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Are we a False Prophet?

I can tell you why there are no longer any prophets or apostles but would any of you believe it?

@ Curtis...

Spoken like a true Pentecostal!

Jesus was an apostle because he was hand picked and sent by his Father.
To be an apostle one had to...
1. Be hand picked by Jesus.
2. Witness the baptism, miracles, crucifixion, and/or the ascension of Christ.

Not everyone could be considered for an apostleship. To be an apostle, one had to have been with Jesus during the whole three years that Jesus was among them. They had to witness his baptism, hear and understand his teachings, see his miracles, witness his sacrifice on the cross, seen him after his resurrection, and witness the ascension. These were the core events that had to be witnessed for the message of the gospel to be preached. An apostle had to be a personal witness of all the above to verify the truth of the good news.

There's no scriptural evidence that indicates the apostles were replaced when they died. It also appears that there were more than the 13. The apostles were appointed by Jesus to lay the foundation of the church. A foundation only needs to be laid once. To say we have apostles today is like laying a foundation on the fourth floor. After the apostles’ died, other positions and offices not requiring an eyewitness of Jesus work would continue to move the church forward.

PROPHETS...

The same is true with prophets as with apostles. The position was a temporary one given for laying the foundation of the emerging Church. The early first century church didn't have a bible. They often didn't have much of any of the written Word. Prophets, like apostles, filled that gap and were instrumental to the growth and life of the early church. Why would we need prophets today when all the prophecies are given and the foundation and establishment of the church is finished?

Other than what we read in the Old and New Testament books, the Didache is the authority on the office of the prophets. In the NT church prophets went from church to church 'telling forth' God's Will for the establishment of the church. They were 'wandering prophets' as they had no place to live, were only meant to stay for no more than a few days, had no family, and were not allowed to receive any money. The position was often abused as they often extended their stay and accepted money and lived large at the expense of the congregation.
 
BLACKSHEEP said:
Jesus was an apostle because he was hand picked and sent by his Father.
To be an apostle one had to...
1. Be hand picked by Jesus.
2. Witness the baptism, miracles, crucifixion, and/or the ascension of Christ
Click to expand...

Hmmm... I wonder if Barnabas did all of these things. Especially since Jesus was already ascended.

Acts 14:14; But when the apostles Barnabas and Paul heard of it, they tore their robes and rushed out into the crowd, crying out

Rom 16:7; Greet Andronicus and Junias, my kinsmen and my fellow prisoners, who are outstanding among the apostles, who also were in Christ before me.
 
BLACKSHEEP said:
Not everyone could be considered for an apostleship. To be an apostle, one had to have been with Jesus during the whole three years that Jesus was among them. They had to witness his baptism, hear and understand his teachings, see his miracles, witness his sacrifice on the cross, seen him after his resurrection, and witness the ascension. These were the core events that had to be witnessed for the message of the gospel to be preached. An apostle had to be a personal witness of all the above to verify the truth of the good news.

There's no scriptural evidence that indicates the apostles were replaced when they died.
Click to expand...

Keep the apostle Paul in mind and also Matthias who was selected to replace Judas who had killed himself (Matthew 27:5).
Now there is conjecture on why Matthias was selected at that particular time and not later, but the one thing we do know is that he was selected to replace Judas, to place their number from 11 to 12.

Sadly, now a days, I do believe you might be finding not just 12, but hundreds if not thousands professing to be apostles!!
Personally, I doubt they are, but in truth all that will come to light one day.
Which will be to the Glory of God or their shame/condemnation.

With the Love of Christ Jesus.
YBIC
Nick
<><
 
BLACKSHEEP said:
The same is true with prophets as with apostles. The position was a temporary one given for laying the foundation of the emerging Church.
Click to expand...

1 Cor 14:1 Pursue love, yet desire earnestly spiritual gifts, but especially that you may prophesy.
1 Cor 14:2 For one who speaks in a tongue does not speak to men but to God; for no one understands, but in his spirit he speaks mysteries.
1 Cor 14:3 But one who prophesies speaks to men for edification and exhortation and consolation.
1 Cor 14:4 One who speaks in a tongue edifies himself; but one who prophesies edifies the church.
1 Cor 14:5 Now I wish that you all spoke in tongues, but even more that you would prophesy; and greater is one who prophesies than one who speaks in tongues, unless he interprets, so that the church may receive edifying.

Rev 2:2; 'I know your deeds and your toil and perseverance, and that you cannot tolerate evil men, and you put to the test those who call themselves apostles, and they are not, and you found them to be false;

I wonder why the church would need to "test" them. If it was just the 14 or 15 named in the
Bible. Seems like they could just say you're not one of these guys.
 
B-A-C said:
Hmmm... I wonder if Barnabas did all of these things. Especially since Jesus was already ascended.

Acts 14:14; But when the apostles Barnabas and Paul heard of it, they tore their robes and rushed out into the crowd, crying out

Rom 16:7; Greet Andronicus and Junias, my kinsmen and my fellow prisoners, who are outstanding among the apostles, who also were in Christ before me.
Click to expand...

We don't know what Barnabas did prior to being with Paul. We don't know if Barnabas was part of the 120 of Acts 1. It does appear that every other apostle had fulfilled the some or all of the requirements I mentioned. BARNABAS PERFORMED miracles in the name of Jesus in Acts 14:3. Does that negate everything I've said?

The main reason why it's alluded to that Barnabas AS an Apostles is because Luke used the word, APOSTLES IN 14:4. The verse you quoted should have included verse 3 and verse 52 of the previous chapter 13 where the last verse calls Barnabas and Paul 'DISCIPLES.'

II Cor. 12:12 – Paul says that a “true” apostle (“The things that mark an apostle”) performed signs, wonders and miracles. Acts 14:3 indicates that not only Paul, but also Barnabas did these. I think this is key in understanding why Luke would consider and call Barnabas an “apostle” and give him equal footing with Paul. I believe that Luke ascribes to Barnabas, the same level of apostleship as Paul.

ONLY Paul and Barnabas are clearly and unequivocally called “apostles” by Scripture along with the 12. But I can also make the argument that Timothy, Salvanus, Andronicus and Junias are also called apostles.

2 Cor. 12:12....Truly the signs of an apostle were wrought among you in all patience, in signs, and wonders, and mighty deeds.

I know one thing. People who have called themselves prophets or apostles have literally embarrassed the church in our day. NOBODY today upholds the qualifications of a prophet or apostle.
 
B-A-C said:
1 Cor 14:1 Pursue love, yet desire earnestly spiritual gifts, but especially that you may prophesy.
1 Cor 14:2 For one who speaks in a tongue does not speak to men but to God; for no one understands, but in his spirit he speaks mysteries.
1 Cor 14:3 But one who prophesies speaks to men for edification and exhortation and consolation.
1 Cor 14:4 One who speaks in a tongue edifies himself; but one who prophesies edifies the church.
1 Cor 14:5 Now I wish that you all spoke in tongues, but even more that you would prophesy; and greater is one who prophesies than one who speaks in tongues, unless he interprets, so that the church may receive edifying.

Rev 2:2; 'I know your deeds and your toil and perseverance, and that you cannot tolerate evil men, and you put to the test those who call themselves apostles, and they are not, and you found them to be false;

I wonder why the church would need to "test" them. If it was just the 14 or 15 named in the
Bible. Seems like they could just say you're not one of these guys.
Click to expand...
Do I have to explain the difference between being a prophet and the gift of prophecy?
 
Christ4Ever said:
Keep the apostle Paul in mind and also Matthias who was selected to replace Judas who had killed himself (Matthew 27:5).
Now there is conjecture on why Matthias was selected at that particular time and not later, but the one thing we do know is that he was selected to replace Judas, to place their number from 11 to 12.

Sadly, now a days, I do believe you might be finding not just 12, but hundreds if not thousands professing to be apostles!!
Personally, I doubt they are, but in truth all that will come to light one day.
Which will be to the Glory of God or their shame/condemnation.

With the Love of Christ Jesus.
YBIC
Nick
<><
Click to expand...
I agree with you. People who are self-proclaimed prophets or apostles have done more to embarrass the church than help it. Today we are disciples and are able to prophesy which is all different than being an apostle or prophet.

There are churches who claim they are all apostles, and ministers who claim they are prophets! "The Apostolic Lighthouse" is one.
 
Act 13:1 Now there were in the church that was at Antioch certain prophets and teachers; as Barnabas, and Simeon that was called Niger, and Lucius of Cyrene, and Manaen, which had been brought up with Herod the tetrarch, and Saul.

If the ministry of the prophet had ended with the Apostles, someone for got to tell these people! Most of these were not Apostles.

Certainly the Old Testament Prophets, and New Testament Prophets had changed, because the Old Testament Prophet were used to lead the people of God. Not so in the New Testament as ALL Christians are lead by the Holy Spirit.
A modern day Prophet are anointed in the area of preaching, and teaching the Word of God. Preaching is done by inspiration of the Holy Spirit, and teaching is by expounding on what the Word of God says.
 
BLACKSHEEP said:
Do I have to explain the difference between being a prophet and the gift of prophecy?
Click to expand...

You might need to. Apparently Paul didn't know.

1 Cor 12:4; Now there are varieties of gifts, but the same Spirit.
1 Cor 12:5; And there are varieties of ministries, and the same Lord.
1 Cor 12:6; There are varieties of effects, but the same God who works all things in all persons.
1 Cor 12:7; But to each one is given the manifestation of the Spirit for the common good.
1 Cor 12:8; For to one is given the word of wisdom through the Spirit, and to another the word of knowledge according to the same Spirit;
1 Cor 12:9; to another faith by the same Spirit, and to another gifts of healing by the one Spirit,
1 Cor 12:10; and to another the effecting of miracles, and to another prophecy, and to another the distinguishing of spirits, to another various kinds of tongues, and to another the interpretation of tongues.

1 Cor 12:28; And God has appointed in the church, first apostles, second prophets, third teachers, then miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, administrations, various kinds of tongues.
1 Cor 12:29; All are not apostles, are they? All are not prophets, are they? All are not teachers, are they? All are not workers of miracles, are they?
1 Cor 12:30; All do not have gifts of healings, do they? All do not speak with tongues, do they? All do not interpret, do they?
 
"Prophecies" shall fail, at the same "knowledge" vanishes away. We still have knowledge today, and prophecies have not yet failed.

1Cor 13:8 Charity never faileth: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail; whether there be tongues, they shall cease; whether there be knowledge, it shall vanish away.
 
Curtis said:
Act 13:1 Now there were in the church that was at Antioch certain prophets and teachers; as Barnabas, and Simeon that was called Niger, and Lucius of Cyrene, and Manaen, which had been brought up with Herod the tetrarch, and Saul.

If the ministry of the prophet had ended with the Apostles, someone for got to tell these people! Most of these were not Apostles.

Certainly the Old Testament Prophets, and New Testament Prophets had changed, because the Old Testament Prophet were used to lead the people of God. Not so in the New Testament as ALL Christians are lead by the Holy Spirit.
A modern day Prophet are anointed in the area of preaching, and teaching the Word of God. Preaching is done by inspiration of the Holy Spirit, and teaching is by expounding on what the Word of God says.
Click to expand...
Have you ever read the Didache? Probably not.

Maybe you can tell me who the prophets are today. Self proclaimed prophets who you say are anointed follow their own spirit. So I ask, "who do you say is a prophet today?" One that's alive or recently passed.
Harold Camping? Yahweh ben Yahweh, Samuel Shaffer, Chuck Pierce, Kim Clement, Rick Joyner, Bob Jones, Peter Wagner, John Paul Jackson, Paul Keith Davis, Paul Cain, L. Ron Hubbard, Father Divine, Jim Jones, David Koresh, Jose Luis de Jesus Miranda, Marshall Applewhite...
Name someone you know who's a prophet today!

"Thus saith the Lord God; Woe unto the foolish prophets, that follow their own spirit, and have seen nothing!" Ezekiel 13:3
 
B-A-C said:
You might need to. Apparently Paul didn't know.

1 Cor 12:4; Now there are varieties of gifts, but the same Spirit.
1 Cor 12:5; And there are varieties of ministries, and the same Lord.
1 Cor 12:6; There are varieties of effects, but the same God who works all things in all persons.
1 Cor 12:7; But to each one is given the manifestation of the Spirit for the common good.
1 Cor 12:8; For to one is given the word of wisdom through the Spirit, and to another the word of knowledge according to the same Spirit;
1 Cor 12:9; to another faith by the same Spirit, and to another gifts of healing by the one Spirit,
1 Cor 12:10; and to another the effecting of miracles, and to another prophecy, and to another the distinguishing of spirits, to another various kinds of tongues, and to another the interpretation of tongues.

1 Cor 12:28; And God has appointed in the church, first apostles, second prophets, third teachers, then miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, administrations, various kinds of tongues.
1 Cor 12:29; All are not apostles, are they? All are not prophets, are they? All are not teachers, are they? All are not workers of miracles, are they?
1 Cor 12:30; All do not have gifts of healings, do they? All do not speak with tongues, do they? All do not interpret, do they?
Click to expand...
Brilliant reply that proves absolutely nothing about the difference between a prophet and prophecy!

This kind of reply proves that you put zero effort in your replies and just post a bunch of scripture with zero response that doesn't support one word you say.
 
Curtis said:
Act 13:1 Now there were in the church that was at Antioch certain prophets and teachers; as Barnabas, and Simeon that was called Niger, and Lucius of Cyrene, and Manaen, which had been brought up with Herod the tetrarch, and Saul.

If the ministry of the prophet had ended with the Apostles, someone for got to tell these people! Most of these were not Apostles.

Certainly the Old Testament Prophets, and New Testament Prophets had changed, because the Old Testament Prophet were used to lead the people of God. Not so in the New Testament as ALL Christians are lead by the Holy Spirit.
A modern day Prophet are anointed in the area of preaching, and teaching the Word of God. Preaching is done by inspiration of the Holy Spirit, and teaching is by expounding on what the Word of God says.
Click to expand...
You don't understand that the apostles and prophets only continued for a short after AD100. The office of prophet and apostle in the emerging church became obsolete. I'm not talking about the apostles and prophets we know in the Old and New Testament. I'm talking people who held the office of prophet and apostle into the beginning part of the second century. You wouldn't know that because you've likely never read the Didache or put any amount of study into this topic. Most of you just fire from the hip and come across with a bit of sarcasm.

Have you even googled, "are there prophets and apostles today?" Nearly every page will tell you NO there are none. Pentecostal's may claim there are apostles and prophets today, but most people who have studied this know there are NOT!
 
BLACKSHEEP said:
Have you ever read the Didache? Probably not.

Maybe you can tell me who the prophets are today. Self proclaimed prophets who you say are anointed follow their own spirit. So I ask, "who do you say is a prophet today?" One that's alive or recently passed.
Harold Camping? Yahweh ben Yahweh, Samuel Shaffer, Chuck Pierce, Kim Clement, Rick Joyner, Bob Jones, Peter Wagner, John Paul Jackson, Paul Keith Davis, Paul Cain, L. Ron Hubbard, Father Divine, Jim Jones, David Koresh, Jose Luis de Jesus Miranda, Marshall Applewhite...
Name someone you know who's a prophet today!

"Thus saith the Lord God; Woe unto the foolish prophets, that follow their own spirit, and have seen nothing!" Ezekiel 13:3
Click to expand...

1Th 5:20 Despise not prophesyings.
1Th 5:21 Prove all things; hold fast that which is good.

1Jn 4:1 Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.

Eph 4:11 And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
Eph 4:12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:
Eph 4:13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:


The "five fold" ministry gifts will never pass away "Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man,"


Kenneth E Hagin was a modern day Prophet, but he passed away a few years ago. I really do not care what you think as my faith has nothing to do with what you believe!
 
So let me ask every one of you again.

"Name someone you know who's a prophet today!" "Who do you say upholds the office of prophet and apostle today?"
 
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