The Positional Platform

[NetChaplain]

The majority of believers today are in legal bondage because they do not see the essential difference between our position and that of Israel under the Law. Israel depended upon their own obedience to get their blessings in the land. Christians receive their blessings because of the Lord Jesus’ obedience in their stead. He paid in full “the wages of sin”—which was death (Rom 6:23): and we have the “free gift of God”—eternal life. This gives us rest of heart so that we have leisure to love the Father for His own sake and learn to delight in His will.

The primary reason Christians today are living such unhappy, such empty, such weak and fruitless lives, is not that they are “not consecrated,” “not surrendered, “not self-denying,” ”not obedient.” The trouble, the one great trouble, is, Christians do not believe that they are “free from the Law, in Christ Jesus” (which Christians Gentiles were never under, as Christian Jews were before believing); and that they already have the glorious blessings they are seeking after and need only to claim them to enjoy them—that “their part” is simply to enter in and by the Spirit enjoy the infinite spoils of the Lord Jesus’ victory.

We died with the Lord Jesus, and were made alive “together with Him.” And with Him we were raised up and seated in heavenly places in Him; where, as a real fact, every child of God now is, in His sight and reckoning, whether by his own reckoning and consequent experience or not! This position in the Lord Jesus seated at the Father‘s right hand is the only platform from which the believer can consider aright the truths of the Word of God!

If positional truth, rather than the duties of attainment, were taught first to the saints, much more satisfactory results would follow the ministry of Christian workers. We should note most carefully that Israel was brought into Canaan (Josh 14:1), uncircumcised (in their heart, not in their flesh) and unworthy as they were, before they were asked (Jer 4:4) to take the circumcised, separated position as the people of God.

So we, as Christians, have been already brought by Christ Jesus our Head, in His death, resurrection and ascension, into the “heavenly places,” and to us have been given “all things that pertain unto life and godliness” (2 Pet 1:3). And it is always on the ground of where we already are, and what we already are, and what we already have, that the Holy Spirit speaks to us concerning our wholehearted recognition and acceptance of the blessed privileges and responsibilities of “the calling wherewith we are called.”

Paul does not ask a thing of the saints in Ephesians 1-3 but just to listen while he proclaims that wondrous series of great and eternal facts concerning them; and not until he has completed this catalogue of positional realities about them does he ask them to do anything at all! And when he does open his plea for their high walk as saints, everything is based on the revelation before given of the facts of their high character and destiny as saints: “I therefore . . . beseech you to walk worthily of the calling wherewith you were called” (Eph 4:1).

Let us cease laying down to the saints long lists of “conditions” of entering into the blessed life in the Lord Jesus; and instead, as the primal preparation for leading them into the reality of this life, show them what their position, possessions, and privileges in the Lord Jesus Christ already are. Thus shall we truly work in dependence upon the Holy Spirit; and thus shall we have much more abiding fruit of our labors among the people of God.

Wm R Newell

 

[kyval82]

i truley enjoyed this post.. ty!!
agree 100 percent! also if christians would believe that we still have the same power today as the apostles could you imagine the healings and soul winning we could do for the LORD!!! PRAISE HIS NAME!!! HE IS THE SAME YESTERDAY AS HE IS TODAY!!!!!!

 

[NetChaplain]

i truley enjoyed this post.. ty!!
agree 100 percent! also if christians would believe that we still have the same power today as the apostles could you imagine the healings and soul winning we could do for the LORD!!! PRAISE HIS NAME!!! HE IS THE SAME YESTERDAY AS HE IS TODAY!!!!!!

Thanks for letting me know you found the material useful and God's blessings to your Family!

 

[B-A-C]

If Gentiles aren't under the law, can they sin? If they can't sin, why do they need Jesus?

 

[farout]

The majority of believers today are in legal bondage because they do not see the essential difference between our position and that of Israel under the Law. Israel depended upon their own obedience to get their blessings in the land. Christians receive their blessings because of the Lord Jesus’ obedience in their stead. He paid in full “the wages of sin”—which was death (Rom 6:23): and we have the “free gift of God”—eternal life. This gives us rest of heart so that we have leisure to love the Father for His own sake and learn to delight in His will.

The primary reason Christians today are living such unhappy, such empty, such weak and fruitless lives, is not that they are “not consecrated,” “not surrendered, “not self-denying,” ”not obedient.” The trouble, the one great trouble, is, Christians do not believe that they are “free from the Law, in Christ Jesus” (which Christians Gentiles were never under, as Christian Jews were before believing); and that they already have the glorious blessings they are seeking after and need only to claim them to enjoy them—that “their part” is simply to enter in and by the Spirit enjoy the infinite spoils of the Lord Jesus’ victory.

We died with the Lord Jesus, and were made alive “together with Him.” And with Him we were raised up and seated in heavenly places in Him; where, as a real fact, every child of God now is, in His sight and reckoning, whether by his own reckoning and consequent experience or not! This position in the Lord Jesus seated at the Father‘s right hand is the only platform from which the believer can consider aright the truths of the Word of God!

If positional truth, rather than the duties of attainment, were taught first to the saints, much more satisfactory results would follow the ministry of Christian workers. We should note most carefully that Israel was brought into Canaan (Josh 14:1), uncircumcised (in their heart, not in their flesh) and unworthy as they were, before they were asked (Jer 4:4) to take the circumcised, separated position as the people of God.

So we, as Christians, have been already brought by Christ Jesus our Head, in His death, resurrection and ascension, into the “heavenly places,” and to us have been given “all things that pertain unto life and godliness” (2 Pet 1:3). And it is always on the ground of where we already are, and what we already are, and what we already have, that the Holy Spirit speaks to us concerning our wholehearted recognition and acceptance of the blessed privileges and responsibilities of “the calling wherewith we are called.”

Paul does not ask a thing of the saints in Ephesians 1-3 but just to listen while he proclaims that wondrous series of great and eternal facts concerning them; and not until he has completed this catalogue of positional realities about them does he ask them to do anything at all! And when he does open his plea for their high walk as saints, everything is based on the revelation before given of the facts of their high character and destiny as saints: “I therefore . . . beseech you to walk worthily of the calling wherewith you were called” (Eph 4:1).

Let us cease laying down to the saints long lists of “conditions” of entering into the blessed life in the Lord Jesus; and instead, as the primal preparation for leading them into the reality of this life, show them what their position, possessions, and privileges in the Lord Jesus Christ already are. Thus shall we truly work in dependence upon the Holy Spirit; and thus shall we have much more abiding fruit of our labors among the people of God.

Wm R Newell

NetChaplain: You have done excellent reasearch, and given a well thought post ! Wonderful ! Here is an issue I think most do not give correct thought to. Keeping the Ten Commandments are still the standard for the Christian. The Ten Commandments are the measure God uses to tell us what standard he expects from us. No one is able to keep each and everyone, when we sin. The Ten Camendments are not suggestions, but Jesus told us that if we kept the two Commandments He gave we would be keeping all the rest. Love the Lord with all our heart, soul, and might, and to love others more than yourself. Again no one of us can be perfect. That's why 1Jonn 1:9,10 are there for us when we sin.

When we surrender to the LORD JESUS CHRIST, we become New Creations, and we submit to Jesus willingly. For the unsaven person this seems inpossible and even foolish. But we dear ones in Christ Jesus have Jesus to intercede for us and the Holy Spirit to teach, convict, and even pray when all we can do is speak in groans when we can't speak. How wonderful it this ? Blessings.


farout

 

[kyval82]

If Gentiles aren't under the law, can they sin? If they can't sin, why do they need Jesus?[/Q

All sin... Gentile or Jew we all fall short. There is no one who cant sin save a christian walking in spirit in which case one actually cannot sin. however we cannot walk in spirit continously. it would be wonderful if we could!!! All must accept Jesus Christ as their savior to enter into heaven and be washed of their sin.

 

[B-A-C]

All sin... Gentile or Jew we all fall short. There is no one who cant sin save a christian walking in spirit in which case one actually cannot sin. however we cannot walk in spirit continously. it would be wonderful if we could!!! All must accept Jesus Christ as their savior to enter into heaven and be washed of their sin.

Agreed. But can you name a specific sin that we do? How do we know whether a specific act we do is sin or not?

 

[NetChaplain]

If Gentiles aren't under the law, can they sin? If they can't sin, why do they need Jesus?

Hi BAC - I can appreciate your reasoning but the Law under the Old Covenant was before Jesus called the Gentiles to salvation and for now, unbelieving Israelites have no covenant with God because "He taketh away the first, that He may establish the second" (Heb 10:9).

 

[B-A-C]

So let me get this straight. We have covenant number 2 because we were never under covenant one? Hmmm... is everyone under covenant two or just Jews or just Christians? You still havent answered the question about if Gentiles can sin.

 

[B-A-C]

Does this new covenant mean Christians can no longer sin? Or that all Gentiles can't sin (onlyJews can sin? ) or that when we do sin we no longer ha e to be obedient to the law 100% confess to priests and do sacrifices?

 

[kyval82]

Agreed. But can you name a specific sin that we do? How do we know whether a specific act we do is sin or not?

well the bible tells us what sin is. examples... cursing gambling drinking cheating lying... really if Jesus wouldnt do it i would say it is a sin. sometimes what we dont do can be a sin as well. knowing to do good and not doing it or not to obey Gods voice.. those are sin. and even to offend another brother or sister can be sinful.

 

[kyval82]

Does this new covenant mean Christians can no longer sin? Or that all Gentiles can't sin (onlyJews can sin? ) or that when we do sin we no longer ha e to be obedient to the law 100% confess to priests and do sacrifices?

it is so much simpler than that... we CAN all sin... ALL OF US... when we sin we MUST ask forgivness of our sin through Jesus before we are cleansed of that sin and forgiven.

 

[B-A-C]

well the bible tells us what sin is. examples... cursing gambling drinking cheating lying... really if Jesus wouldnt do it i would say it is a sin. sometimes what we dont do can be a sin as well. knowing to do good and not doing it or not to obey Gods voice.. those are sin. and even to offend another brother or sister can be sinful.

You mentioned cursing and gambling above, these are two of the commandments. So in other words, breaking the commandments is sin? Every one of the sins you mentioned is listed in the Old Testament. But NetChaplain says Gentiles aren't held to these laws. If that's true, how do we sin?

 

[B-A-C]

it is so much simpler than that... we CAN all sin... ALL OF US... when we sin we MUST ask forgivness of our sin through Jesus before we are cleansed of that sin and forgiven.

Is this a one time thing, or do we need to ask for forgiveness everytime we sin?

 

[NetChaplain]

So let me get this straight. We have covenant number 2 because we were never under covenant one? Hmmm... is everyone under covenant two or just Jews or just Christians? You still havent answered the question about if Gentiles can sin.

The Gentile has never been under the Law (Ten Commandments, sacrificial ordinances and all within the Mosaic Law). You will never see Scripture directing the Gentile to obedience to this because it was given to Israel only. This is why they are called "the people of God," because He started His union and fellowship with them and then to the Gentiles (the rest of the world) through them: "through their fall salvation is come unto the Gentiles" (Rom 11:11).

The "New" (Matt 26:28) or "Second" (Heb 8:7; 10:9) Covenant, which is also known as the "Everlasting Covenant," is not between the Father and man, but between the Father and Son, but the believer is the recipient of it. The New Covenant in Jesus' blood (Matt 26:28; Mark 14:24; Luke 22:20; 1 Cor 11:25) was made with the Father and Son from eternity past (1 Pet 1:19-21) and it consists of the promise of the Father to the Son that He would raise Him from the dead when He died (atoned) for mankind.

Scripture is clear in wording this and the most demonstrative passage is Hebrews 13:20, 21: "God . . . brought up our Lord Jesus from the dead, that great Shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant . . ."

If this interests you I would like to share with you the difference between unbelieving Israel's "Everlasting Covenant" (Gen 17:19--they will be saved in the future--Jer 32:40; Eze 36:26, 27--this has not occurred yet for the general populace is still in unbelief) and the believer's "Everlasting Covenant."

 

[kyval82]

You mentioned cursing and gambling above, these are two of the commandments. So in other words, breaking the commandments is sin? Every one of the sins you mentioned is listed in the Old Testament. But NetChaplain says Gentiles aren't held to these laws. If that's true, how do we sin?

I see now where you are confused.. we are not held to these laws as a WAY OF SALVATION. when Jesus was crucified we no longer went by the way of the law. we do not sacrifice nor feel if we break one of the commandments we need to make a sacrifice to God... We ask forgivness for our sin. i believe yes a christian should feel compelled to ask forgivness whenever they sin.

 

[james1523]

Christians and unbelieving gentiles are not under Old Covenant Torah including the 10 commandments. Unbelieving gentiles are under the laws of Noah, the pre-Moses laws, and the law of nature/conscience. And Christians are not under any law, neither the law of Moses, the law of conscience, or the law of nature.. but under grace (Rom 6:14).

 

[spirit1st]

Salvation is a FREE GIFT!
Rom_5:15 But not as the offence, so also is the free gift. For if through the offence of one many be dead, much more the grace of God, and the gift by grace, which is by one man, Jesus Christ, hath abounded unto many.
Rom_5:16 And not as it was by one that sinned, so is the gift: for the judgment was by one to condemnation, but the free gift is of many offences unto justification.
Rom_5:18 Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.

People seem to want to ADD to it ! God says it a FREE GIFT !




2Th_2:10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.

1Co 15:3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;
1Co 15:4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:

Rom 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
Rom 10:10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

That all there is too it !
Rom_1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.


Joh_6:29 Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.

People seem to want to put others in bondage to the way they think we all should live and worship ?

Many church preach you must be there slave to have salvation and to keep it ! It just not True !

Joh_8:36 If the Son therefore shall make you free, ye shall be free indeed.

Jas_1:25 But whoso looketh into the perfect law of liberty, and continueth therein, he being not a forgetful hearer, but a doer of the work, this man shall be blessed in his deed.
Jas_2:12 So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty.


So many see they cannot live up to what some churches require of them and give up ! sometimes we can do more harm than good 1 We need to be led by the HOLY GHOST and not our understanding !

My family hated to see me around when I got saved !
I was always judging about everything they did !

I had been taught so much was evil and I was quick to tell others ! Did not show much Love or Mercy ! Pretty selfish really !

 

[spirit1st]

Salvation is a FREE GIFT!
Rom_5:15 But not as the offence, so also is the free gift. For if through the offence of one many be dead, much more the grace of God, and the gift by grace, which is by one man, Jesus Christ, hath abounded unto many.
Rom_5:16 And not as it was by one that sinned, so is the gift: for the judgment was by one to condemnation, but the free gift is of many offences unto justification.
Rom_5:18 Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.

People seem to want to ADD to it ! God says it a FREE GIFT !




2Th_2:10 And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in them that perish; because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved.

1Co 15:3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;
1Co 15:4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:

Rom 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
Rom 10:10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

That all there is too it !
Rom_1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.


Joh_6:29 Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.

People seem to want to put others in bondage to the way they think we all should live and worship ?

Many church preach you must be there slave to have salvation and to keep it ! It just not True !

Joh_8:36 If the Son therefore shall make you free, ye shall be free indeed.

Jas_1:25 But whoso looketh into the perfect law of liberty, and continueth therein, he being not a forgetful hearer, but a doer of the work, this man shall be blessed in his deed.
Jas_2:12 So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty.


So many see they cannot live up to what some churches require of them and give up ! sometimes we can do more harm than good 1 We need to be led by the HOLY GHOST and not our understanding !

My family hated to see me around when I got saved !
I was always judging about everything they did !

I had been taught so much was evil and I was quick to tell others ! Did not show much Love or Mercy ! Pretty selfish really !

Not a living sacrifice ! But a living complainer 1 beating other down and Not lifting them up !

That why satan does beat other down !
1Pe_1:22 Seeing ye have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit unto unfeigned love of the brethren, see that ye love one another with a pure heart fervently:


Rev_3:19 As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent.

 

[B-A-C]

I see now where you are confused.. we are not held to these laws as a WAY OF SALVATION.

Agreed, but then you are saying before we were saved we were held accountable for not keeping them? And even after we are saved we shouldn't keep doing them?