Can You Loose Your Salvation?

[Born Again 2004]

We are saved by the empowering PRESENCE of God. but you still can throw it away.

Hmm!, I see where God said in the scriptures that we are saved by Grace ( a gift). Can you show me where it says it is by his empowering PRESENCE and not a gift?

 

[B-A-C]

No! A person who thinks they have a right /license to sin is no Christian at all. To be remorseful and ever wanting to abide in Christ and having the understanding that we are forgiven despite our inequities, now that is a Christian! Romans 8:1

But grace alone theology is exactly a right and license to sin. If I need nothing but grace, I can sin all I want to.
Romans 8:1 .. agreat verse... I notice it ends with .. "those who are in Christ".

How do we know if we are in Christ?

1 Jn 3:24; The one who keeps His commandments abides in Him, and Christ in him. We know by this that He abides in us, by the Spirit whom He has given us.

 

[Sue J Love]

But grace alone theology is exactly a right and license to sin. If I need nothing but grace, I can sin all I want to.
Romans 8:1 .. agreat verse... I notice it ends with .. "those who are in Christ".

How do we know if we are in Christ?

1 Jn 3:24; The one who keeps His commandments abides in Him, and Christ in him. We know by this that He abides in us, by the Spirit whom He has given us.

Therefore there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus. 2 For the law of the Spirit of life [a]in Christ Jesus has set you free from the law of sin and of death. 3 For what the Law could not do, weak as it was through the flesh, God did: sending His own Son in the likeness of [c]sinful flesh and as an offering for sin, He condemned sin in the flesh, 4 so that the requirement of the Law might be fulfilled in us, who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit. 5 For those who are according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who are according to the Spirit, the things of the Spirit. 6 For the mind set on the flesh is death, but the mind set on the Spirit is life and peace, 7 because the mind set on the flesh is hostile toward God; for it does not subject itself to the law of God, for it is not even able to do so, 8 and those who are in the flesh cannot please God.

 

[Born Again 2004]

But grace alone theology is exactly a right and license to sin. If I need nothing but grace, I can sin all I want to.
Romans 8:1 .. agreat verse... I notice it ends with .. "those who are in Christ".

• But grace alone theology is exactly a right and license to sin. Maybe for you but not for me! Physically, man says license to sin, spiritually God says a true Christian does not deliberately sin. Hebrews 10:26 If we deliberately keep on sinning after we have received the knowledge of the truth, no sacrifice for sins is left. Personally, I don't deliberately sin but I know when I do that Romans 8:1 applies.
  

How do we know if we are in Christ?

If he is in you,then,you are in him. John 14:20 On that day you will realize that I am in my Father, and you are in me, and I am in you. If you have to ask, maybe he is not in you.

1 Jn 3:24; The one who keeps His commandments abides in Him, and Christ in him. We know by this that He abides in us, by the Spirit whom He has given us.

Do you keep his commandments ( all of them) perfectly with out fail? What do you do when you mess up on one?

 

[Sue J Love]

If he is in you,then,you are in him. John 14:20 On that day you will realize that I am in my Father, and you are in me, and I am in you. If you have to ask, maybe he is not in you.

In context, John 14:21-24: He who has My commandments and keeps them is the one who loves Me; and he who loves Me will be loved by My Father, and I will love him and willdisclose Myself to him.” 22 Judas (not Iscariot) *said to Him, “Lord, what then has happened that You are going to disclose Yourself to us and not to the world?” 23 Jesus answered and said to him, “If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word; and My Father will love him, and We will come to him and make Our abode with him. 24 He who does not love Me does not keep My words; and the word which you hear is not Mine, but the Father’s who sent Me.

 

[Born Again 2004]

In context, John 14:21-24: He who has My commandments and keeps them is the one who loves Me; and he who loves Me will be loved by My Father, and I will love him and willdisclose Myself to him.” 22 Judas (not Iscariot) *said to Him, “Lord, what then has happened that You are going to disclose Yourself to us and not to the world?” 23 Jesus answered and said to him, “If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word; and My Father will love him, and We will come to him and make Our abode with him. 24 He who does not love Me does not keep My words; and the word which you hear is not Mine, but the Father’s who sent Me.

24 He who does not love Me does not keep My words; and the word which you hear is not Mine, but the Father’s who sent Me.[/QUOTE] I will take this one verse and try to explain myself.
Are you perfect? Do you think God means for you to keep his word perfectly 24/7 ? Are you with out sin? When you do sin, are you not still loving Jesus and thankful for what he did for you?. The law proved we are not perfect and need for a Savior. James 2:10 For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles at just one point is guilty of breaking all of it. The law fails us, our perfection fails us...thank God for his grace and free gift in Jesus Christ!

 

[Born Again 2004]

Everyone would agree that St. Paul was a Christian. Nevertheless, he struggled with the perfection that he was called to be....He did what he didn't want to do and he didn't do what he wanted to do (Romans 7). What was the outcome of his this struggle? He loved Jesus Christ and realized that he alone ( by God's Grace) managed the imbalance for him and he wrote Romans 8:1

 

[Bendito]

Hmm!, I see where God said in the scriptures that we are saved by Grace ( a gift). Can you show me where it says it is by his empowering PRESENCE and not a gift?

The best definition of Grace I have ever found is "The empowering PRESENCE of God which empowers us to do what He has for us to do."

 

[Sue J Love]

24 He who does not love Me does not keep My words; and the word which you hear is not Mine, but the Father’s who sent Me.

I will take this one verse and try to explain myself.
Are you perfect? Do you think God means for you to keep his word perfectly 24/7 ? Are you with out sin? When you do sin, are you not still loving Jesus and thankful for what he did for you?. The law proved we are not perfect and need for a Savior. James 2:10 For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles at just one point is guilty of breaking all of it. The law fails us, our perfection fails us...thank God for his grace and free gift in Jesus Christ![/QUOTE]

Romans 8:1-8: There is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus. 2 For the law of the Spirit of life has set you free in Christ Jesus from the law of sin and death. 3 For God has done what the law, weakened by the flesh, could not do. By sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh and for sin, he condemned sin in the flesh, 4 in order that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not according to the flesh but according to the Spirit. 5 For those who live according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who live according to the Spirit set their minds on the things of the Spirit. 6 For to set the mind on the flesh is death, but to set the mind on the Spirit is life and peace. 7 For the mind that is set on the flesh is hostile to God, for it does not submit to God's law; indeed, it cannot. 8 Those who are in the flesh cannot please God.

Romans 8:12-14: So then, brothers, we are debtors, not to the flesh, to live according to the flesh. 13 For if you live according to the flesh you will die, but if by the Spirit you put to death the deeds of the body, you will live. 14 For all who are led by the Spirit of God are sons of God.

Luke 9:23-25: And he said to all, “If anyone would come after me, let him deny himself and take up his cross daily and follow me. 24 For whoever would save his life will lose it, but whoever loses his life for my sake will save it. 25 For what does it profit a man if he gains the whole world and loses or forfeits himself?

1 John 1:5-9: This is the message we have heard from him and proclaim to you, that God is light, and in him is no darkness at all. 6 If we say we have fellowship with him while we walk in darkness, we lie and do not practice the truth. 7 But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus his Son cleanses us from all sin. 8 If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. 9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

All throughout the New Testament it teaches us that it is what we practice, i.e. it is our walks of faith which determine whether or not our faith in Jesus Christ is genuine, and it also teaches that if our walks (our lifestyles) are that we practice sinning against God, we don't know God, we don't love him, we are not in fellowship with him, and we don't have eternal life with him. Jesus died on a cross for our sins because no one can keep the law perfectly. So, it isn't that God demands perfection, but our lifestyles must reflect Christ and that we are living and conducting our lives according to the Spirit and no longer according to the flesh. Yes, we will sin, at times, but sin should no longer be our master. We should not be ruled by it. We should not make it our daily practice, but by the Spirit we should be putting to death the deeds of the flesh, and we should daily be taking up our cross and following Christ. Do we lose our salvation if we sin? No! But, there are many warnings to Christians in the NT that if they fall away, and they turn away from God, that they will face the wrath of God. We can't ignore these stern warnings. And, there are many of them.

Everyone would agree that St. Paul was a Christian. Nevertheless, he struggled with the perfection that he was called to be....He did what he didn't want to do and he didn't do what he wanted to do (Romans 7). What was the outcome of his this struggle? He loved Jesus Christ and realized that he alone ( by God's Grace) managed the imbalance for him and he wrote Romans 8:1

He wrote the whole chapter of Romans 8 in which he says that the righteous requirement of the law is fulfilled in us who walk, not according to the flesh, but according to the Spirit. He said that if we walk according to the flesh (in darkness), we will die in our sins, not live with Christ for eternity. So many people take Romans 7 out of context and use it as an excuse for continued sin against God, but it must be read in the context of Romans 6 and Romans 8 which teach death to sin and living to righteousness and walking according to the Spirit and no longer according to the flesh. In Romans 7 Paul described his life in the flesh, when the flesh had mastery over him, but at the end of chapter 7 and in Romans 8 he tells of how Jesus set him free, and then he went on to teach that if we walk according to the flesh we will die in our sins. Also, Paul was one who would tell people to emulate him, and that he wished they would be like him, other than his chains. He could not say that, and he could not teach what he did in Romans 6 & 8 if he was regularly giving in to the flesh and being controlled by it, as he described in chapter 7.

You might also want to look up these verses, which I call the "If" verses which basically teach that "if" we do such and such we have eternal life, but if we don't, then we don't. John 8:31-32; Romans 11:17-24; I Co 15:2; Col 1:21-23; II Tim 2:10-13; Hebrews 3:6, 14-15; 2 Pet. 1:5-11; I John 2:24-25.

You might also want to look at these verses which teach that we are saved (past), we are being saved (present) and that we will be saved (future) when Jesus Christ returns. Ro. 8:24; 13:11; 1 Co. 1:18; 15:1-2; 2 Co. 2:15; Eph. 2:5; 2 Tim. 1:8-9; Heb. 5:9; 9:28; 1 Pet. 1:5, 8-9.

Also, the Greek language has a tense that we don't normally use in the English language but which denotes something that is actively happening. For example, in John 3:16, it should be read whoever believing in him, meaning that eternal life is conditional to active belief, and that belief is described for us all throughout the NT as walking (in lifestyle, conducting our lives) according to the Spirit and no longer according to the flesh. So, one cannot have the hope of eternal life on the basis of a past confession of Christ as Savior if he or she is not actively believing, which is evidenced by a walk of faith, not a mere confession of faith.

We have to be so careful here that we don't pull scriptures out of context and build entire doctrines around them while ignoring the bulk of scriptures on the same subject, like we can't read Romans 8:1 and stop there, but we have to read at least until verse 17, for it covers the same topic. And, the same goes for Romans 10:9-10. We can't isolate these two verses from the whole of Romans and build our doctrine of salvation around those few verses. We must read scriptures in the context in which they were written and accept the whole of the message and not just the parts that fit with our theology.

But, it is only by God's grace and in his power and strength within us that any of us can walk according to the Spirit and not according to the flesh, and only as we yield control of lives over to him and submit to his will and do what he says, in his power.

 

[Dave M]

John 10:28
I give them eternal life, and they will never perish, and no one will snatch them out of my hand.

Jonh 10-28 to me clearly says he gives us eternal life now here, so if it its eternal it something that can not be lost otherwise it would not be eternal

Romans 11:29
For the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable.

Romans 11-29 to me clearly says once God gives us grace its a done deal, he will not take it back.


1 John 3:6-9
No one who abides in him keeps on sinning; no one who keeps on sinning has either seen him or known him

He also changes us on the inside so we will not go back to our old ways and if we do go back to are old ways I would suggest that we were never saved int the first place making the argument of loosing salvation null and void to me.


1 John 2:3-4
And by this we know that we have come to know him, if we keep his commandments. Whoever says “I know him” but does not keep his commandments is a liar, and the truth is not in him,

seems we can look for certain aspect of the way we live, to tell if we are saved perhaps. but I think you have to look at yourself to see and be honest with yourself. Once I stopped trying to figure out if other people are saved I found myself in a better place

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Lastly I say with all humbleness I do not know all the answeres and no one does except our heavenly father, I do know I could also make a argument for loosing salvation . Are you humble enough to admit you do not know everything? Because the bible speaks of being humble as a key ingredient to being saved !!

James 4:6
But he gives more grace. Therefore it says, “God opposes the proud, but gives grace to the humble.

James 4:10
Humble yourselves before the Lord, and he will exalt you.

Proverbs 16:18-19
Pride goes before destruction, and a haughty spirit before a fall. It is better to be of a lowly spirit with the poor than to divide the spoil with the proud.

2 Chronicles 7:14
If my people who are called by my name humble themselves, and pray and seek my face and turn from their wicked ways, then I will hear from heaven and will forgive their sin and heal their land.


Seems being humble is the foundation of receiving the Grace !!

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I would like to add that I have seen this argument of osas for a while, I hope at the very least it makes people go after the truth for themselves and dig into the bible with passion to seek the truth, and put your pride behind yourself and do not worry about being right or wrong only worry about finding the truth. If you believe salvation can be lost and it helps you be more obedient to Chirst I say good, if you believe salvation can not be lost and helps you grow in your faith I say good. I do not see how anyone can come to a 100% positive answer one way or another on the subject. as it is very easy to make a case for both sides. I know what I believe is to be true but I try to respect what other think even if I tend not to agree with everything they say.

Matthew 6:33
But seek first the kingdom of God and his righteousness, and all these things will be added to you

 

[Sue J Love]

I would like to add that I have seen this argument of osas for a while, I hope at the very least it makes people go after the truth for themselves and dig into the bible with passion to seek the truth, and put your pride behind yourself and do not worry about being right or wrong only worry about finding the truth.

I would ditto that, Dave! I would also suggest we read the Bible book by book and chapter by chapter and read all the verses which support a particular theology in context, comparing scripture with scripture, and to do so openly and honestly before God, being willing to change what we believe if God should show us something different. When we read verses in context, it broadens their meaning, such as this one you quoted:

I give them eternal life, and they will never perish, and no one will snatch them out of my hand.

In context it reads: "My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me; and I give eternal life to them, and they will never perish; and no one will snatch them out of My hand. My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father’s hand."

Notice with me the description of those to whom he gives eternal life. They are those who listen to his voice, who he knows, and they follow (obey) him, and they will never perish, but will have eternal life. This also fits with what Paul said in Romans 8, where he says that the righteous requirement of the law is fulfilled in us who walk, not according to the flesh, but according to the Spirit, for if we walk according to the flesh, we will die in our sins, but if by the Spirit we are putting to death the deeds of the flesh, we will live with Christ for eternity. John said something similar in 1 John 1, as did Jesus in Luke 9:23-25, etc. There is a continuous teaching in the New Testament that our eternal life with God is dependent on our walks of faith, not just on our confessions of faith.

 

[Born Again 2004]

people take Romans 7 out of context and use it as an excuse for continued sin against God,

Why do some people always take this type of conversation and use it to prove that others , like me, are saying that we ( a common term) have a "license To Sin".Nothing can be further from the truth! I am either very inept at explaining the truth or, you really do not understand it!

In Romans 7 Paul described his life in the flesh, when the flesh had mastery over him, but at the end of chapter 7 and in Romans 8 he tells of how Jesus set him free,

Yes, Jesus ( given to us by God's Grace) is alone responsible for our salvation. This contract DOES not require our perfection but it DEMANDS our obedience in striving for perfection, which is proof of our salvation. If we were capable for perfection we could have obeyed the law perfectly and there would have been no need for Jesus!

• Sue, I asked you a question but you have thus avoided it, do you sin? That means do you sin or, are you perfect with out sin?
• When you become a true Christian, God lives in you. Have you not read the mystery that the Bible talks about? Colossians 1: 26-27 , the mystery which has been hidden from ages and from generations, but now has been revealed to His saints. 27 To them God willed to make known what are the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles: which is Christ in you, the hope of glory.
• Being a slave to his flesh, Paul , in no way became perfect and, neither did you are I. What we should understand is that as a Christian and God in us, there is no condemnation.....condemnation from what? Condemnation from sin!!! With God in you you are saved from the consequences of sin which is spiritual death. As long as you live in this physical world, you are human and you will sin. The bigger issue is when you leave this physical realm and enter God's spiritual realm, do you have God in you or not!

 

[KingJ]

Making some good points there Born again 2004. We all sin, only God is perfect.

I do believe in OSAS. I believe many just don't grasp the respectful to all style of preaching / speaking by God, Paul and the other NT writers on this subject. God would never isolate person x and y from the congregation and say they are not saved. Every instance of scripture suggesting we can lose our salvation needs to be read in this light. God does not make mistakes. He does not wash someone and graft him in by mistake when He says what He does in Jer 17:9-12. We make the mistakes. Not God.

I would love to know from anti OSAS believers how they explain the thief next to Jesus on the cross. We who endure more for God stand a risk of going to hell? If that was true we should all desire to be martyrs asap.

 

[Dave M]

Making some good points there Born again 2004. We all sin, only God is perfect.

I do believe in OSAS. I believe many just don't grasp the respectful to all style of preaching / speaking by God, Paul and the other NT writers on this subject. God would never isolate person x and y from the congregation and say they are not saved. Every instance of scripture suggesting we can lose our salvation needs to be read in this light. God does not make mistakes. He does not wash someone and graft him in by mistake when He says what He does in Jer 17:9-12. We make the mistakes. Not God.

I would love to know from anti OSAS believers how they explain the thief next to Jesus on the cross. We who endure more for God stand a risk of going to hell? If that was true we should all desire to be martyrs asap.

another one is Lot abrhams nephew a carnal christian but a saved one

 

[Sue J Love]

Why do some people always take this type of conversation and use it to prove that others , like me, are saying that we ( a common term) have a "license To Sin".Nothing can be further from the truth! I am either very inept at explaining the truth or, you really do not understand it!
Yes, Jesus ( given to us by God's Grace) is alone responsible for our salvation. This contract DOES not require our perfection but it DEMANDS our obedience in striving for perfection, which is proof of our salvation. If we were capable for perfection we could have obeyed the law perfectly and there would have been no need for Jesus!

• Sue, I asked you a question but you have thus avoided it, do you sin? That means do you sin or, are you perfect with out sin?
• When you become a true Christian, God lives in you. Have you not read the mystery that the Bible talks about? Colossians 1: 26-27 , the mystery which has been hidden from ages and from generations, but now has been revealed to His saints. 27 To them God willed to make known what are the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles: which is Christ in you, the hope of glory.
• Being a slave to his flesh, Paul , in no way became perfect and, neither did you are I. What we should understand is that as a Christian and God in us, there is no condemnation.....condemnation from what? Condemnation from sin!!! With God in you you are saved from the consequences of sin which is spiritual death. As long as you live in this physical world, you are human and you will sin. The bigger issue is when you leave this physical realm and enter God's spiritual realm, do you have God in you or not!

Born Again - But, I did answer your questions. This is what I said:

All throughout the New Testament it teaches us that it is what we practice, i.e. it is our walks of faith which determine whether or not our faith in Jesus Christ is genuine, and it also teaches that if our walks (our lifestyles) are that we practice sinning against God, we don't know God, we don't love him, we are not in fellowship with him, and we don't have eternal life with him. Jesus died on a cross for our sins because no one can keep the law perfectly. So, it isn't that God demands perfection, but our lifestyles must reflect Christ and that we are living and conducting our lives according to the Spirit and no longer according to the flesh. Yes, we will sin, at times, but sin should no longer be our master. We should not be ruled by it. We should not make it our daily practice, but by the Spirit we should be putting to death the deeds of the flesh, and we should daily be taking up our cross and following Christ. Do we lose our salvation if we sin? No! But, there are many warnings to Christians in the NT that if they fall away, and they turn away from God, that they will face the wrath of God. We can't ignore these stern warnings. And, there are many of them.

For the record, I believe in the eternal security of the believer in Jesus Christ, i.e. the one believing (present tense) in him, but belief as defined by Jesus and by his NT apostles, which includes repentance and walks of obedience, not sinless perfection, but a consistent walk of faith in Christ in which we daily, or regularly and consistently, by the Spirit, are putting sin to death, as we cooperate fully with God's work of grace in our lives.

The problem with OSAS is that its adherents largely (mostly, i.e. a large majority of them) get the idea that they can pray some prayer to receive Christ, at one point in their lives, and that how they live their lives doesn't matter from that point forward. Many preachers are boldly preaching that we don't have to repent and that obedience is not required by God, and some even go so far as to tell people that they can now commit all the sins they want and still have their ticket into heaven. God says differently. He says if we walk in sin, in darkness, according to the flesh, that we will die in our sins, and that if we make sin our practice, we don't have eternal life. And, he says this to those who profess him as Savior of their lives, and as a warning. In fact, he used the children of Israel as an example to us, who profess Christ, so that we should not follow their example and fail to enter into our promised land due to unbelief and disobedience, because of hardened hearts.

So, on one side of the coin you have those who believe you can pray a sinner's prayer and "bam" you are in, eternal life guaranteed, no matter what you do from that point forward. This is not what scriptures teach. Then, on the other side of the pendulum are those who believe you lose your salvation every time you sin, and that if you don't confess every sin before you die, that you lose your salvation. Wrong! This is also not biblical. The truth is to be found somewhere in between these two extremes, and a careful study of scripture will lead to the truth. Yes, we are saved by grace, but through faith, which we must exercise, or it is not faith at all. James made that clear when he said that even the demons believe, and they shudder. The sad reality is that too many humans don't even shudder, i.e. they have not the fear of God, and therefore many of them have become callous to God's/Christ's instructions to us and to his warnings. The warnings are there for a reason, and it would behoove us to find out what they are all about, for our eternity could very well depend on it.

 

[Born Again 2004]

Making some good points there Born again 2004. We all sin, only God is perfect.

I do believe in OSAS. I believe many just don't grasp the respectful to all style of preaching / speaking by God, Paul and the other NT writers on this subject. God would never isolate person x and y from the congregation and say they are not saved. Every instance of scripture suggesting we can lose our salvation needs to be read in this light. God does not make mistakes. He does not wash someone and graft him in by mistake when He says what He does in Jer 17:9-12. We make the mistakes. Not God.

I would love to know from anti OSAS believers how they explain the thief next to Jesus on the cross. We who endure more for God stand a risk of going to hell? If that was true we should all desire to be martyrs asap.

I do get tired of constantly being falsely put into the box ,that we have a license to sin!...I detest that and sin in my life. I am not so naive to say that I am sinless but with a repentant heart, I know I am forgiven when I do! One of the issues with putting me and others in this box, it doesn't exclude the horrible sins of our society, which is abhorring but never the less,it also lumps us into those categories as well....that is so insulting! It should go with out saying that sin is sin to God but the one he can not forgive is denying Jesus and blasphemy of the Holy Spirit!

 

[Sue J Love]

I do believe in OSAS. I believe many just don't grasp the respectful to all style of preaching / speaking by God, Paul and the other NT writers on this subject. God would never isolate person x and y from the congregation and say they are not saved. Every instance of scripture suggesting we can lose our salvation needs to be read in this light. God does not make mistakes. He does not wash someone and graft him in by mistake when He says what He does in Jer 17:9-12. We make the mistakes. Not God.

But if some of the branches were broken off, and you, being a wild olive, were grafted in among them and became partaker with them of the rich root of the olive tree, 18 do not be arrogant toward the branches; but if you are arrogant, remember that it is not you who supports the root, but the root supports you. 19 You will say then, “Branches were broken off so that I might be grafted in.” 20 Quite right, they were broken off for their unbelief, but you stand by your faith. Do not be conceited, but fear; 21 for if God did not spare the natural branches, He will not spare you, either. 22 Behold then the kindness and severity of God; to those who fell, severity, but to you, God’s kindness, if you continue in His kindness; otherwise you also will be cut off. 23 And they also, if they do not continue in their unbelief, will be grafted in, for God is able to graft them in again. Romans 11:17-23

 

[B-A-C]

This is a rather lengthy passage, but it's called "the Assurance of Faith". How can we be assured of Salvation? We can be, but there are conditions.

Heb 10:19; Therefore, brethren, since we have confidence to enter the holy place by the blood of Jesus,
Heb 10:20; by a new and living way which He inaugurated for us through the veil, that is, His flesh,
Heb 10:21; and since we have a great priest over the house of God,
Heb 10:22; let us draw near with a sincere heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled clean from an evil conscience and our bodies washed with pure water.
Heb 10:23; Let us hold fast the confession of our hope without wavering, for He who promised is faithful;
Heb 10:24; and let us consider how to stimulate one another to love and good deeds,
Heb 10:25; not forsaking our own assembling together, as is the habit of some, but encouraging one another; and all the more as you see the day drawing near.
Heb 10:26; For if we go on sinning willfully after receiving the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins,
Heb 10:27; but a terrifying expectation of judgment and THE FURY OF A FIRE WHICH WILL CONSUME THE ADVERSARIES.
Heb 10:28; Anyone who has set aside the Law of Moses dies without mercy on the testimony of two or three witnesses.
Heb 10:29; How much severer punishment do you think he will deserve who has trampled under foot the Son of God, and has regarded as unclean the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified, and has insulted the Spirit of grace?
Heb 10:30; For we know Him who said, "VENGEANCE IS MINE, I WILL REPAY." And again, "THE LORD WILL JUDGE HIS PEOPLE."
Heb 10:31; It is a terrifying thing to fall into the hands of the living God.
Heb 10:32; But remember the former days, when, after being enlightened, you endured a great conflict of sufferings,
Heb 10:33; partly by being made a public spectacle through reproaches and tribulations, and partly by becoming sharers with those who were so treated.
Heb 10:34; For you showed sympathy to the prisoners and accepted joyfully the seizure of your property, knowing that you have for yourselves a better possession and a lasting one.
Heb 10:35; Therefore, do not throw away your confidence, which has a great reward.
Heb 10:36; For you have need of endurance, so that when you have done the will of God, you may receive what was promised.
Heb 10:37; FOR YET IN A VERY LITTLE WHILE, HE WHO IS COMING WILL COME, AND WILL NOT DELAY.
Heb 10:38; BUT MY RIGHTEOUS ONE SHALL LIVE BY FAITH; AND IF HE SHRINKS BACK, MY SOUL HAS NO PLEASURE IN HIM.
Heb 10:39; But we are not of those who shrink back to destruction, but of those who have faith to the preserving of the soul.

 

[Born Again 2004]

You might also want to look at these verses which teach that we are saved (past), we are being saved (present) and that we will be saved (future) when Jesus Christ returns. Ro. 8:24; 13:11; 1 Co. 1:18; 15:1-2; 2 Co. 2:15; Eph. 2:5; 2 Tim. 1:8-9; Heb. 5:9; 9:28; 1 Pet. 1:5, 8-9.

I have never said you are not saved. In all of my discussions at TJ on OSAS, I have never once said that a anti- OSAS person is not saved. That is for God to determine, not me. But, I look at these verses and I don't see what you see, they no way support your theology!
You live in the physical world but when you die you enter the spiritual realm. Before you die ( the physical world) has Jesus returned? No! When you die you enter God's spiritual realm. After you die, does Jesus return? You better believe it!

 

[Born Again 2004]

This is a rather lengthy passage, but it's called "the Assurance of Faith". How can we be assured of Salvation? We can be, but there are conditions.

Conditions went away when the law was superseded by Grace!