Homosexuality

[4Jesus]

Walk close to the Saviour my young brother. Let no one condemn you. Keep praying - be honest and contrite before the Lord. We all have all sinned in thought and in deed. I for one will be praying for you in love.
If you feel it would help please feel free to privately message me.
In the Love of Jesus
David

Fevold2, My precious brother,

Thank you for your private message. I have responded - I am posting this perchance I have not pressed all the right buttons to ensure my reply reaches you.

Yours in the lovely Name of Jesus
David

 

[Chad]

Dear Brother,

My regrets. I did not deliberately single Brother Chad. I have simply asked him to quote scripture to support his belief on three specific points.

After all, I think it is quite important for a homosexual to know whether they are committing a sin, possessed of a 'dirty spririt' or even both. Unclean (dirty) spirits are 'cast out' in Jesus' name. Sins are cleansed by the Blood of Jesus.

In Him
David

I disagree. You have continually followed me and question everything I say. Grow up, and stop your annoying attitude "my precious brother". Everything I post is right in the Bible itself. You have never heard of a dirty spirit? I'm sorry, should I have to go by your own vocabulary, perhaps unclean would be closer to literal english word found in the bible? Is that good enough for you "my precious brother"? I don't like your attitude and I don't like you following me around with your senseless questions so consider it your last chance to stop that pathetic pattern of annoyance.

In Jesus' name.

 

[Chad]

Blessings to you Brother Chad.

Could I ask you please enlighten me on the following points:

1. What do you mean by a 'dirty spirit' please, it is not a term I am familiar with? If, as a guess, you are ascerting that the homosexual person is possessed of a demon, it would be useful to learn the scripture which teaches this.

2. What is your scriptural authority that the 'dirty spirit' of homsexuality can only be removed in Jesus' name, instead of a 'healing' in the name of Jesus?

3. Are you singling out homosexuality as a 'dirty spirit' and not e.g. Adultery, promiscuity, sex outside of marraige? Are all the 'abominations' demonic possessions in your veiw or are they abominable 'sin'?

In Jesus
David

My view? How about GOD's view? Why do you care for my view oh precious brother? Where do you see any singling out? Sin is sin, is that too difficult to figure out?

Leviticus 20:13
If a man lies with a male as with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination; they shall surely be put to death; their blood is upon them.

Your #2 question makes no sense whatsoever. Your #1 question is sarcastic, going by the dozen other threads you followed me around with questions just to antagonize me like a child.

 

[4Jesus]

I disagree. You have continually followed me and question everything I say. Grow up, and stop your annoying attitude "my precious brother". Everything I post is right in the Bible itself. You have never heard of a dirty spirit? I'm sorry, should I have to go by your own vocabulary, perhaps unclean would be closer to literal english word found in the bible? Is that good enough for you "my precious brother"? I don't like your attitude and I don't like you following me around with your senseless questions so consider it your last chance to stop that pathetic pattern of annoyance and grow up. For the record, your greetings honestly do not sound any bit sincere to me at all. Sounds more pagan like with the religiousness it expresses. Be real and stop trying to sound so religious and know-it-all.

In Jesus' name.

Please forgive me. I have obviously offended you. All I sincerly and genuinly wanted to understand from you is whether you believe the Bible reveals to us that homosexualiy is, to quote you, is an unclean spirit, i.e. demon possession, or whether it is sin. The bible teaches that sin has three sources; the flesh, the world and the devil. I believe that homosexuality can be from either or all of the three.

You see, I have encountered a situation where a non-practicing homosexual youth from Christian parents was so disturbed at the preaching his homosexuality was because of him being possessed of an unclean spirit; he lost hope and killed himself. The 'letter' can and does kill.

Chad, please be assured I am not following you around. I desire to hear from you what God is saying to you. I wish to be unity with you.

Incidentally, your penultimate reply to me (above) commenced with, "I disagree". I simply asked you three questions regarding your doctrine. I am a sincerely at loss to understand what you are disagreeing with me about. What have I said that you disagree with please?

David

 

[Chad]

Chad: When you think that a woman is beautiful, you are lusting after her? Attraction is not lust. I am talking about homosexuality here, not lying with a man, nor intercourse between two men. How can you be so absolutely sure that it is a choice? I am attracted to guys physically, but I yearn to be with a woman. I would not choose this for myself, for it is confusing, as you may gather. When did I have the choice to feel this way? I'd give it up in less than a heartbeat if it were possible.

This does not make sense at all. You say you *are* talking about homosexuality, yet you say "not lying with a man nor intercourse between two men". Do you even know the definition of homosexuality?

Homosexual
American Heritage Dictionary

Of, relating to, or having a sexual orientation to persons of the same sex.

As far as being attracted to men physically, that is not a healthy thing and you need to confess this to GOD in Jesus' name and seek His strength to deliver you. I have an issue with lust, I gave it to Him at the foot of the Cross in Jesus' name and confess my sins before the Lord. I leave no room for debating with myself or my sins or anything else.

 

[4Jesus]

Chad,

I know sin is sin, and I know to practice homosexuality is sin, I know the Bible tells us it is an abomination - and other verision say 'detestable'. We have no disagreement between us on that point.

The only specific thing that I am trying to clarify with you, in love and respect, is; whether you expound that homosexuality is occassioned by demon possestion (dirty or unclean spirit indwelling) or if it as a result of sin (fleshly disobedience to Gods Law) or attraction to what the world accepts.

I personally believe that homosexual activity can be brought about by temptation from the flesh the world and the Devil.

Again, my appologies for the manner in which I greeted you as a brother and 'in Jesus'. Please forgive me.

David

 

[Chad]

The only specific thing that I am trying to clarify with you, in love and respect, is; whether you expound that homosexuality is occassioned by demon possestion (dirty or unclean spirit indwelling) or if it as a result of sin (fleshly disobedience to Gods Law) or attraction to what the world accepts.

I personally believe that homosexual activity can be brought about by temptation from the flesh the world and the Devil.

David

Well to be quite honest, isn't there sin involved that would invite an unclean spirit or sin involved whether it is straight from the flesh? Sin is involved either way, and must be dealt with by the blood of Jesus Christ. Very simple and straightforward. We know it is a sin and that's enough to know. It doesn't matter where it came from, what matters is if something is wrong in the eyes of GOD or not, it has to be dealt with.

 

[ccansl]

Apparently there is a ministry called Exodus that takes the position that gay acts/lifestyle is sin but that Christians with same sex attraction are still in Christ. Jesus comes first, let Him and those who love in His name take care of the person's needs. The problem is probably no more a choice than hetero-attraction is.

 

[Fellowservant]

Eph 2:2 Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:

As we see above every man outside of Christ, is under the power of the spirit of Satan. Whether its an unclean one or not, all are under the power of the prince of the air (ie Satan) if they are not in Christ. Why? because if they were freed from the powers of darkness, they would become new creatures in Christ, and the spirit of Christ would be leading them.

Rom 8:14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.


God bless

 

[4Jesus]

Well to be quite honest, isn't there sin involved that would invite an unclean spirit or sin involved whether it is straight from the flesh? Sin is involved either way, and must be dealt with by the blood of Jesus Christ. Very simple and straightforward. We know it is a sin and that's enough to know. It doesn't matter where it came from, what matters is if something is wrong in the eyes of GOD or not, it has to be dealt with.

Chad,

Thank you, I agree.

However, it does not address the question I originally asked, the answer to which is very important when ministering to the homosexual.

You said, "Yes, they (homosexuals) are sinning and yes they DO have a choice. The desire/lust of same sex is a dirty (unclean spirit) spirit that must be and can only be removed in Jesus' name."

My question (simplified) is, Where does God say (scripture please) that homosexuality is an unclean spirit that must and can only be removed in Jesus' name?

If you are able to point specifically to the Word of God that teaches homosexuality is an unclean spirit (demon) which can only be removed in Jesus name, then surely the remedy for homosexuality is to be found in Mark 16:17 "in My Name they will cast out demons..."

Somewhere in this thread someone related 'choosing to be homosexual' to 'choosing to be a murderer or a thief'. I personally believe that would be a true comparison when a heterosexual chooses to become involved in homosexual activity. For the celibate homosexual from birth, e.g. fevoldj2, I truly believe a better comparison is to ask the question, did the man blind from birth choose to be blind? Did the born deaf man choose to be deaf? Did the born dumb man choose to be dumb? Did the born mental defective man choose to be mad?

Jesus healed the man born blind; He did not cast out an unclean spirit from him. So where in the Word does it say, "The desire/lust of same sex is a dirty (unclean spirit) spirit that must be and can only be removed in Jesus' name."

Best Regards
David

 

[Nigh]

4Jesus,My precious brother,

Are you really that dense? You are the ONLY one on this forum who thinks Chad believes (or is saying) all homosexual desires are from demon possession.

Can it be? Yes. It is sin, like all others, and can be demon influenced or otherwise. Chad is not claiming all homosexuals are demons possessed, and for you to look for scripture to support such a claim is a waste of time and borderline bothersome. I won't tolerate this much more. If your aim is to be banned from this site, then continue. If not, then may I humbly suggest you move the conversation onward? Offer new insight or scripture, or questions, but don't rehash this "Chad said" prattle any more.

My apologies for speaking "in the flesh", but one can be driven to it now can't he? Enough is enough. Move on, or I'll move you.

Yours in the lovely Name of Jesus,
Nigh

 

[4Jesus]

Brother Nigh

I will comply with your request as moderator.

It's just that to me, " the desire/lust of same sex is a dirty (unclean) spirit that must be and can only be removed in Jesus' name." means, "the desire/lust of same sex is a dirty (unclean) spirit that must be and can only be removed in Jesus' name." Sorry for being so "dense". I will leave it there!

quote "My apologies for speaking "in the flesh", but one can be driven to it now can't he? Enough is enough. Move on, or I'll move you." unquote

Thats OK brother please be assured you are in my prayers.

In Jesus
David

 

[Nigh]

...It's just that to me, " the desire/lust of same sex is a dirty (unclean) spirit that must be and can only be removed in Jesus' name." means, "the desire/lust of same sex is a dirty (unclean) spirit that must be and can only be removed in Jesus' name."

OK 4J, tell me, can it be removed in the name of Mohammad? Or Carl? Or John Jacob Jinglehiemer Schmitt? I didn't think so. We all know that Chad was saying it is only Jesus who can take away sin. That is the plan made by our Heavenly Father. "By his blood"..."On the cross".."at the foot of his thrown"...OR "in Jesus' name". It all means the same thing. If you like, I'll break out the crayons and coloring books and draw you a picture.

Sorry for being so "dense".

That's OK brother, rest assured you are in my prayers as well.

This is my Fathers house.

In His name,
Nigh

 

[gabrielle_iglo]

Engaging in homosexual behavior is a choice, but the desire is not necessairily a choice. Perhaps what "planted" the desire was a choice (like watching gay porno...etc) but not everyone who desires people of the same sex made a choice to desire people of the same sex. Do you think that young teens who get kicked out of their houses onto the street wanted to be gay? No I don't think so. Does it mean they couldn't change their ways with the help of Jesus? Most defnitely not!

I do believe it is Satan who put that desire there and it is not "normal" or good, but wanting to engage in homosexual behavior is a sin exactly like any other incorrect desire... like wanting heterosexual sex, like masterbating, like lieing.
How about I use you for example. I'm sure at one point you wanted sex outside of marriage. Did you go and have sex? No (well maybe you did... but I don't want to know). But you wanted it. Does that mean you are possesed by the devil and have demons in you? Does it mean you cannot be saved? Since when have any of us been perfect?

Why do we treat homosexuality any different than other sins?

The lifestyle is chosen, but the desire is natural to have considering the circumstances (how people are publicising it so much and glamorising it- why wouldn't it come to mind for some people who already have the tendancy?).

I do not pretend to understand how I could actually want to have sex with a chick, but I do know that it is hard for people who do want that. I do not claim to be sin free, it just so happens I don't have a problem with that sin. I have a "gay" friend who almost never lies, I lie way more than her (so how do you know I'm telling the truth right now? I guess you'll just have to trust me!) so we deal with different sins! Hers is no worse.

Also if the Bible should speak for itself why do you claim to have the answers? Were you there sitting by Paul while he was writting? How do you know more than anyone else that the Bible condemns homosexuality? (though I agree in that case because my conscience has convinced me of that and I do think God sees homosexuality as a sin)

 

[gabrielle_iglo]

This is for Nigh, Chad and 4Jesus:

God asked us to not use His name in vain. Now I don't care if you guys continue your annoying petty bickering, but when you use God to back up your sarcasm and rudeness that is insulting to even me.

"Thats OK brother please be assured you are in my prayers." "Yours in the lovely Name of Jesus"

Don't say it if you don't mean it, but I am not here to judge you, just pointing it out.

*God Bless

PS: sry Chad I'll try to correct my wording.

 

[Chad]

Now I don't care if you guys continue your annoying petty bickering, but when you use God to back up your sarcasm and rudeness that is insulting to even me.

Yet somehow that is mature and in lovingness after all isn't it to insult someone with "petty bickering"?

Thread locked. Homosexuality is a sin and that is simple. Read the Bible.

 

[Nigh]

4Jesus,
Let me offer some assistance regarding the succeeding question.

Incidentally, your penultimate reply to me (above) commenced with, "I disagree". I simply asked you three questions regarding your doctrine. I am a sincerely at loss to understand what you are disagreeing with me about. What have I said that you disagree with please?

OK, here come the crayons...

teraside said...

4Jesus, please read in context what Chad is saying, your actions seem to seek an attempt of aggravating Chad, he does and says what he says by and through the Holy Spirit. Chad lives for Jesus and he does not deserve to be singled out in this conversation

you said...

My regrets. I did not deliberately single Brother Chad...

Then Chad said...

I disagree. You have continually followed me and question everything I say.

Is that clear enough for you? Do you now understand, as everyone else here does, exactly what disagreement Chad has with what statement?

4Jesus, please read in context what Chad is saying

Incidentally, if you had headed these words you would have seen that Chad was not claiming demon possession as the cause for homosexuality. Look at it now.

Yes, they are sinning and yes they DO have a choice. The desire/lust of same sex is a dirty spirit that must be and can only be removed in Jesus' name.

Notice the underlined words in the penultimate sentence of his statement. Being possessed by demons implies that one does not have a choice. That one is not in control of his/her actions, but that a demon/spirit is in control. The very fact that Chad says they have a choice should be enough for you to understand what Chad is saying.

God bless,
Nigh