
and Rev 1:18)
Although Jesus' glorified body is immortal, it is still capable of dining upon ordinary
foods and beverages; and will do so in the kingdom. (Matt 26:29, Luke 22:15-16,
Luke 22:28-30)
In other words: when Jesus' body underwent its miraculous upgrade to immortality,
the process didn't transform him into a different species of life, viz: Jesus today is
still human.
● 1Tim 2:5 . . For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the
man Christ Jesus.
The Greek word translated "men" and "man" in that verse is anthropos (anth'-ro
pos) a very common word throughout the New Testament for indicating human life.
So; there are at least four things about Jesus today that we can be certain:
1) He's alive
2) He's immortal
3) He's capable of dining upon ordinary foods and beverages and,
4) He's an h.sapiens, i.e. a human life.
There's a fifth thing: Jesus' gender. Throughout the Bible, beginning with
Melchizedek in the book of Genesis; priests have always been humans and they've
always been males. God has never appointed a woman to that position. In point of
fact; God has never appointed women to be priests of any kind let alone high
priests.
Of Jesus it is said:
"Jehovah has sworn and will not change His mind-- You are a priest forever, in the
order of Melchizedek." (Ps 110:4)
"He was designated by God to be high priest in the order of Melchizedek" (Heb
5:10)
Melchizedek's order is immortal (Heb 7:1-3 & Heb 7:23-25) viz: Jesus today is not
only a man, but he's permanently a man, i.e. he'll never be a woman nor will he
ever be an angel.
"For surely it is not angels he helps, but Abraham's descendants. For this reason he
had to be made like his brothers in every way, in order that he might become a
merciful and faithful high priest in service to God" (Heb 2:15-17)
FAQ: If 1Pet 3:18-20 isn't relative to Jesus' resurrection; then what?
REPLY: It's relative to Gen 6:3, viz: 1Pet 3:18-20 is an excellent text that Jesus
(a.k.a. the Word) is a theophany, i.e. God's spirit in human form. And an
astonishing theophany it is because, in effect, the human side of Jesus' origin
places "My spirit" in a pedigree with Adam.
_
Below is a passage utilized as proof text to substantiate the belief that Jesus was
restored to life as an angel instead of the man he was on the cross.
"Christ also died for sins once for all, the just for the unjust, in order that he might
bring us to God, having been put to death in the flesh, but made alive in the spirit;
in which also He went and made proclamation to the spirits now in prison, who once
were disobedient, when the patience of God kept waiting in the days of Noah,
during the construction of the ark, in which a few, that is, eight persons, were
brought safely through the water." (1Pet 3:18 20)
It's true that Jesus today has a so-called glorified body. (Phil 3:21) And it's true
that one of his glorified body's properties is immortality. (Rom 6:9, 1Tim 6:14-15,
and Rev 1:18)
Although Jesus' glorified body is immortal, it is still capable of dining upon ordinary
foods and beverages; and will do so in the kingdom. (Matt 26:29, Luke 22:15-16,
Luke 22:28-30)
In other words: when Jesus' body underwent its miraculous upgrade to immortality,
the process didn't transform him into a different species of life, viz: Jesus today is
still human.
● 1Tim 2:5 . . For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the
man Christ Jesus.
The Greek word translated "men" and "man" in that verse is anthropos (anth'-ro
pos) a very common word throughout the New Testament for indicating human life.
So; there are at least four things about Jesus today that we can be certain:
1) He's alive
2) He's immortal
3) He's capable of dining upon ordinary foods and beverages and,
4) He's an h.sapiens, i.e. a human life.
There's a fifth thing: Jesus' gender. Throughout the Bible, beginning with
Melchizedek in the book of Genesis; priests have always been humans and they've
always been males. God has never appointed a woman to that position. In point of
fact; God has never appointed women to be priests of any kind let alone high
priests.
Of Jesus it is said:
"Jehovah has sworn and will not change His mind-- You are a priest forever, in the
order of Melchizedek." (Ps 110:4)
"He was designated by God to be high priest in the order of Melchizedek" (Heb
5:10)
Melchizedek's order is immortal (Heb 7:1-3 & Heb 7:23-25) viz: Jesus today is not
only a man, but he's permanently a man, i.e. he'll never be a woman nor will he
ever be an angel.
"For surely it is not angels he helps, but Abraham's descendants. For this reason he
had to be made like his brothers in every way, in order that he might become a
merciful and faithful high priest in service to God" (Heb 2:15-17)
FAQ: If 1Pet 3:18-20 isn't relative to Jesus' resurrection; then what?
REPLY: It's relative to Gen 6:3, viz: 1Pet 3:18-20 is an excellent text that Jesus
(a.k.a. the Word) is a theophany, i.e. God's spirit in human form. And an
astonishing theophany it is because, in effect, the human side of Jesus' origin
places "My spirit" in a pedigree with Adam.
_
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Dear Beetow,
I hope you mean refute, and not substantiate.
I can make the change if you'd like.
Just let me know.
With the Love of Christ Jesus.
Moderator
Nick
\o/
<><
Beetow
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I'm unaware of people using 1Pet 3:18-20 as a proof text to refute their belief thatI hope you mean refute, and not substantiate.
I can make the change if you'd like.
Jesus came back from death as an angel. Actually the very opposite, i.e. everyone
that I've encountered online uses that passage to support their belief that he came
back from death as an angel, especially Jehovah's Witnesses. (pg 334, Reasoning From The
Scriptures, ©1989)
Thanks anyway.
_
It is estimated that a least 109 billion humans have lived. Any thoughts on how long it's going to take to reconstruct each and every one of them?
Curtis
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Some assembly required
Beetow
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● 1Cor 15:35 . . How are the dead raised? and with what manner of body do they
come?
Everything that we know of in the cosmos-- all life, matter, and energy --is
composed of elements listed in the so-called periodic table. (There was a time when
every one of those elements were indigenous, but now several of them are
invasive, viz: man-made.)
Well; it seems reasonable to me that if God was intelligent enough, resourceful
enough, and capable enough, to create the elements we know of, then it shouldn't
be too difficult for Him to create any number of elements that we don't know of. (I
think it safe to assume that the world above is quite a bit unlike our world below.)
● 1Cor 15:50 . . This I say, brothers, that flesh and blood cannot inherit God’s
kingdom, neither does corruption inherit incorruption.
(According to John 3:3-12, God's kingdom will be established on Earth.)
Now; if I am reading the 15th chapter of 1st Corinthians correctly, then verse 50
refers to Adam, i.e. to the original chemistry of the human body. It's very possible
that Jesus' glorified body is composed of elements nobody has ever heard of; so
that instead of it transparent as thin air, it exists as heretofore unknown material
easily seen by the naked eye.
● Acts 1:11 . . Men of Galilee, why do you stand looking into the sky? This Jesus,
who has been taken up from you into heaven, will come in just the same way as
you have watched him go into heaven.
● 1 John 3:2 . .We shall see him just as he is.
● Rev 1:7 . . Behold, he is coming with the clouds, and every eye will see him, even
those who pierced him.
_
● 1Cor 15:35 . . How are the dead raised? and with what manner of body do they
come?
Everything that we know of in the cosmos-- all life, matter, and energy --is
composed of elements listed in the so-called periodic table. (There was a time when
every one of those elements were indigenous, but now several of them are
invasive, viz: man-made.)
Well; it seems reasonable to me that if God was intelligent enough, resourceful
enough, and capable enough, to create the elements we know of, then it shouldn't
be too difficult for Him to create any number of elements that we don't know of. (I
think it safe to assume that the world above is quite a bit unlike our world below.)
● 1Cor 15:50 . . This I say, brothers, that flesh and blood cannot inherit God’s
kingdom, neither does corruption inherit incorruption.
(According to John 3:3-12, God's kingdom will be established on Earth.)
Now; if I am reading the 15th chapter of 1st Corinthians correctly, then verse 50
refers to Adam, i.e. to the original chemistry of the human body. It's very possible
that Jesus' glorified body is composed of elements nobody has ever heard of; so
that instead of it transparent as thin air, it exists as heretofore unknown material
easily seen by the naked eye.
● Acts 1:11 . . Men of Galilee, why do you stand looking into the sky? This Jesus,
who has been taken up from you into heaven, will come in just the same way as
you have watched him go into heaven.
● 1 John 3:2 . .We shall see him just as he is.
● Rev 1:7 . . Behold, he is coming with the clouds, and every eye will see him, even
those who pierced him.
_
MedicBravo
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At best we can infer or conclude the most logical reason of something.
If God spoke everything but us into existence pretty sure he can create glorified bodies and restore every Christian as they should be.
Hekuran
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Yes, no need to give ourselves headaches speculating on the biology and chemistry of resurrection. God has it all in hand.
The more important question is how the future hope of resurrection shapes the way we live today
Beetow
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quick to use that verse in promoting their personal belief that Jesus was restored to
life as a spirit being rather than a physical being, i.e. an angel instead of a man.
_
Were it not for 1Cor 15:50 I would consent, but fringe elements out there are very
quick to use that verse in promoting their personal belief that Jesus was restored to
life as a spirit being rather than a physical being, i.e. an angel instead of a man.
_
B-A-C
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Luke 24:38; And He said to them, "Why are you troubled, and why do doubts arise in your hearts?
Luke 24:39; "See My hands and My feet, that it is I Myself; touch Me and see, for a spirit does not have flesh and bones as you see that I have."
Luke 24:40; And when He had said this, He showed them His hands and His feet.
Luke 24:41; While they still could not believe it because of their joy and amazement, He said to them, "Have you anything here to eat?"
Luke 24:42; They gave Him a piece of a broiled fish;
Luke 24:43; and He took it and ate it before them.
[AMP]
1Jn 4:1; BELOVED, DO not put faith in every spirit, but prove (test) the spirits to discover whether they proceed from God; for many false prophets have gone forth into the world.
1Jn 4:2; By this you may know (perceive and recognize) the Spirit of God: every spirit which acknowledges and confesses [the fact] that Jesus Christ (the Messiah) [actually] has become man and has come in the flesh is of God [has God for its source];
1Jn 4:3; And every spirit which does not acknowledge and confess that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh [but would annul, destroy, sever, disunite Him] is not of God [does not proceed from Him]. This [nonconfession] is the [spirit] of the antichrist, [of] which you heard that it was coming, and now it is already in the world.
1Jn 3:2; Beloved, now we are children of God, and it has not appeared as yet what we will be. We know that when He appears, we will be like Him, because we will see Him just as He is.
Luke 24:39; "See My hands and My feet, that it is I Myself; touch Me and see, for a spirit does not have flesh and bones as you see that I have."
Luke 24:40; And when He had said this, He showed them His hands and His feet.
Luke 24:41; While they still could not believe it because of their joy and amazement, He said to them, "Have you anything here to eat?"
Luke 24:42; They gave Him a piece of a broiled fish;
Luke 24:43; and He took it and ate it before them.
[AMP]
1Jn 4:1; BELOVED, DO not put faith in every spirit, but prove (test) the spirits to discover whether they proceed from God; for many false prophets have gone forth into the world.
1Jn 4:2; By this you may know (perceive and recognize) the Spirit of God: every spirit which acknowledges and confesses [the fact] that Jesus Christ (the Messiah) [actually] has become man and has come in the flesh is of God [has God for its source];
1Jn 4:3; And every spirit which does not acknowledge and confess that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh [but would annul, destroy, sever, disunite Him] is not of God [does not proceed from Him]. This [nonconfession] is the [spirit] of the antichrist, [of] which you heard that it was coming, and now it is already in the world.
1Jn 3:2; Beloved, now we are children of God, and it has not appeared as yet what we will be. We know that when He appears, we will be like Him, because we will see Him just as He is.
B-A-C
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1Jn 4:1; Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world.
1Jn 4:2; By this you know the Spirit of God: every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ has been resurrected in the flesh is from God;
1Jn 4:3; and every spirit that does not confess Jesus is not from God; this is the spirit of the antichrist, of which you have heard that it is coming, and now it is already in the world.
MedicBravo
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Jesus had a physical body after the Resurrection.
People touched him and heard His voice.
That's a bad analogy b/c Jesus was never an angel.
Twistie
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2Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is. 3And every man that hath this hope in him purifieth himself, even as he is pure.
Hekuran
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I didn't mean that Jesus' resurrection, or our hope of resurrection is unimportant – quite the opposite. It is at the very heart of my faith and without it, everything else unravels. I meant that trying to puzzle out exactly how it might happen in terms of chemistry, biology, physics is a dead end, that's all.
Alexthe first
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Ie. In their image
