How does a persos know that he is not decievin himself?

[Seeker Of Jesus]

Can a person decieve themselves into thinking that they are saved when they r really not. The bible says that when The Lord returns and takes His people, many will come to him and ask why were they not saved, and The Lord will simply tell them Matthew 7:23: "Then I will tell them plainly, 'I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!"

Do you think a person can decieve themselves into thinking that they r saved when truly they are not?

 

[Hekuran]

The next verses have the answer - obey the teaching of Jesus in the sermon on the mount! Obeying Jesus is building on a firm foundation that will not crumble in the storm of Judgement.

“Therefore everyone who hears these words of mine and puts them into practice is like a wise man who built his house on the rock. The rain came down, the streams rose, and the winds blew and beat against that house; yet it did not fall, because it had its foundation on the rock. But everyone who hears these words of mine and does not put them into practice is like a foolish man who built his house on sand. The rain came down, the streams rose, and the winds blew and beat against that house, and it fell with a great crash.”

 

[allforihs]

Do you think a person can decieve themselves into thinking that they r saved when truly they are not?

Yes, a person can believe he is saved and not be saved. Matthew 7:23 tells you that.

As Hekuran said, a saved person obeys Christ. We all serve our master. If Christ is your master, you will serve him and follow his law.

For example, mega-church pastors Randy and Paula White think they're saved. But, they got divorced, showing that they are not saved. They know Jesus forbids divorce, but they do not belong to Jesus. He is not their master.

 

[Seeker Of Jesus]

Just because they got a divorce does not mean that they are not saved, for all we know he/she could've cheated on him/her which gives he/she the right to get a divorce.

 

[allforihs]

Just because they got a divorce does not mean that they are not saved, for all we know he/she could've cheated on him/her which gives he/she the right to get a divorce.

Yes, their divorce does mean they're not saved. They presented their divorce to the public as casual and mutual. Such a move is not out of character for them. Jesus is not their master.

 

[Tusk Barnes]

I would conjecture that people have been deceived into thinking they need to be saved in the first place. After that first deceit, everything else that followed is meaningless. Believing you ARE saved, (whether deceived or not) doesn't matter if there is no reason to actually be saved to begin with.

 

[allforihs]

I would conjecture that people have been deceived into thinking they need to be saved in the first place. After that first deceit, everything else that followed is meaningless. Believing you ARE saved, (whether deceived or not) doesn't matter if there is no reason to actually be saved to begin with.

The Atheist doctrine isn't that you don't need saving (receiving eternal life), but that you can't be saved. For themselves, they may be right.

 

[The Robster]

Yes, their divorce does mean they're not saved. They presented their divorce to the public as casual and mutual. Such a move is not out of character for them. Jesus is not their master.

Please do not tell me you are suggesting that everyone who has obtained a divorce is not saved? Plenty of Christians are doing or have done all kinds of things that would be classified as sinful and wrong, yet the blood of Jesus Christ has covered every sin. Jesus has never been out to condemn people nor does He do it today. Does God hate divorce? yes. If you get one does that change that you are the righteousness of God in Christ? Not one bit. Plenty of Christians are doing things they shouldn't be doing and many are not doing things they are supposed to as Christians under grace. Those failings do not change their right standing with God or the fact that they are saved if they believe it by faith in their heart. I'm willing to bet you don't do a few things under grace that you are supposed to be doing as a Christian. Does that mean that Jesus is not your Master? Seems to me that you want to pick and choose which failings make a person unsaved. And that's not supported by scripture.

 

[Tusk Barnes]

The Atheist doctrine isn't that you don't need saving (receiving eternal life), but that you can't be saved. For themselves, they may be right.

The amount of not-knowing-what-you're-talking-about that you have demonstrated in response to all of my posts would be embarrassing to any other human. I salute you for sticking to your guns, no matter how filled with plastic bullets they may be. Atheism only means lacking a belief in a god. Since sin has, from time immemorial, been defined by "gods," and definitely not men, I also implicitly lack a belief in sin, and thus a need of salvation from said sin. Again, I've only conjectured that the initial deceit arrived when you were convinced that you needed salvation. Learn what words mean, please.

Divorcees are not saved? Really? That's like saying sinners are not forgiven.

Thanks for nothing, Jesus...ala allforihs.

 

[Boanerges]

Can a person decieve themselves into thinking that they are saved when they r really not. The bible says that when The Lord returns and takes His people, many will come to him and ask why were they not saved, and The Lord will simply tell them Matthew 7:23: "Then I will tell them plainly, 'I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!"

Do you think a person can decieve themselves into thinking that they r saved when truly they are not?

Jesus made it clear- these folks sought to serve Him in their own strength and yet they never came into the relationship of son-ship. Rather than submitting their heart to God (and being born again) they choose acts of dead religion seeking to build their own righteousness instead of walking in His. Their reply betrays them: "Lord didn't we do this- Lord didn't we do that"? It was a works based life that never (by faith) touched God's heart and received new life.

 

[Brother Mike]

saved or not....

Yes, their divorce does mean they're not saved.

I get amazed more and more by what I read here everyday....

Son-ship.... child Growing, mature.

stages.

Amazing.. that you can't make one mistake or get out of a horrible situation to serve God in a greater capacity. Amazing that any acts of growing and learning by making mistakes would put you on the unsaved list.....

Jesus Is Lord

 

[El Hombre viejo]

Yes, their divorce does mean they're not saved. They presented their divorce to the public as casual and mutual. Such a move is not out of character for them. Jesus is not their master.

allforihs..Where did you get that line? Its not in the Bible. Or are you simply passing judgment? How is divorce any worse than stealing a car? Or robbery? prostitution? Or passing judgment on other Christians?

If you're going to teach on here, please speak what the Father speaks on the subject?

 

[JDFree]

How does a person know that he is not deceiving himself? Pretty simple really, thanks to Father God, Jesus Christ & Holy Spirit! God knows the nuts & bolts of us as our Creator. He knows exactly what YOU need, as compared to what someone else needs, and it can be different. That's a major problem with denominations and people's personal doctrine: thinking that everyone can fit into a single, one-size-fits-all belief & doctrine! There's bound to be some variations, so what you want is SOLID BASICS to build your house upon, the Solid Rock of our Salvation Jesus Christ!

The answer is, Ask God! If you humble yourself on your face before God and ask HIM to reveal all of himself to you that your brains can handle, HE WILL! Ask Him to reveal himself to you in every way that He will, and He Will! Then ask Him to personally lead you to the Truth of His Holy Scriptures, that you may gain Knowledge & Wisdom in Him, to show you exactly where to find the Truth of Him, and He Will! Ask Him to teach you what your life should be before Him, and He Will!

Pray Jesus to forgive you your sins by His Perfect Sacrifice for sin, and then lay your sin at His nail scarred feet: GONE forever more! BELIEVE, as to 'Be' and Live', that because Jesus is the Son of God/Son of man, sent from Father God and that by this, His Sacrifice may be Perfect, and that He is indeed Lord God Almighty, and the Son of God who gave His life for your sin, paying the ransom of your soul, that you may be FREE!

Ask Him to help you to live in His Way every moment of your life, in ALL THINGS, and He Will! As much as is possible, stay in His Word, refreshing your heart & soul daily, even throughout the day if you may.

TRUST in Him that He is All Sufficient to your every need, and He Will Be! When times get tough, and they will, again cast yourself at His feet, and don't get up until the advancing armies have passed by you or fallen before your Mighty God, because either way, He is your ONLY Hope in all of creation and He will be your strength & protection!

Pray Him for the strength to endure temptation, weakness, illness, attacks, disappointments and heartbreaks and He Will!

Prove every teaching of another by Scripture: to be absolutely sure it is of God, not of men; and if you cannot yet understand Scripture then very simply: BELIEVE NO MAN, but BELIEVE GOD!

Put away from yourself every evil you can, and ask God to guide you, strengthen you, and make you able to stand in Him, and He Will! BE-LIEVE that Jesus is God and that He is Perfectly Sufficient in all things and Loves you and cares for you, and put all of your cares upon God, for He cares for you, and He Will!

 

[SpiritLedEd]

allforihs..Where did you get that line? Its not in the Bible. Or are you simply passing judgment? How is divorce any worse than stealing a car? Or robbery? prostitution? Or passing judgment on other Christians?

If you're going to teach on here, please speak what the Father speaks on the subject?

FYI, Chad closed Allforihs's membership. Belief-wise, he's so far out in left field he's beyond intelligent discourse.

SLE

 

[Tusk Barnes]

Good gracious! I hope that doesn't happen to me. I've loved my time here so far, and I might go as far as to say I've made a few friends. I hope my beliefs (or lack thereof, as it were) don't get me kicked. I've tried keeping things civil and informative on both ends, at least.

 

[agua]

Can a person decieve themselves into thinking that they are saved when they r really not. The bible says that when The Lord returns and takes His people, many will come to him and ask why were they not saved, and The Lord will simply tell them Matthew 7:23: "Then I will tell them plainly, 'I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!"

Do you think a person can decieve themselves into thinking that they r saved when truly they are not?

The ones in Matthew 7:23 are the false prophets in 7:15.They did works and claimed they were for God.The fruit of their works however proved they were never born again.The phophecy,casting out demons ,and wonderful works were all done from vain motives.eg..a prophet may incite his congregation to raise millions of dollars for a worthy cause and even help many in need,while also using this money to build his mansion and fuel his jet.

Mat 7:20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.


I have trouble believing these people truly think they are saved.Maybe their pride puffs them up to think this.

 

[El Hombre viejo]

FYI, Chad closed Allforihs's membership. Belief-wise, he's so far out in left field he's beyond intelligent discourse.

SLE

Ahh? It's sad, but I do have to admit it was frustrating to read many of his posts.

 

[JDFree]

It really is shame. Sometimes he'd hit the nail right on the head with a post that reflected a very deep & correct understanding of a complex part of Christian belief, then the next post was out in Wonderland.

Excellent example of the real problem that surfaces when a person or group refuses to accept God's Word as it's written, as it's SPOKEN through the Holy Spirit, and instead adds to it & subtracts from it until it suits them: Counterfeit Christ!

Man's own 'Oh, so very clever' mind & imagining & conjecture & ultra-critical analysis have destroyed many: "...thinking themselves wise, they become fools..." as the Ego & SELF with its imaginations overthrow the things of God. That wasn't intended as insult from me at all, but just stating what Scripture says regarding the subject. Personally I liked the felllow but for said problems.

 

[El Hombre viejo]

It really is shame. Sometimes he'd hit the nail right on the head with a post that reflected a very deep & correct understanding of a complex part of Christian belief, then the next post was out in Wonderland.

Excellent example of the real problem that surfaces when a person or group refuses to accept God's Word as it's written, as it's SPOKEN through the Holy Spirit, and instead adds to it & subtracts from it until it suits them: Counterfeit Christ!

Man's own 'Oh, so very clever' mind & imagining & conjecture & ultra-critical analysis have destroyed many: "...thinking themselves wise, they become fools..." as the Ego & SELF with its imaginations overthrow the things of God. That wasn't intended as insult from me at all, but just stating what Scripture says regarding the subject. Personally I liked the felllow but for said problems.

Romans 1:20-25 (Amplified Bible)

<sup class="versenum" id="en-AMP-27949">20</sup>For ever since the creation of the world His invisible nature and attributes, that is, His eternal power and divinity, have been made intelligible and clearly discernible in and through the things that have been made (His handiworks). So [men] are without excuse [altogether without any defense or justification],<sup class="xref" value="(<a href=&quot;#cen-AMP-27949A&quot; title=&quot;See cross-reference A&quot;>A</a>)">(A)</sup>
<sup class="versenum" id="en-AMP-27950">21</sup>Because when they knew and recognized Him as God, they did not honor and glorify Him as God or give Him thanks. But instead they became futile and <sup class="footnote" value="[<a href=&quot;#fen-AMP-27950a&quot; title=&quot;See footnote a&quot;>a</a>]">[a]</sup>godless in their thinking [with vain imaginings, foolish reasoning, and stupid speculations] and their senseless minds were darkened.
<sup class="versenum" id="en-AMP-27951">22</sup>Claiming to be wise, they became fools [professing to be smart, they made simpletons of themselves].
<sup class="versenum" id="en-AMP-27952">23</sup>And by them the glory and majesty and excellence of the immortal God were exchanged for and represented by images, resembling mortal man and birds and beasts and reptiles.
<sup class="versenum" id="en-AMP-27953">24</sup>Therefore God gave them up in the lusts of their [own] hearts to sexual impurity, to the dishonoring of their bodies among themselves [abandoning them to the degrading power of sin],
<sup class="versenum" id="en-AMP-27954">25</sup>Because they exchanged the truth of God for a lie and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, Who is blessed forever! Amen (so be it).




Anybody who leaves the Holy Spirit out of his education and growth is a fool. The natural man (the intellect) cannot perceive the things of the Spirit.
<sup class="xref" value="(<a href=&quot;#cen-AMP-27954B&quot; title=&quot;See cross-reference B&quot;>B</a>)"></sup>

 

[JDFree]

Romans 1:20-25 (Amplified Bible)

<SUP class=versenum id=en-AMP-27949>20</SUP>For ever since the creation of the world His invisible nature and attributes, that is, His eternal power and divinity, have been made intelligible and clearly discernible in and through the things that have been made (His handiworks). So [men] are without excuse [altogether without any defense or justification],<SUP class=xref value='(A)'>(A)</SUP>
<SUP class=versenum id=en-AMP-27950>21</SUP>Because when they knew and recognized Him as God, they did not honor and glorify Him as God or give Him thanks. But instead they became futile and <SUP class=footnote value='[a]'>[a]</SUP>godless in their thinking [with vain imaginings, foolish reasoning, and stupid speculations] and their senseless minds were darkened.
<SUP class=versenum id=en-AMP-27951>22</SUP>Claiming to be wise, they became fools [professing to be smart, they made simpletons of themselves].
<SUP class=versenum id=en-AMP-27952>23</SUP>And by them the glory and majesty and excellence of the immortal God were exchanged for and represented by images, resembling mortal man and birds and beasts and reptiles.
<SUP class=versenum id=en-AMP-27953>24</SUP>Therefore God gave them up in the lusts of their [own] hearts to sexual impurity, to the dishonoring of their bodies among themselves [abandoning them to the degrading power of sin],
<SUP class=versenum id=en-AMP-27954>25</SUP>Because they exchanged the truth of God for a lie and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, Who is blessed forever! Amen (so be it).

Anybody who leaves the Holy Spirit out of his education and growth is a fool. The natural man (the intellect) cannot perceive the things of the Spirit.
<SUP class=xref value='(B)'></SUP>

Yep, about covers it, thanks!