"House of Coffee"

[jiggyfly]

Acts 20:28-30
28*“And now beware! Be sure that you feed and shepherd God’s flock—his church, purchased with his blood—over whom the Holy Spirit has appointed you as elders.* 29*I know full well that false teachers, like vicious wolves, will come in among you after I leave, not sparing the flock. 30*Even some of you will distort the truth in order to draw a following.

I heard a very disturbing story today at lunch with a friend. A mega church in Raleigh NC is building a new 1500 seat sanctuary/ cafateria/ starbucks cafe facility. All in order to try and draw larger numbers.

I did a google search and found that this is not an isolated case, many churches are adopting this feature as a marketing stragety. One of the articles I read quoted a man saying,"The introduction of chain stores in churches is part of a broader attempt to make the church-going experience more like the outside world." This man is a director at a christian college.

Starbucks, from what I could gather online supports new age beliefs. Nothing good has ever come out of compromise and I assure you that this new alliance will produce the same result. This is just one more example of man running things, prideful, arrogant man.

Jesus said, " I will build my church"( Matthew 16:18 ) and He has his own way of doing things. He said, "If I be lifted up I will draw all men to me" and "My kingdom is not of this world". So when we see church organizations and groups doing things contrary to what Jesus has said about His church we can only conclude that it is not the church Jesus is building.

Matthew 7:13&14
13*“You can enter God’s Kingdom only through the narrow gate. The highway to hell* is broad, and its gate is wide for the many who choose the easy way. 14*But the gateway to life is small, and the road is narrow, and only a few ever find it.

In light of what Jesus said in Matthew 7;13&14,
when we see many flocking to these so called mega churches, that alone should be enough to atleast raise an eyebrow. These places have become more sensitive to the seeker than to the Holy Spirit.

If you are part of one of these mega, seeker sensitve, high level marketing, non-offending churches I'm not going to suggest you leave it. I suggest you flee from it as quickly as possible, ask Jesus where He is building and co-operate.

 

[Chad]

Great thread brother thank you for bringing this to light. Although I go to Starbucks often to read and green tea I will investigate into their practices and beliefs. I refuse to support evil corporations.

I feel sorry that Christ has to witness His Body [church] going astray from His Word and commandments. I'm in agreement that if anyone is patr of a church that practices such money marketing gimmicks, flee and find a TRUE BIBLE BASED CHURCH. Bible based, not man based.

Its bad enough we have pervesion of GOD's Word, we do not need to continue forth by participating in these false churches. I do encourage to NOT bail out on prayer no matter how discouraged you feel. Always pray for these people. They may be lost or they may be purely evil motivated. That is up to GOD to decide not us.

 

[fightngwrmwood]

I worked for a small business coffee shop where Starbucks moved in next door to take advantage of a prebuilt in clientelle. It happens a lot. So the good news is if you do like to go to Starbucks, the chances are there is a really good small shop struggling to maintain its business nearby!

fww

 

[Mike]

The house of Prayer has been turned into a den of Thieves ! Thanks Jiggy . MikeT4G

 

[AlabasterBox]

It's sad

 

[Coconut]

Matthew 22:16 A man came to Jesus saying "Teacher, we know that You are true, and teach the way of God in truth; nor do You care about anyone, for You do not regard the person of men." How different it is today with those who proclaim to be preaching His message.

 

[kindsfater]

I had heard about this very thing happening as well, jiggyfly. Here's the good news...God is in control! We must remain steadfast till the end and continue to pray for those who have gone astray. Thank you for the heads up and timely warning.

In His Love

 

[foreverwjesus]

Honestly, i preferr my flavored foldgers coffee and my porch swing. so starbucks I never had any interrest in anyways
Now as far with the church having a little fellowship hall or cafe' that is good but i have to agree if starbucks supports new age then no i wouldnt have anything to do with it

 

[SpiritLedEd]

Thanks Jiggyfly. Great post. It is indeed sad that a church congregation needs marketing gimmicks to grow its population. I doubt very much that that congregation will be planting

 

[SpiritLedEd]

will be planting any new churches. They are not really interested in spreading the Word of God.

 

[SpiritLedEd]

God's Word, preached by anointed ministers, does not need marketing gimmicks. The church I atttend has grown from 600 to over 1400 in about five years, plus, by the end of 2006 we will have planted at least two new churches in our area. And we don't use coffe house coffe, either.

 

[Coconut]

FEEDING SHEEP OR AMUSING GOATS
C. H. Spurgeon (1834-1892)

The mission of amusement fails to effect the end desired.
An evil resides in the professed camp of the Lord so gross in its impudence that the most shortsighted can hardly fail to notice it. During the past few years it has developed at an abnormal rate evil for evil. It has worked like leaven until the whole lump ferments. The devil has seldom done a cleverer thing than hinting to the Church that part of their mission is to provide entertainment for the people, with a view to winning them. From speaking out as the Puritans did, the Church has gradually toned down her testimony, then winked at and excused the frivolities of the day. Then she tolerated them in her borders. Now she has adopted them under the plea of reaching the masses.

My first contention is that providing amusement for the people is nowhere spoken of in the Scriptures as a function of the Church. If it is a Christian work why did not Christ speak of it? "Go ye into all the world and preach the gospel to every creature." That is clear enough. So it would have been if He has added, "and provide amusement for those who do not relish the gospel." No such words, however, are to be found. It did not seem to occur to Him. Then again, "He gave some apostles, some prophets, some pastors and teachers, for the work of the ministry." Where do entertainers come in? The Holy Spirit is silent concerning them. Were the prophets persecuted because they amused the people or because they refused? The concert has no martyr roll.

Again, providing amusement is in direct antagonism to the teaching and life of Christ and all His apostles. What was the attitude of the Church to the world? "Ye are the salt," not sugar candy-something the world will spit out, not swallow. Short and sharp was the utterance, "Let the dead bury their dead." He was in awful earnestness!

Had Christ introduced more of the bright and pleasant elements into His mission, He would have been more popular when they went back, because of the searching nature of His teaching. I do not hear Him say, "Run after these people, Peter, and tell them we will have a different style of service tomorrow, something short and attractive with little preaching. We will have a pleasant evening for the people. Tell them they will be sure to enjoy it. Be quick, Peter, we must get the people somehow!" Jesus pitied sinners, sighed and wept over them, but never sought to amuse them. In vain will the Epistles be searched to find any trace of the gospel amusement. Their message is, "Come out, keep out, keep clean out!" Anything approaching fooling is conspicuous by its absence. They had boundless confidence in the gospel and employed no other weapon. After Peter and John were locked up for preaching, the Church had a prayer meeting, but they did not pray, "Lord grant Thy servants that by a wise and discriminating use of innocent recreation we may show these people how happy we are." If they ceased not for preaching Christ, they had not time for arranging entertainments. Scattered by persecution, they went everywhere preaching the gospel. They "turned the world upside down." That is the difference! Lord, clear the Church of all the rot and rubbish the devil has imposed on her and bring us back to apostolic methods.

Lastly, the mission of amusement fails to affect the end desired. It works havoc among young converts. Let the careless and scoffers, who thank God because the Church met them halfway, speak and testify. Let the heavy-laden who found peace through the concert not keep silent! Let the drunkard to whom the dramatic entertainment has been God's link in the chain of their conversion, stand up! There are none to answer. The mission of amusement produces no converts. The need of the hour for today's ministry is believing scholarship joined with earnest spirituality, the one springing from the other as fruit from the root. The need is biblical doctrine, so understood and felt, that it sets men on fire!

Amen!

 

[kindsfater]

FEEDING SHEEP OR AMUSING GOATS
C. H. Spurgeon (1834-1892)
The mission of amusement fails to effect the end desired.

The devil has seldom done a cleverer thing than hinting to the Church that part of their mission is to provide entertainment for the people, with a view to winning them. From speaking out as the Puritans did, the Church has gradually toned down her testimony, then winked at and excused the frivolities of the day. Then she tolerated them in her borders. Now she has adopted them under the plea of reaching the masses.

My first contention is that providing amusement for the people is nowhere spoken of in the Scriptures as a function of the Church. If it is a Christian work why did not Christ speak of it? "Go ye into all the world and preach the gospel to every creature." That is clear enough. So it would have been if He has added, "and provide amusement for those who do not relish the gospel."

The mission of amusement produces no converts. The need of the hour for today's ministry is believing scholarship joined with earnest spirituality, the one springing from the other as fruit from the root. The need is biblical doctrine, so understood and felt, that it sets men on fire!
Amen!

AMEN, AMEN Coconut!!! It's not JESUS PLUS!!!! Praise GOD!

Our Pastor loves to quote Spurgeon! In fact he sent all the men in the men's disciple group a copy of one of Spurgeon's sermons from February 2, 1862 at the Metropolitan Tabernacle.

 

[jiggyfly]

From speaking out as the Puritans did, the Church has gradually toned down her testimony, then winked at and excused the frivolities of the day. Then she tolerated them in her borders. Now she has adopted them under the plea of reaching the masses.

Amen Coconut!

What the church can't prevent, it blesses. Kurt Tucholsky (1973)

 

[sunshine307]

Amen sister. Look how long ago that was written, and things haven't got any better.

 

[Jesuslovesu]

Last year i went to a big church (to visit) bigger than I had ever seen it had a coffee shop, a restraunt and a play land that would put mcdonalds to shame.Quess what else I found there... well... didnt find there? I didnt see a bible in case someone didnt have on I didnt see a cross...i would have had no clue I was a t a church if someone hadnt told me

 

[Fuzzy]

I've read a number of these posts or threads..however they're called and I'm not surprised. I once saw a large church bring in live animals and a huge number of full grown trees and plants up on stage to create a 'live' nativity scene. The aftermath was less than desirable. And nearly half the plants died for lack of care.
I agree with Chad...there needs to be prayer. Too many people are going to church for reasons that are not 'Christ-centered' or even biblical for that matter. They go to be 'comfortable' or 'catered to'. But we must not forget that we are dealing with 'earth-bound' people...christian or not. Someone said: "If you ever find a perfect church-don't go in."
I also like the mention of Spurgeon. I have a number of his sermons (printed from a web-site called 'Spurgeons Archives') and books as well. The man was truely a servant of God. His little book 'All of Grace' is right up there with 'Pilgrims Progress' and the Holy Bible as far as publications go.
As far as Starbucks goes..I never cared for their coffee anyhow. But I think a coffee-house is a good place for fellowship or bible study or to bring someone who wants to know about Jesus. It's not the place as much as it is the people. Luke 7:36-50 is a wonderful example of meeting people on their 'own ground', so to speak-and 'showing' them Jesus.

 

[evangeline]

I was blown away by that article by Spurgeon!!! How true!!!
The church that is obediant to God, that is glorifying Christ Jesus, and is alive with the Holy Spirit simply doesn't need clever marketing or cute gimmicks to draw people. See John 6:44&65!

I have a question that I would like people's opinions on.

My friend has a vision for opening a church in a shopping mall that would be open whenever the shops are open. I have seen something like it in Latin American countries. What do you think?


evangeline

 

[jiggyfly]

I was blown away by that article by Spurgeon!!! How true!!!
The church that is obediant to God, that is glorifying Christ Jesus, and is alive with the Holy Spirit simply doesn't need clever marketing or cute gimmicks to draw people. See John 6:44&65!
I have a question that I would like people's opinions on.
My friend has a vision for opening a church in a shopping mall that would be open whenever the shops are open. I have seen something like it in Latin American countries. What do you think?

evangeline

Someone has already been doing this, not just in shopping malls but in grocery stores and even in Walmarts. In just about every kind of market, there is ecclesia and the founder is a bit of an eccentric. His name is Jesus the Christ!