fightngwrmwood
Member
- Joined
- Dec 24, 2005
- Messages
- 320
Peter 3:15-16 Simply proclaim the Lord Christ is holy in your hearts, and always have your answer ready for people who ask you the reason for the hope that you have. But give it with courtesy and respect and with a clear conscience, so that those who slander your good behavior in Christ may be ashamed of their accusations. And if it is the will of God that you should suffer, it is better to suffer for doing right than for doing wrong.
Our relationships with God are so personal; it is sometimes difficult to address certain questions without getting defensive. Or sometimes in our zeal or passion, totally of God, we can go too far, not taking into account where our audience is in their walk with the Lord, potentially causing more harm than good. But we are still responsible to give an answer. To have an answer.
A very sobering thought is that the Pharisees, the religious leaders of their times, (people that had incredibly large portions of the Old Testament memorized), the group with the answers, were the population of people that Jesus was the most upset with. Sometimes religious leaders topple, showing that what appeared to be fruit, was just a good show. We are reminded of something we thought was of God, wasn't His will at all.
Perhaps there are things we can't know - the Spirit will keep them hidden. However, if we are to have an answer, there are some fundamental things that we need to account for. One of those, I believe is discerning who is of the Lord and who is not. I have several reasons for this, but I want to briefly back track.
To get back to the example of the Pharisees, Jesus did discern this but then again, He was (and is) God. But He also told us to break evil bondage with fasting and prayer (Mk 9:29), to be wise as serpents (Mt 10:16), and that Satan can carry away a seed that does not take root in good soil (Mk 4:15). Other passages tell us about spiritual attacks, but clearly Jesus expected us to recognize and name evil.
Jesus also told his disciple Peter Get behind me Satan.(Mt 16:23 and Mk 8:33) Clearly, He was not saying, Peter you are going to hell. He was saying, Peter, you are obstructing the will of God.
Scott Peck (MD), in his book, The People of the Lie, writes,
"To proceed we need at least a working definition of evil. Yet in our hearts I think we all have some understanding of its nature. For the moment I can do no better than to heed my son, who, with the characteristic vision of eight year olds, explained simply, Why, Daddy, evil is live spelled backwards. Evil is in opposition to life. It is that which opposes the life force. It has, in short, to do with killing. Specifically, it has to do with murder, namely unnecessary killing, killing that is no required for biological survival."
He goes on to give several case studies of people he has treated, only two of which have to do with demon possession. What struck me most about the book was the clever subtlety of evil.
Perhaps, and hopefully, the scripture verse "Do not judge" has come to mind. Peck addresses this scripture better than I can.
"In labeling certain people as evil, I am obviously making a severely critical value judgment. My Lord said, "Judge not, that ye be not judged," By this statement so often quoted out of context Jesus did not mean we should never judge our neighbor. For he went on to say, Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother's eye. (Mt 7:1-5) What he meant was that we should judge others only with great care, and that such carefulness begins with self-judgment.
We cannot begin to heal human evil until we are able to look at it directly.
Obviously, the plank has to be out one should always have his or her own house clean. Additionally, this implies that pastors and leaders are held to a higher standard and are responsible for their flock. It would make sense that someone who needs to discern good an evil is held to a higher standard than what they expect of others. (Jm 3:1 Only a few of you, my brothers, should be teachers, bearing in mind that we shall receive a stricter judgment.) However, this is my opinion, which, if naming what is of the Lord and what is not, is also a necessary tool. There will be things where you don't know either way. Paul sets the example for the use of this. For other cases these instructions are my own, not the Lord's. He then goes on with his opinion. (1 Co 7:12)
Paul also talks about judging and makes an interesting remark that we are to judge our brothers and sisters, but not carry these expectations for the nonbeliver. In order to to this, we must discern the believer from the non believer.
It is no concern of mine to judge outsiders. It is for you to judge those who are inside, is it not? But outsiders are for God to judge. (1 Co 5:12-13)
Although outsiders are for God to judge, a person must discern inside from out.
Discernment requires careful and prayerful attention and people should be very conservative in saying what is of the Lord and what is not of the Lord. I can't emphasize this enough. Additionally it is only through the Holy Spirit that this discernment can take place, for only God knows the true spirit of every individual.
1 Corinthians 2:10-12
God has given us revelation through the Spirit, for the Spirit explores the depths of everything, even the depths of God. After all, is there anyone who knows the qualities of God except the Spirit of God.
It is good to be very conservative with discernment of good and evil. However, I notice something in myself that seems to come up in an entire line of reasoning I have seen in others too, which borders on the spirit of timidity Paul referred to as not from God. (2 Tm 1:7) There are times I resist naming good and evil at all, for fear of being wrong. I recognize this as pride, not avoiding being judgmental. The other danger is that evil unnamed has much more power.
So I am still (and will always be)
Fighting Wormwood
Our relationships with God are so personal; it is sometimes difficult to address certain questions without getting defensive. Or sometimes in our zeal or passion, totally of God, we can go too far, not taking into account where our audience is in their walk with the Lord, potentially causing more harm than good. But we are still responsible to give an answer. To have an answer.
A very sobering thought is that the Pharisees, the religious leaders of their times, (people that had incredibly large portions of the Old Testament memorized), the group with the answers, were the population of people that Jesus was the most upset with. Sometimes religious leaders topple, showing that what appeared to be fruit, was just a good show. We are reminded of something we thought was of God, wasn't His will at all.
Perhaps there are things we can't know - the Spirit will keep them hidden. However, if we are to have an answer, there are some fundamental things that we need to account for. One of those, I believe is discerning who is of the Lord and who is not. I have several reasons for this, but I want to briefly back track.
To get back to the example of the Pharisees, Jesus did discern this but then again, He was (and is) God. But He also told us to break evil bondage with fasting and prayer (Mk 9:29), to be wise as serpents (Mt 10:16), and that Satan can carry away a seed that does not take root in good soil (Mk 4:15). Other passages tell us about spiritual attacks, but clearly Jesus expected us to recognize and name evil.
Jesus also told his disciple Peter Get behind me Satan.(Mt 16:23 and Mk 8:33) Clearly, He was not saying, Peter you are going to hell. He was saying, Peter, you are obstructing the will of God.
Scott Peck (MD), in his book, The People of the Lie, writes,
"To proceed we need at least a working definition of evil. Yet in our hearts I think we all have some understanding of its nature. For the moment I can do no better than to heed my son, who, with the characteristic vision of eight year olds, explained simply, Why, Daddy, evil is live spelled backwards. Evil is in opposition to life. It is that which opposes the life force. It has, in short, to do with killing. Specifically, it has to do with murder, namely unnecessary killing, killing that is no required for biological survival."
He goes on to give several case studies of people he has treated, only two of which have to do with demon possession. What struck me most about the book was the clever subtlety of evil.
Perhaps, and hopefully, the scripture verse "Do not judge" has come to mind. Peck addresses this scripture better than I can.
"In labeling certain people as evil, I am obviously making a severely critical value judgment. My Lord said, "Judge not, that ye be not judged," By this statement so often quoted out of context Jesus did not mean we should never judge our neighbor. For he went on to say, Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother's eye. (Mt 7:1-5) What he meant was that we should judge others only with great care, and that such carefulness begins with self-judgment.
We cannot begin to heal human evil until we are able to look at it directly.
Obviously, the plank has to be out one should always have his or her own house clean. Additionally, this implies that pastors and leaders are held to a higher standard and are responsible for their flock. It would make sense that someone who needs to discern good an evil is held to a higher standard than what they expect of others. (Jm 3:1 Only a few of you, my brothers, should be teachers, bearing in mind that we shall receive a stricter judgment.) However, this is my opinion, which, if naming what is of the Lord and what is not, is also a necessary tool. There will be things where you don't know either way. Paul sets the example for the use of this. For other cases these instructions are my own, not the Lord's. He then goes on with his opinion. (1 Co 7:12)
Paul also talks about judging and makes an interesting remark that we are to judge our brothers and sisters, but not carry these expectations for the nonbeliver. In order to to this, we must discern the believer from the non believer.
It is no concern of mine to judge outsiders. It is for you to judge those who are inside, is it not? But outsiders are for God to judge. (1 Co 5:12-13)
Although outsiders are for God to judge, a person must discern inside from out.
Discernment requires careful and prayerful attention and people should be very conservative in saying what is of the Lord and what is not of the Lord. I can't emphasize this enough. Additionally it is only through the Holy Spirit that this discernment can take place, for only God knows the true spirit of every individual.
1 Corinthians 2:10-12
God has given us revelation through the Spirit, for the Spirit explores the depths of everything, even the depths of God. After all, is there anyone who knows the qualities of God except the Spirit of God.
It is good to be very conservative with discernment of good and evil. However, I notice something in myself that seems to come up in an entire line of reasoning I have seen in others too, which borders on the spirit of timidity Paul referred to as not from God. (2 Tm 1:7) There are times I resist naming good and evil at all, for fear of being wrong. I recognize this as pride, not avoiding being judgmental. The other danger is that evil unnamed has much more power.
So I am still (and will always be)
Fighting Wormwood
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