How Was Paul As Saul Called to be Saved?

[GodB4Us]

Just as all who are chosen as they were ordained before the world to be the first group unto whom the Father showed mercy to.

That particular set of verses is exactly the thing that leads one to believe that God will call everyone eventually. Paul was not better nor worse than any sinner though he thought he was but many have persecuted the church since its formation, but no one has received the divine intervention that Paul received. Why was he so special that this kind of revelation was made
to him vs the majority of mankind have nothing at all similar to this as a testimony of being called and are thus bound for hell?

There are some stories on the internet about Muslims having a vision or a direct intervention from the Son of God that converted them to believe in Him when the religious animosity of the Muslim community would not avail any one to be seeking God by way of Jesus Christ other than what was impose upon them to believe or else.

Here is one of those stories;

Muslims Experiencing Dreams and Visions of Jesus

Just as Saul was turned around for going in the wrong direction, so are these Muslims today.

 

[God's Truth]

Did Saul turned away from sin and turned to Christ or did Christ intervened and turned him around to believing in Him instead?

I am not denying that Saul became Paul in living a life of repentance as His disciple after he got saved, but he was not turning from sin when he was on the road to Damascus until Christ intervened and turned him instead.

He still wasn't saved by just believing, he had to repent of his sins.
You keep preaching that people can just believe and they are saved.
You go against the scriptures.

 

[B-A-C]

He still wasn't saved by just believing, he had to repent of his sins.
You keep preaching that people can just believe and they are saved.
You go against the scriptures.

I also believe people must repent.. but I wonder if there is a grace period for new believers?

scenario 1.
Maybe I just accepted Jesus yesterday.. maybe I don't know all the "rules" yet.
Maybe I don't know the Bible very well, and no one has really discipled me yet.
am I not saved yet?

Is there grace for "old" believers?

scenario 2.
I've been saved for 20 years. I've read the Bible, I know the "rules".
For the most part I've given up my old sinful ways. But...
I still stumble sometimes.
am I not saved?

Some on here, would say there is a scenario #3.
I believe in Jesus, but I can go on living like I did before I was "saved".
are they not saved?
Is there grace for those who continue in willful sin?

 

[Samson2020]

I also believe people must repent.. but I wonder if there is a grace period for new believers?

scenario 1.
Maybe I just accepted Jesus yesterday.. maybe I don't know all the "rules" yet.
Maybe I don't know the Bible very well, and no one has really discipled me yet.
am I not saved yet?

Is there grace for "old" believers?

scenario 2.
I've been saved for 20 years. I've read the Bible, I know the "rules".
For the most part I've given up my old sinful ways. But...
I still stumble sometimes.
am I not saved?

Some on here, would say there is a scenario #3.
I believe in Jesus, but I can go on living like I did before I was "saved".
are they not saved?
Is there grace for those who continue in willful sin?

You'll be repenting of sin until the die you die for as long as your in your flesh you'll never be perfect. Salvation is according to grace period. Not by any work, although one is expected
to make efforts at turning away from evil (repentance) and doing good. However, good was also on the tree of death in the garden of Eden. Sometimes what we think is good
may not be what the will of God is for that situation. I.E. crucifixion of Jesus, Peter says no way, but in retrospect??

 

[God's Truth]

It's interesting Saul thought he was "religious", doing God's work.

He considered himself "blameless" to the righteousness of the Law.

I was raised Catholic and when my mom was dying and she didn't receive her last rites before she could give her last confession, because the priest got held up for whatever human reasons, I realized the Catholic religion that was my life did not have God's Truth. I was only 24 at the time and I started a search for God's Truth not man's truth which took many years and ended with an amazing testimony.

What I am getting at is that as a Catholic, I was baptized as an infant and was raised believing I was already washed and had the Holy Spirit, if I sinned and felt contrite about it, that is what mattered, and if I went to a priest to confess it, that is what mattered. Can you see the similarity with Paul's before he was saved? I am not saying my life was like Paul's, I'm saying I believed I was already saved by just doing what the church said to do.
Paul was a Pharisee and they didn't repent of their sins for the new covenant. See Luke 7:30 But the Pharisees and lawyers rejected the counsel of God against themselves, being not baptized of him.
In my search for God's Truth, I threw out everything I believed because I did not trust it anymore. Long testimony made shorter...I got Jesus' teachings in the Bible and started doing what HE SAID TO DO, because too many denominations saying this and that, like "faith alone", and whatever…so I went straight to the source, Jesus' words in the Bible, and in it the first thing Jesus teaches is to repent of sins or perish. Well being raised as a Catholic and not believing I was a sinner per se, I struggled with the admitting I was a sinner part, but since I wanted to be saved by Jesus, I had to admit I was a sinner, so I did, I looked at myself and life without excuses and I repented of those sins. That is the beginning of an amazing testimony I have of when Jesus saved me himself.
I just want to help others to know God better, to know God's Truth and not some denomination's truth. I want to help people to have Jesus to be their Teacher and not got to people who call themselves scholars.

It seems we have some people who think that persecuting some Christians, they are doing God a favor.

Right! I have been reprimanded falsely by many site owners and mods and banned, for they are against their private site having such freedom of speech, and I have even been told by moderators and site owners that they are protecting people from me who have their beliefs.

I wonder how many "Saul's" we have around here?

There are many who refuse to repent of their sins because they are taught to just believe. It is rampant out there that teaching.

Of course we know the story Saul met Jesus and became Paul.


Was Paul changed "instantly"? I guess that's a hard thing to say.

He believed instantly, and still had to repent of his sins. Paul's conversion is proof that we have to make our heart right by admitting we are sinners and repenting of those sins first.

We know that Paul was blind for three days.


I read somewhere that "Straight street" is still in Damascus to this very day.


Paul wasn't filled with the Holy Spirit until at least 3 days after the event of the road to Damascus. So when was he converted?

He wasn't given sight and the Holy Spirit until after he repented of his sins.

 

[B-A-C]

You'll be repenting of sin until the die you die for as long as your in your flesh you'll never be perfect.

If I go by my "experience", then you are right, as I am not perfect yet. Yet, I wonder if there is scripture that says we 'HAVE' to continue in sinning after being saved?

 

[God's Truth]

Just as all who are chosen as they were ordained before the world to be the first group unto whom the Father showed mercy to.

That particular set of verses is exactly the thing that leads one to believe that God will call everyone eventually. Paul was not better nor worse than any sinner though he thought he was but many have persecuted the church since its formation, but no one has received the divine intervention that Paul received. Why was he so special that this kind of revelation was made
to him vs the majority of mankind have nothing at all similar to this as a testimony of being called and are thus bound for hell?

You are going against the scripture though, because Paul says he was saved---one of the WORST of sinners---to show that even a person with worse sins can be saved too. Paul WAS one of the worst of sinners.

 

[Samson2020]

If I go by my "experience", then you are right, as I am not perfect yet. Yet, I wonder if there is scripture that says we 'HAVE' to continue in sinning after being saved?

It would be wise to not continue but that tongue is a hard thing to bridle, and a lie is a lie even if you don't know your lying. We believe we have things right and continue to preach
according to what we think we understand. But are we absolutely right, and speak no lie??
If one were to follow Jesus' example to the fullness, he/she would never speak a word without the Holy Ghost telling us what to say so we know that we said the absolute truth.
Just an example of a thing we might not consider a sin, probably because we were doing it according to a good work as we saw it.

 

[Samson2020]

You are going against the scripture though, because Paul says he was saved---one of the WORST of sinners---to show that even a person with worse sins can be saved too. Paul WAS one of the worst of sinners.

Paul only considered himself the worst of sinners as according to scripture sin is sin. There is no difference between adultery and murder and bearing false witness, sin is sin.

 

[God's Truth]

Verse 15 here is sometimes used to support pre-destination.

The plan for salvation was predestined, we are not, even though God knows who will chose Him. We have to be careful not to fall into the false doctrines of people like Luther and Calvin.
Paul was in the plan for helping lay the foundation of salvation, the plan that was made before anything was created.

In any case, Paul says he didn't go meet the previous disciples immediately, but was in Damascus (possibly Arabia too) for 3 years.
When we read the account is Acts 9...

It sounds like maybe it was a few days after he was at Ananias's house. But when I read Galatians 1. It seems like it was at least 3 years between Acts 9:18; and Acts 9:26;.
It we add Galatians 2 in the mix, then it was at least 14 years later.

The point Paul was making is that he was saved and chosen by Jesus himself and not by the other Apostles, because an Apostle is one taught by Jesus and had no prior training and teaching from another.
See people still didn't trust Paul and he was defending himself.

 

[B-A-C]

There is no difference between adultery and murder and bearing false witness, sin is sin.

John 19:11; Jesus answered, "You would have no authority over Me, unless it had been given you from above; for this reason he who delivered Me to you has the greater sin."
Jesus says some people commit "a greater sin".

Lev 18:22; 'You shall not lie with a male as one lies with a female; it is an abomination.
God calls some sins an "abomination". But yet not all sins are an abomination.

Matt 12:31; "Therefore I say to you, any sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven people, but blasphemy against the Spirit shall not be forgiven.
Jesus says all sins except for one, can be forgiven.

1Jn 5:16; If anyone sees his brother committing a sin not leading to death, he shall ask and God will for him give life to those who commit sin not leading to death. There is a sin leading to death; I do not say that he should make request for this.
1Jn 5:17; All unrighteousness is sin, and there is a sin not leading to death.
Apparently at least one sin, doesn't "lead to death".

Luke 12:47; "And that slave who knew his master's will and did not get ready or act in accord with his will, will receive many lashes,
Luke 12:48; but the one who did not know it, and committed deeds worthy of a flogging, will receive but few. From everyone who has been given much, much will be required; and to whom they entrusted much, of him they will ask all the more.
It seems there is more grace for the "ignorant". They will still be punished, but not equally to those who "knew better".

 

[God's Truth]

Just as all who are chosen as they were ordained before the world to be the first group unto whom the Father showed mercy to.

No one is saved before they are saved. Paul was chosen in the plan that was made before the creation of the world and before anything.

Paul says he was one unnaturally born.
That means he didn't become an Apostle like the others did...he didn't live with Jesus while Jesus walked the earth, he wasn't taught by Jesus and experience everything Jesus went through while Jesus had his ministry.

That particular set of verses is exactly the thing that leads one to believe that God will call everyone eventually.

God does call everyone, however, many resist.

Paul was not better nor worse than any sinner though he thought he was but many have persecuted the church since its formation, but no one has received the divine intervention that Paul received. Why was he so special that this kind of revelation was made

Paul did get to have a special revelation, and he also suffered much because of it.
Paul was chosen and had the privilege of suffering as an apostle, because of God's mercy, and to show us all that even the WORST OF SINNERS CAN BE FORGIVEN. See 1 Timothy 1:16.

to him vs the majority of mankind have nothing at all similar to this as a testimony of being called and are thus bound for hell?

It is going to be harder for people to have excuses anymore, for Bibles are so easy to get a hold of now.

 

[Samson2020]

Paul was in the plan for helping lay the foundation of salvation, the plan that was made before anything was created.

I'll buy that and also add to it that God had every little thing covered for all people before the first thing was created as ALL of His works were finished before the foundation of the world.
Even though it wasn't created yet!

No one is saved before they are saved

I think that is understood by all already

Paul says he was one unnaturally born.
That means he didn't become an Apostle like the others did...he didn't live with Jesus while Jesus walked the earth, he wasn't taught by Jesus

Are you sure you've read and understand what you read in the Bible?

Galatians 1:11-12 But I make known to you, brethren, that the gospel that was preached by me is not according to man. For I neither received it from a man, nor was I taught it,
it came through the revelation of Jesus Christ

Apparently at least one sin, doesn't "lead to death".

Not sure on that one as the wages of SIN is DEATH. But to only commit the "apparent" one in ones life would be pretty much impossible??

 

[B-A-C]

Paul did get to have a special revelation, and he also suffered much because of it.

John 20:29; Jesus *said to him, "Because you have seen Me, have you believed? Blessed are they who did not see, and yet believed."

It seems there is a greater.. ummm... reward? blessing? ..something for those who don't have to have a special revelation from God.

 

[GodB4Us]

I also believe people must repent.. but I wonder if there is a grace period for new believers?

scenario 1.
Maybe I just accepted Jesus yesterday.. maybe I don't know all the "rules" yet.
Maybe I don't know the Bible very well, and no one has really discipled me yet.
am I not saved yet?

Is there grace for "old" believers?

scenario 2.
I've been saved for 20 years. I've read the Bible, I know the "rules".
For the most part I've given up my old sinful ways. But...
I still stumble sometimes.
am I not saved?

Some on here, would say there is a scenario #3.
I believe in Jesus, but I can go on living like I did before I was "saved".
are they not saved?
Is there grace for those who continue in willful sin?

The question is what that call to repent is really all about?

If we look at how Gentiles were to get the remission of sins plainly ... it is by believing in Him and when they heard the word Thus believed in Him, they got the Holy Ghost before water baptism and even before they confessed Him with their mouths.

Acts 10:43 To him give all the prophets witness, that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins. 44 While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.

This same Peter gave the same calling of the gospel to the Jews at Pentecost but it is often overlooked because they apply water baptism as the means t get that remission of sins while some in here apply repenting from all sins as a means to get remission of sins.

But there is only one gospel and this same Peter was preaching the same thing for how the Jews were to receive the remission of sins also by what? By repenting from unbelief for having crucified Jesus Christ thus by believing in Him is how they were to get the remission of sins.

Acts 2:36 Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made the same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ. 37 Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do? 38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

As many believers today believe the call is to repent from all sins rather than to repent from unbelief for the remission of sins, and yet others believe water baptism is the means for the remission of sins, but both ignoring Acts 10:43-44 plainly testifying by this same Peter how believing in Him is how one receives the remission of sins, many sinners turn away from Him because they know they can't stop sinning because they have tried.

Therefore sinners need to know the other hope we have in Jesus Christ that He can deliver them from their sins to no longer live in them as well as have the free gift of eternal life by simply believing in Him as our Saviour.

Then discipleship comes afterwards as we look to Jesus Christ trusting Him as our Good Shepherd & Friend to help us to follow Him by laying aside every weight & sin daily in living that reconciled relationship with God thru Christ.

 

[God's Truth]

I also believe people must repent.. but I wonder if there is a grace period for new believers?

That is a profound question.
The rampant teachings are faith alone and no need to repent, or the Catholics and Mormons and Jehovah witnesses, etc, who teach to adhere to their sacraments to be saved.

scenario 1.
Maybe I just accepted Jesus yesterday.. maybe I don't know all the "rules" yet.
Maybe I don't know the Bible very well, and no one has really discipled me yet.
am I not saved yet?

They have to repent of their sins.

Is there grace for "old" believers?

scenario 2.
I've been saved for 20 years. I've read the Bible, I know the "rules".
For the most part I've given up my old sinful ways. But...
I still stumble sometimes.
am I not saved?

Our salvation is about working out our salvation and training ourselves.
However, does the person really know God and have understanding? Are they ensnared to preach false doctrines?

Some on here, would say there is a scenario #3.
I believe in Jesus, but I can go on living like I did before I was "saved".
are they not saved?
Is there grace for those who continue in willful sin?

I know many of these people. They don't even believe they have to repent of their sins.

You did a good job at making these scenarios. It probably deserves more discussion.

 

[God's Truth]

John 20:29; Jesus *said to him, "Because you have seen Me, have you believed? Blessed are they who did not see, and yet believed."

It seems there is a greater.. ummm... reward? blessing? ..something for those who don't have to have a special revelation from God.

I think all can have a special revelation.

 

[God's Truth]

I'll buy that and also add to it that God had every little thing covered for all people before the first thing was created as ALL of His works were finished before the foundation of the world.
Even though it wasn't created yet!

I think that is understood by all already



Are you sure you've read and understand what you read in the Bible?

Galatians 1:11-12 But I make known to you, brethren, that the gospel that was preached by me is not according to man. For I neither received it from a man, nor was I taught it,
it came through the revelation of Jesus Christ




Not sure on that one as the wages of SIN is DEATH. But to only commit the "apparent" one in ones life would be pretty much impossible??

You misunderstand what I said. Paul wasn't taught by Jesus while Jesus walked the earth and had his earthly ministry, as the other Apostles.

 

[PloughBoy]

I also believe people must repent.. but I wonder if there is a grace period for new believers?

scenario 1.
Maybe I just accepted Jesus yesterday.. maybe I don't know all the "rules" yet.
Maybe I don't know the Bible very well, and no one has really discipled me yet.
am I not saved yet?

Is there grace for "old" believers?

scenario 2.
I've been saved for 20 years. I've read the Bible, I know the "rules".
For the most part I've given up my old sinful ways. But...
I still stumble sometimes.
am I not saved?

Some on here, would say there is a scenario #3.
I believe in Jesus, but I can go on living like I did before I was "saved".
are they not saved?
Is there grace for those who continue in willful sin?

Saving grace is saving grace!
But is it a grace for those who continue in wilful sin?

The answer is yes:
But it goes buy a different name: “The FATHERS. “WHIP”!

You should know that by now!

“The Whip of Correction “

He whips every son,, Severely whom He receives! So they will not be “Condemn with the world”!

If GOD have Not Laid The correction whip on you, you are not One of His sons.
But you might be a Christian.

 

[God's Truth]

If I go by my "experience", then you are right, as I am not perfect yet. Yet, I wonder if there is scripture that says we 'HAVE' to continue in sinning after being saved?

When a person wants to be saved, they repent of their sins, they crucify themselves on the cross with Jesus, which means they die to the sins of the world, they die, and then are born again, they raise up to live a new life, a life they live pleasing the Lord by obeying the Lord.

When that happens, a person is saved, born again, they now have the Holy Spirit, which is God the Father Himself and Jesus Christ living in them.
They are washed, purified and made holy.
They are born again and have a new life without sins, and are now to live up to that which they have received, they are to live up to that perfection and that holiness they received.

Hebrews 10:14 For by one sacrifice he has made perfect forever those who are being made holy.


After we are made perfect and holy by his blood, we are to live up to that.

Philippians 3:16 Only let us live up to what we have already attained.