What was Jesus saying when He said "you must be born again"

[B-A-C]

Galatians 5:22-26 (NKJV)

But back to Galatians 5. I personally believe this is closer to where we need to go to answer this question.

Paul gives a bit of a warning in Galatians 5.
1. It was for freedom that Christ set us free; therefore keep standing firm and do not be subject again to a yoke of slavery.
7. You were running well; who hindered you from obeying the truth?
8. This persuasion did not come from Him who calls you.
9. A little leaven leavens the whole lump of dough.

It seems they were doing pretty good for a while. But Paul is worried they will go back to "slavery" (of sin) and disobeying the truth.

13. For you were called to freedom, brethren; only do not turn your freedom into an opportunity for the flesh, but through love serve one another.
14. For the whole Law is fulfilled in one word, in the statement, “You shall love your neighbor as yourself.”
15. But if you bite and devour one another, take care that you are not consumed by one another.

More warnings... even warnings about being "too free" in their freedom.

16. But I say, walk by the Spirit, and you will not carry out the desire of the flesh.
17. For the flesh sets its desire against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh; for these are in opposition to one another, so that you may not do the things that you please.
18. But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the Law.

Verses 16 and 17 really lay it out. Walking by the Spirit means opposing the flesh. You can't "walk" by the Spirit unless.. you HAVE the Spirit with you. (IN you)
But even when the Spirit is in... you still have to oppose the flesh... you can't "do the things that you please"... some Bibles say "the things that you want to do".
Even though you have the Spirit in you... you still want to do the things of the flesh sometimes.

1 Pet 3:18; For Christ also died for sins once for all, the just for the unjust, so that He might bring us to God, having been put to death in the flesh, but made alive in the spirit;

I believe this verse in true in at least a few different ways. Jesus did die in the flesh... but was still alive in the Spirit... but even so.. He was still alive in the flesh (He was resurrected) after all of this.
We are still in the flesh also. Even if we have been crucified with Christ.

Rom 7:4; Therefore, my brethren, you also were made to die to the Law through the body of Christ, so that you might be joined to another, to Him who was raised from the dead, in order that we might bear fruit for God.
Rom 7:5; For while we were in the flesh, the sinful passions, which were aroused by the Law, were at work in the members of our body to bear fruit for death.

Being "born again".. mean dying to the flesh. Dying to the flesh doesn't mean we physically die. It means dying to your own wants and desires. Dying to "self" (ego, pride, lust, etc... )

Rom 7:18; For I know that nothing good dwells in me, that is, in my flesh; for the willing is present in me, but the doing of the good is not.
Rom 7:19; For the good that I want, I do not do, but I practice the very evil that I do not want.
Rom 7:20; But if I am doing the very thing I do not want, I am no longer the one doing it, but sin which dwells in me.

Having the Spirit in you doesn't automatically want you want to quit sinning (anyone who has never sinned after being a Christian, raise your hand).
I've heard some churches say "If you have the Holy Spirit in you... you won't even want to sin". This is the opposite of what the Bible says. Read Gal 5:17; and Rom 7:18-19; again.

The Holy Spirit just gives to strength not to. We are no longer slaves to sin. We are no longer slaves to our flesh. We are born again.. born of the Spirit. We have the power
to resist. To overcome sin now. When we sin now.. it's because we choose to.

Rom 8
4. so that the requirement of the Law might be fulfilled in us, who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit.
5 For those who are according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who are according to the Spirit, the things of the Spirit.
6 For the mind set on the flesh is death, but the mind set on the Spirit is life and peace,
7 because the mind set on the flesh is hostile toward God; for it does not subject itself to the law of God, for it is not even able to do so,
8 and those who are in the flesh cannot please God.

9 However, you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. But if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Him.

10 If Christ is in you, though the body is dead because of sin, yet the spirit is alive because of righteousness.
11 But if the Spirit of Him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, He who raised Christ Jesus from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through His Spirit who dwells in you.
12 So then, brethren, we are under obligation, not to the flesh, to live according to the flesh—
13 for if you are living according to the flesh, you must die; but if by the Spirit you are putting to death the deeds of the body, you will live.

This is what being "born again"... Born of the Spirit means... walking in the Spirit everyday. Battling the flesh.. everyday. Dying to the flesh everyday.

Luke 9:23; And He was saying to them all, “If anyone wishes to come after Me, he must deny himself, and take up his cross daily and follow Me.
Luke 9:24; For whoever wishes to save his life will lose it, but whoever loses his life for My sake, he is the one who will save it.

Jesus isn't just talking about martyrdom here. Here is talking about dying to self and living for Him. We can't do this on our own. We can only do this if we are walking "in the Spirit".

1 Cor 15:31; I affirm, brethren, by the boasting in you which I have in Christ Jesus our Lord, I die daily

We have to die to the old self in order to be "born again". The new cannot live unless the old dies. ( John 12:24; 1 Cor 15:36; )

 

[Sue D.]

Sue... I don't really know you. I've never met you. I've only read what you've posted here on TJ. It's all I have to go by... but from what I've seen, I would say you are saved and have the Holy Spirit.

Still....
I've heard Universalists, Antimonians, Mormons, and Jehovah's Witnesses tell me that exact same sentence... "it's something I 'felt'". But is it really really just a feeling?

Acts 1:8; 1 Cor 4:20;

It is something I have "felt" from time to time also. Certainly not just once, but I'm not sure we can base this on just a feeling.

Okay -- I 'felt' an inner peace in my heart that had never been there before. And it's never left.

 

[B-A-C]

Gal 2:19 For through the Law I died to the Law, so that I might live to God.
Gal 2:20; I have been crucified with Christ; and it is no longer I who live, but Christ lives in me; and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave Himself up for me.

Rom 6:5; For if we have become united with Him in the likeness of His death, certainly we shall also be in the likeness of His resurrection,
Rom 6:6; knowing this, that our old self was crucified with Him, in order that our body of sin might be done away with, so that we would no longer be slaves to sin;
Rom 6:7; for he who has died is freed from sin.
Rom 6:8; Now if we have died with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with Him,

John 12:24; Truly, truly, I say to you, unless a grain of wheat falls into the earth and dies, it remains alone; but if it dies, it bears much fruit.
John 12:25; He who loves his life loses it, and he who hates his life in this world will keep it to life eternal.
John 12:26; If anyone serves Me, he must follow Me; and where I am, there My servant will be also; if anyone serves Me, the Father will honor him.

1 Cor 15:31; I affirm, brethren, by the boasting in you which I have in Christ Jesus our Lord, I die daily
1 Cor 15:36; You fool! That which you sow does not come to life unless it dies

Have you been crucified with Christ. Is the old self dead? So that you can be "born again"... Born of the Spirit.

 

[Brother-Paul]

But back to Galatians 5. I personally believe this is closer to where we need to go to answer this question.

Paul gives a bit of a warning in Galatians 5.
1. It was for freedom that Christ set us free; therefore keep standing firm and do not be subject again to a yoke of slavery.
7. You were running well; who hindered you from obeying the truth?
8. This persuasion did not come from Him who calls you.
9. A little leaven leavens the whole lump of dough.

It seems they were doing pretty good for a while. But Paul is worried they will go back to "slavery" (of sin) and disobeying the truth.

13. For you were called to freedom, brethren; only do not turn your freedom into an opportunity for the flesh, but through love serve one another.
14. For the whole Law is fulfilled in one word, in the statement, “You shall love your neighbor as yourself.”
15. But if you bite and devour one another, take care that you are not consumed by one another.

More warnings... even warnings about being "too free" in their freedom.

16. But I say, walk by the Spirit, and you will not carry out the desire of the flesh.
17. For the flesh sets its desire against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh; for these are in opposition to one another, so that you may not do the things that you please.
18. But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the Law.

Verses 16 and 17 really lay it out. Walking by the Spirit means opposing the flesh. You can't "walk" by the Spirit unless.. you HAVE the Spirit with you. (IN you)
But even when the Spirit is in... you still have to oppose the flesh... you can't "do the things that you please"... some Bibles say "the things that you want to do".
Even though you have the Spirit in you... you still want to do the things of the flesh sometimes.

1 Pet 3:18; For Christ also died for sins once for all, the just for the unjust, so that He might bring us to God, having been put to death in the flesh, but made alive in the spirit;

I believe this verse in true in at least a few different ways. Jesus did die in the flesh... but was still alive in the Spirit... but even so.. He was still alive in the flesh (He was resurrected) after all of this.
We are still in the flesh also. Even if we have been crucified with Christ.

Rom 7:4; Therefore, my brethren, you also were made to die to the Law through the body of Christ, so that you might be joined to another, to Him who was raised from the dead, in order that we might bear fruit for God.
Rom 7:5; For while we were in the flesh, the sinful passions, which were aroused by the Law, were at work in the members of our body to bear fruit for death.

Being "born again".. mean dying to the flesh. Dying to the flesh doesn't mean we physically die. It means dying to your own wants and desires. Dying to "self" (ego, pride, lust, etc... )

Rom 7:18; For I know that nothing good dwells in me, that is, in my flesh; for the willing is present in me, but the doing of the good is not.
Rom 7:19; For the good that I want, I do not do, but I practice the very evil that I do not want.
Rom 7:20; But if I am doing the very thing I do not want, I am no longer the one doing it, but sin which dwells in me.

Having the Spirit in you doesn't automatically want you want to quit sinning (anyone who has never sinned after being a Christian, raise your hand).
I've heard some churches say "If you have the Holy Spirit in you... you won't even want to sin". This is the opposite of what the Bible says. Read Gal 5:17; and Rom 7:18-19; again.

The Holy Spirit just gives to strength not to. We are no longer slaves to sin. We are no longer slaves to our flesh. We are born again.. born of the Spirit. We have the power
to resist. To overcome sin now. When we sin now.. it's because we choose to.

Rom 8
4. so that the requirement of the Law might be fulfilled in us, who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit.
5 For those who are according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who are according to the Spirit, the things of the Spirit.
6 For the mind set on the flesh is death, but the mind set on the Spirit is life and peace,
7 because the mind set on the flesh is hostile toward God; for it does not subject itself to the law of God, for it is not even able to do so,
8 and those who are in the flesh cannot please God.

9 However, you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. But if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Him.

10 If Christ is in you, though the body is dead because of sin, yet the spirit is alive because of righteousness.
11 But if the Spirit of Him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, He who raised Christ Jesus from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through His Spirit who dwells in you.
12 So then, brethren, we are under obligation, not to the flesh, to live according to the flesh—
13 for if you are living according to the flesh, you must die; but if by the Spirit you are putting to death the deeds of the body, you will live.

This is what being "born again"... Born of the Spirit means... walking in the Spirit everyday. Battling the flesh.. everyday. Dying to the flesh everyday.

Luke 9:23; And He was saying to them all, “If anyone wishes to come after Me, he must deny himself, and take up his cross daily and follow Me.
Luke 9:24; For whoever wishes to save his life will lose it, but whoever loses his life for My sake, he is the one who will save it.

Jesus isn't just talking about martyrdom here. Here is talking about dying to self and living for Him. We can't do this on our own. We can only do this if we are walking "in the Spirit".

1 Cor 15:31; I affirm, brethren, by the boasting in you which I have in Christ Jesus our Lord, I die daily

We have to die to the old self in order to be "born again". The new cannot live unless the old dies. ( John 12:24; 1 Cor 15:36; )

Excellent brother PTL

 

[rhern53]

I was only reading a little on this yesterday.

1. Spirit of the Lord.
2. Spirit of Knowledge.
3. Spirit of Understanding.
4. Spirit of Wisdom.
5. Spirit of Counsel.
6. Spirit of Power.
7. Spirit of the Fear of the Lord.

The seven Spirits are the seven stars.

In the Christian Bible, the term Seven Spirits of God appears four times in the Book of Revelation.

Revelation 1:4-6 (NKJV)
4 John, to the seven churches which are in Asia: Grace to you and peace from Him who is and who was and who is to come, and from the seven Spirits who are before His throne,

5 and from Jesus Christ, the faithful witness, the firstborn from the dead, and the ruler over the kings of the earth. To Him who loved us and washed us from our sins in His own blood,

6 and has made us kings and priests to His God and Father, to Him be glory and dominion forever and ever. Amen.

Revelation 3:1 (NKJV)
1 "And to the angel of the church in Sardis write, 'These things says He who has the seven Spirits of God and the seven stars: "I know your works, that you have a name that you are alive, but you are dead.

Revelation 4:4-5 (NKJV)
4 Around the throne were twenty-four thrones, and on the thrones I saw twenty-four elders sitting, clothed in white robes; and they had crowns of gold on their heads.

5 And from the throne proceeded lightnings, thunderings, and voices. Seven lamps of fire were burning before the throne, which are the seven Spirits of God.

Revelation 5:6-7 (NKJV)
6 And I looked, and behold, in the midst of the throne and of the four living creatures, and in the midst of the elders, stood a Lamb as though it had been slain, having seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven Spirits of God sent out into all the earth.

7 Then He came and took the scroll out of the right hand of Him who sat on the throne.

The lampstand with 7 lamps on top, is John remembering or being reminded of the following?

Zechariah 4:10 (NKJV)
10 For who has despised the day of small things? For these seven rejoice to see The plumb line in the hand of Zerubbabel. They are the eyes of the LORD, Which scan to and fro throughout the whole earth."

This verse though linking with what John said in Revelation, is always handy to cling to, especially when suffering trials, as we all do, and as many are right now.

We are under the watchful eye of God through the ministry and presence of the Holy Spirit in our lives

When we invite the Holy Spirit to live in our hearts, and become new creations, born again from above, the seven eyes and seven lamps as described above show that God is always watching over us, and He is mighty to save and to deliver us out of sin and darkness and into His wonderful and glorious light.

Amen