Did you receive the gift of the Holy Spirit by works, or by faith?

[God's Truth]

Straw man= false accusation

Believing in (Faith in) Jesus Christ does not = disobedience

John 6:28-29​

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King James Version​

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28 Then said they unto him, What shall we do, that we might work the works of God?
29 Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.”

Doi it isn't a strawman, unless you live on an island and are mentally disabled.

 

[God's Truth]

As I told you before, faith without works is dead. There are many false doctrines and beliefs out there, including those who think they can earn the grace of God, and the gifts of the Holy Spirit based on their own works.

Then do the right thing and preach people to repent of their sins to get saved.

You are no Noah and no John the baptizer.

 

[StewardoftheMystery]

Then do the right thing and preach people to repent of their sins to get saved.

You are no Noah and no John the baptizer.

Believing in Jesus Christ is also believing in the words of God which Jesus spoke; including the message of repenting of sins.

Faith does not = disobeying the words of God.

 

[Waggles]

2 This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?

And how do we know that we have received the indwelling Holy Spirit according to scripture??

 

[Waggles]

Faith in God is obedience…

Nonsense
there must be at least 10,000 variations to what faith in God is.

 

[God's Truth]

Believing in Jesus Christ is also believing in the words of God which Jesus spoke; including the message of repenting of sins.

Faith does not = disobeying the words of God.

You can't say it?

Preach what Jesus preached.

Repent or perish!

 

[StewardoftheMystery]

And how do we know that we have received the indwelling Holy Spirit according to scripture??

John 7:38
He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of livingwater.

 

[StewardoftheMystery]

Nonsense
there must be at least 10,000 variations to what faith in God is.

John 12:44
Jesus cried and said, He that believeth on me, believeth not on me, but on him that sent me.

 

[StewardoftheMystery]

Preach what Jesus preached.

John 5:24
Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.

 

[God's Truth]

John 5:24
Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.

Jesus said that to those who repented of their sins.

 

[God's Truth]

No one receives the Holy Spirit without obeying Jesus who says to do more than believe in him.

We have to believe that Jesus is the one we have to obey.

Faith alone is dead and cannot save anyone.

 

[StewardoftheMystery]

Jesus said that to those who repented of their sins.

Galatians 3:2-5

King James Version

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2 This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?
3 Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?
4 Have ye suffered so many things in vain? if it be yet in vain.
5 He therefore that ministereth to you the Spirit, and worketh miracles among you, doeth he it by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?

Matthew 9:2
And, behold, they brought to him a man sick of the palsy, lying on a bed: and Jesus seeing their faith said unto the sick of the palsy; Son, be of good cheer; thy sins be forgiven thee.

Matthew 9:22
But Jesus turned him about, and when he saw her, he said, Daughter, be of good comfort; thy faith hath made thee whole. And the woman was made whole from that hour.

Matthew 9:29
Then touched he their eyes, saying, According to your faith be it unto you.

Matthew 15:28
Then Jesus answered and said unto her, O woman, great is thy faith: be it unto thee even as thou wilt. And her daughter was made whole from that very hour.

Mark 2:5
When Jesus saw their faith, he said unto the sick of the palsy, Son, thy sins be forgiven thee.

Mark 5:34
And he said unto her, Daughter, thy faith hath made thee whole; go in peace, and be whole of thy plague.

Mark 10:52
And Jesus said unto him, Go thy way; thy faithhath made thee whole. And immediately he received his sight, and followed Jesus in the way.

Luke 5:20
And when he saw their faith, he said unto him, Man, thy sins are forgiven thee.

Luke 7:50
And he said to the woman, Thy faith hath saved thee; go in peace.

Luke 8:48
And he said unto her, Daughter, be of good comfort: thy faith hath made thee whole; go in peace.

Luke 17:19
And he said unto him, Arise, go thy way: thy faith hath made thee whole.

Luke 18:42
And Jesus said unto him, Receive thy sight: thy faith hath saved thee.

Mark 11:22
And Jesus answering saith unto them, Have faith in God.

Luke 18:8
….. Nevertheless when the Son of man cometh, shall he find faith on the earth?

 

[God's Truth]

Galatians 3:2-5​

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King James Version​

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2 This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?
3 Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh?
4 Have ye suffered so many things in vain? if it be yet in vain.
5 He therefore that ministereth to you the Spirit, and worketh miracles among you, doeth he it by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?

They were saved by obeying Jesus and repenting of their sins and not by getting circumcised and doing the other purification works of the law.

Matthew 9:2
And, behold, they brought to him a man sick of the palsy, lying on a bed: and Jesus seeing their faith said unto the sick of the palsy; Son, be of good cheer; thy sins be forgiven thee.
Matthew 9:22But Jesus turned him about, and when he saw her, he said, Daughter, be of good comfort; thy faith hath made thee whole. And the woman was made whole from that hour.

Matthew 9:29
Then touched he their eyes, saying, According to your faith be it unto you.

Matthew 15:28
Then Jesus answered and said unto her, O woman, great is thy faith: be it unto thee even as thou wilt. And her daughter was made whole from that very hour.

Mark 2:5
When Jesus saw their faith, he said unto the sick of the palsy, Son, thy sins be forgiven thee.

Mark 5:34
And he said unto her, Daughter, thy faith hath made thee whole; go in peace, and be whole of thy plague.

Mark 10:52
And Jesus said unto him, Go thy way; thy faithhath made thee whole. And immediately he received his sight, and followed Jesus in the way.

Luke 5:20
And when he saw their faith, he said unto him, Man, thy sins are forgiven thee.

Luke 7:50
And he said to the woman, Thy faith hath saved thee; go in peace.

Luke 8:48
And he said unto her, Daughter, be of good comfort: thy faith hath made thee whole; go in peace.

Luke 17:19
And he said unto him, Arise, go thy way: thy faith hath made thee whole.

Luke 18:42
And Jesus said unto him, Receive thy sight: thy faith hath saved thee.

Mark 11:22
And Jesus answering saith unto them, Have faith in God.

Luke 18:8
….. Nevertheless when the Son of man cometh, shall he find faith on the earth?

Jesus shows that we are to come to him too for the forgiveness of sins.

How do you ever get that means we don't have to obey him to receive the Holy Spirit? The Holy Spirit was not even given yet, for Jesus did not die and rise again and ascend.

You don't know this?

 

[God's Truth]

@StewardoftheMystery

I see from the scriptures that we can receive the Holy Spirit after we repent and are baptized (Acts 2:38), when God shows that he accepts us (Acts 15:8); for obeying, Acts 5:32, “...the Holy Spirit, whom God has given to those who obey him.”

Read these scriptures carefully. Jesus says they will receive the Holy Spirit if they obey. John 14:15-31 “If you love me, you will obey what I command. and I will ask the Father, and he will give you another Counselor to be with you forever--- the Spirit of truth.

Jesus will not even live with you unless you obey. John 14:23 Jesus replied, "If anyone loves me he will obey my teaching. My Father will love him, and we will come to him and make our home with him.

Even Cornelius had an angel come to him to tell him to send for Peter, and that is when he and his whole household received the Holy Spirit because they were God fearing and righteous people, for that is to whom the message is sent. See Acts 10:22; Acts 10:35 and Acts 13:26.

 

[StewardoftheMystery]

How do you ever get that means we don't have to obey him to receive the Holy Spirit?

How do you get the idea that having faith in Jesus Christ somehow suggests we don’t have to obey Him?

Faith does not= disobedience

 

[Dave M]

How do you get the idea that having faith in Jesus Christ somehow suggests we don’t have to obey Him?

Faith does not= disobedience

I think the point is anyone can say they have faith but the real evidence is the obedience to his word

 

[StewardoftheMystery]

I think the point is anyone can say they have faith but the real evidence is the obedience to his word

Exactly. You will know a tree by his fruit. Having faith in Jesus Christ will produce a faithfulness in obeying His words. Faith and works go hand in hand.

But just because someone says they have faith, ( but do not) this is not really faith in Jesus Christ, it is just lip service.

Matthew 15:8
This people draweth nigh unto me with their mouth, and honoureth me with their lips; but their heart is far from me.

 

[God's Truth]

How do you get the idea that having faith in Jesus Christ somehow suggests we don’t have to obey Him?

We HAVE TO OBEY him.

Faith does not= disobedience

Just because someone might believe in Jesus, it doesn't mean they will obey him.

 

[God's Truth]

I think the point is anyone can say they have faith but the real evidence is the obedience to his word

Exactly!

Thanks, Dave M, for StewardoftheMystery must know what I am saying, but he is twisting it up and playing some game.

 

[God's Truth]

Exactly. You will know a tree by his fruit. Having faith in Jesus Christ will produce a faithfulness in obeying His words. Faith and works go hand in hand.

NO.

A person is NOT saved by faith alone and then a wait and see if fruit comes and if if does then it was real faith.

That is a false teaching.

FAITH ALONE IS ALWAYS DEAD AND CANNOT SAVE.

But just because someone says they have faith, ( but do not) this is not really faith in Jesus Christ, it is just lip service.

We are talking about people who DO believe but have not obeyed yet by repenting of their sins.

Matthew 15:8
This people draweth nigh unto me with their mouth, and honoureth me with their lips; but their heart is far from me.

So you see it is NOT like you said that faith and works go hand in hand!

Matthew 7:21“Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22 Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name and in your name drive out demons and in your name perform many miracles?’ 23 Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!’


They kept doing evil and they did NOT repent of their sins.
We have to repent of our sins to get saved.