Do You Have To Be Baptised To Recieve The Holy Spirit

[Stickz]

"Sorry, there is no way around it, if you say that you must be water baptized to be saved, that is boasting of something that you physically had to do.....that is boasting in your actions and not in faith alone."

Then, your saying that your being capable of the faith that it takes to receive your salvation is boasting. It was in your own power, right? Wasn't it your choice to make? Didn't you pray or something to receive your salvation, RJ?

 

[RJ]

"So, Stickz, here it is. With regards to the need to be water baptized for salvation, we have two clear-cut views, both can not be of God. One saves and one does not and God have mercy on anyone who chooses the wrong way.....Hebrews 11:6"

Both views are definitely not of God.

Wait a minute! SO you believe in water baptism as a requirement for salvation but you belief in is not of God...Wow, your confusing!

 

[Stickz]

Sorry that you're getting confused, RJ, but I was only agreeing with what you had said in your post, that one of our views is definitely not of God. One is wrong. Calm down and make sure that you've read clearly what has been said, RJ.

 

[RJ]

Sorry that you're getting confused, RJ, but I was only agreeing with what you had said in your post, that one of our views is definitely not of God. One is wrong. Calm down and make sure that you've read clearly what has been said, RJ.

Not sure exactly how you came back with that when you said: "Both views are definitely not of God."? How else can you read that?
There are two views here. First you say: "Both views are definitely not of God." And then you say: "One is wrong"!
Now, no offense my brother but you ought to consider coming down and understanding when statements are conflicting, If you don't call that confusing then I don't know what is!

 

[RJ]

"Wow, where in the world did I ever mention sprinkling or infant baptism in anyway?"

You didn't mention sprinkling or infant baptism, RJ, I did to make a point. Apparently you missed the point.

I miss a lot of your points brother! and, the sprinkling / infants still had nothing to do with our discussion!

 

[Stickz]

Not sure exactly how you came back with that when you said: "Both views are definitely not of God."? How else can you read that?
There are two views here. First you say: "Both views are definitely not of God." And then you say: "One is wrong"!
Now, no offense my brother but you ought to consider coming down and understanding when statements are conflicting, If you don't call that confusing then I don't know what is!

Okay, RJ, I re-read everything and you're correct, I did have a typo in my post. I'm sorry, I got in a hurry because I had to leave my house. What I meant was we both have an opinion and at least one of us is wrong. I suppose we could both be wrong about our route to salvation, but one thing is for sure, we cannot both be right about the baptism.

 

[RJ]

RJ, let me ask you: What exactly happened to make the thief on the cross come to the conclusion that Jesus was the Son of God? Scripture gives us very little of their conversation on the cross, correct? Had the thief heard about Jesus at another point in time? You give me something that you can support with scripture, please.

Again, you are way off off-base. It was you that brought up the thief, not me. So, I politely have no motive to look up scripture on a matter that I did not endorse to further my stance. You did endorse it to enhance your stance and I did was point out that you had no scriptural support for it! If you think it is important to you and wish to entice some feed back, I suggest that you begin a new thread on the matter.
Other than that, I will give you this. The bible says nothing about the thief other than the crucifixion incident. So, I will offer this on how he knew. Once, when Peter said that Jesus was God, Jesus said that Peter did not learn that on his own, that his knowledge came from God. Maybe God revealed this to the thief, I don't know for sure. That is something you will have to ask God first chance you get. I do know this though. You have no basis to assume that thief was baptized just to falsely support your theology!

 

[RJ]

Then, your saying that your being capable of the faith that it takes to receive your salvation is boasting. It was in your own power, right? Wasn't it your choice to make? Didn't you pray or something to receive your salvation, RJ?

C'mon STichz, you should know that is not right!....Faith is not works of your own, it is a gift of God. You receive God by faith, like Abraham, he credits you with salvation. Your faith comes right from God and not you.....When you proclaim this salvation by grace, how in the world can you call that boasting?
I don't know how many times I have to give this to you but here it is again:

• Ephesians 2: 8-9... Stichz, don't you know that faith is a free gift from God?
• Romans 12:3 ....3 For I say to every man that is among you, through the grace given unto me, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think, but to think soberly according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.... Stickz, faith comes from God, so he does call that boasting anywhere!!!

 

[Stickz]

I miss a lot of your points brother! and, the sprinkling / infants still had nothing to do with our discussion!

I used them as examples, RJ, to make a point because they are looked as baptisms and that is what this thread is about, right? Waiting until you are an adult and getting baptized just in case is making it about the act itself and not about faith. If the person being baptized does not know why they are doing it there is no point doing it.

In your opinion, RJ, should a person say the Sinner's Prayer and believe themselves saved just in case there really is a God?

 

[RJ]

In your opinion, RJ, should a person say the Sinner's Prayer and believe themselves saved just in case there really is a God?

Pardon me?..You are so full of surprises! After all our back and forths with each other and you have the tenacity to question the very existence of God? How can you be saved? If you don't believe there is a God, what were you baptized for?

 

[ATP]

should a person say the Sinner's Prayer and believe themselves saved just in case there really is a God?

The sinner's prayer isn't Rom 10:9-10. To be saved you follow Rom 10:9-10.

 

[Stickz]

Pardon me?..You are so full of surprises! After all our back and forths with each other and you have the tenacity to question the very existence of God? How can you be saved? If you don't believe there is a God, what were you baptized for?

You really don't even try, do you?

 

[RJ]

should a person say the Sinner's Prayer and believe themselves saved just in case there really is a God?

You really don't even try, do you?

You said it , I didn't!
If anything, your about statement about there being a God, shows you spiritual maturity and does nothing to promote Talk Jesus and is even totally inappropriate here.
It is like you are doing this bait and switch on me. I am really not interested in you games and I take one's salvation very seriously!!, so I will politely bow out and end my conversation with you.
You are the one who is not trying!

 

[Stickz]

Go on then, RJ, I'm tired of having to go back and try to explain one of my posts to you anyway.

 

[RJ]

I used them as examples, RJ, to make a point because they are looked as baptisms and that is what this thread is about, right? Waiting until you are an adult and getting baptized just in case is making it about the act itself and not about faith. If the person being baptized does not know why they are doing it there is no point doing it.

In your opinion, RJ, should a person say the Sinner's Prayer and believe themselves saved just in case there really is a God?

I have no further comment. May God bless you on you're spiritual journey.

 

[RJ]

Go on then, RJ, I'm tired of having to go back and try to explain one of my posts to you anyway.

May God bless your spiritual growth and putting your faith, which he gave you, only in him and not in yourself!

 

[Stickz]

Parable of the Talents.

 

[Stickz]

Even though, RJ, has discarded me as an unbelieving blasphemer from Hell, I'd still like someone to answer the question: Was John's baptism from God or of men?

When everyone else in the world was getting baptized at the time ( Paul ended up running into people who had been baptized by John in some pretty far away places, didn't he? ) believing it possible that the thief on the cross too was baptized is less of a stretch than assuming that he wasn't. I'm pretty sure that the scale would lean in my favor on that one. Why is it that other people can make assumptions about the thief on the cross, but I can't, without it being something that I'm only doing to support my theology? People who call themselves Christians don't just do whatever they can to support their own theology, do they? Almost everything that could be said of the thief on the cross would have to be assumption because not very much is said.

Something to think about ( for some, anyway, I guess ): When Paul says that he was not "called" to baptize, it may not mean that there was nothing to being baptized in water. There were people that Paul baptized, right? Quite often, according to some of his letters, he often had one or more people with him. Paul was known as the chief speaker, at least, to some

Acts 14:12 And they called Barnabas, Jupiter; and Paul, Mercurius, because he was the chief speaker.

but if Paul did do all of the speaking, most of the time, what did the others that were with him do?

I Corinthians 3:6 I have planted, Apollos watered; but God gave the increase.

 

[RJ]

Even though, RJ, has discarded me as an unbelieving blasphemer from Hell, I'd still like someone to answer the question: Was John's baptism from God or of men?

Please stop the lies. You're at it again with the untruths. You have already apologized for speaking falsely of me before. There is no place for this kind of false accusation here at TJ, especially when you have nothing to back it up. If you are a honest Jesus loving Christian, please show all listening in, where, in any post that I called you a " unbelieving blasphemer from Hell". Well, you can't and you're attack is un-becoming of the Christian who you say you are! Either pull back that comment or live with the consequences!

 

[Stickz]

Please, go take a reading & comprehension class, RJ.

For one, did you notice that there were no quotation marks around what I said that you called me, RJ? In English grammar, that is usually a sign that the writer is not trying to quote what was said. You did pretty much accuse me of blasphemy earlier in the thread ( I'm not doing all the work, it's there, if you want to see it go look yourself ). The way that you are questioning what I say is an indicator that you also believe me to be someone deceived, not a true believer, so ... is there any other option here than understanding that you think of me as an unbeliever? If I admittedly do not believe the things that you are saying, and what you are saying is the only way for someone to be saved, why should I not assume that you are pretty much calling me an unbeliever? I do not believe you about much of anything that you say, and in your eyes that makes me an unbeliever. So ... I do have to admit to adding the word 'Hell' myself, you know, paraphrasing a little. Anyway, take it how you want to, RJ, you are good at that.