If your brother sins

[At Peace]

How is that? The old testament is full of men repenting before God and God honoring their repentance.

In the OT men could offer a sacrifice for their sins, but it was never expected that they wouldn't sin again.
In the NT we are given the opportunity to kill the flesh and be reborn of God's seed.
God's seed cannot bring forth evil fruit.

The gift if repentance comes from God and those of the Old Testament were given the chance to repent and many saw this and did.

They were given the chance to offer sacrifices for their sins.
Can you provide a verse saying God offered repentance to the OT Jews?
Before John the Baptist, that is.
That might make for a good new thread...

 

[At Peace]

What is it that you are saying here concerning what I said here
"The power or dominion of sin has been broken, destroyed and defeated over a believer.
It's all done through growth and any one who thinks different is only fooling themselves".

You offer two "ways" of conquest; one that the power of sin has been destroyed, and one that says we have to spend the time growing into victory.
I hope you can see a difference.

It seems as if you are confusing that the stronghold of sin has been broken and one now can overcome sin with its automatically done away with.

Isn't that what you just wrote?
If we are reborn of God's seed, we cannot bring forth evil fruit. (1 John 3:9)
Are you opining that our rebirth also "takes time"?

 

[Gabriel Kinson]

I thought of Ezekiel 18:21-23

"But if a wicked person turns away from all the sins they have committed and keeps all my decrees and does what is just and right, that person will surely live; they will not die. None of the offenses they have committed will be remembered against them. Because of the righteous things they have done, they will live. Do I take any pleasure in the death of the wicked? declares the Sovereign Lord. Rather, am I not pleased when they turn from their ways and live?"

 

[At Peace]

No bro that's signs of Flesh.

Not really, though in some cases it may be.
It is written..."Moreover if thy brother shall trespass against thee, go and tell him his fault between thee and him alone: if he shall hear thee, thou hast gained thy brother." (Matt 18:15)
Though this format isn't exactly a face to face arena, I feel it qualifies as meeting the above verse's intent.

 

[At Peace]

It's not cut and dry like that.
One can honestly turn from a sin and get tripped up again and again until they have overcome it.

More sin just manifests that the former "repentance" was false.

There is nothing in there that says their repentance was not genuine.

I'm not sure of what "there" you write of.??

Example,
Walking in Love and Forgiveness .
An employee goes to work and strives for excellence in their work.
A foreman does not like the guy because he does not drink and hang out with them and constantly causes problems and makes up lies about the employee.

The employee repents and and forgives and the foreman keeps up and the employee gets pushed hard and spouts off.[/QUOTE]
What does the employee repent of before spouting off?

He then repents ask for.forgiveness and prays and walks in Love.

If this repentance holds true, it will be the first real repentance from sin that the man had.
It is his start of a walk in the light.

This does not say his repentance was not genuine but it does say he is growing and walking in obedience to God's Word and God Will Be Pleased With Him.
Blessings to you

Your description of repentance is different from the bible's.
It is written..."For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of: but the sorrow of the world worketh death." (2 Cor 7:10)
You ascribe repentance to one who actually repented of their repentance.
If the sorrow for previous sin had been real, they wouldn't have sinned again.

Again, we are working with hypotheticals.
So wouldn't the sin indicate that the employee was not a child of God...relative to 1 John 3:8-10 ?

 

[At Peace]

I thought of Ezekiel 18:21-23

"But if a wicked person turns away from all the sins they have committed and keeps all my decrees and does what is just and right, that person will surely live; they will not die. None of the offenses they have committed will be remembered against them. Because of the righteous things they have done, they will live. Do I take any pleasure in the death of the wicked? declares the Sovereign Lord. Rather, am I not pleased when they turn from their ways and live?"

Good catch!
Though this makes no mention of "repentance" precisely, it does address the heart of the matter.
Still, men of the OT had not been given the ability to be circumcised in their hearts, so could not maintain a walk in the Spirit.
We should also include this scripture concerning "false" repentances...
"But when the righteous turneth away from his righteousness, and committeth iniquity, and doeth according to all the abominations that the wicked man doeth, shall he live? All his righteousness that he hath done shall not be mentioned: in his trespass that he hath trespassed, and in his sin that he hath sinned, in them shall he die." (Eze 18:24)
The same hold true today.

 

[Wired 4 Fishen]

They were given the chance to offer sacrifices for their sins.
Can you provide a verse saying God offered repentance to the OT Jews?
Before John the Baptist, that is.
That might make for a good new thread...

Here are two
2 Samuel 12
David did some serious repentance and God honored it.

2 kings 20
Hezekiah also did some serious repenting.
In both cases it was the gift of repentence.

 

[Wired 4 Fishen]

Your description of repentance is different from the bible's.
It is written..."For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of: but the sorrow of the world worketh death." (2 Cor 7:10)
You ascribe repentance to one who actually repented of their repentance.
If the sorrow for previous sin had been real, they wouldn't have sinned again.

Again, we are working with hypotheticals.
So wouldn't the sin indicate that the employee was not a child of God...relative to 1 John 3:8-10 ?

This makes no sense at all.
repented of their repentance.
I have not said anything of the sort .


Blessings to you

 

[Wired 4 Fishen]

If the sorrow for previous sin had been real, they wouldn't have sinned again.

So by this then are you saying once you yourself had repented then you never sinned again?

Scripture tells us the Power of sin over us has been broken.
This means we can overcome sin.

This does not say if we truly repent we can't sin again.
If it were as you say then every born again believer would be Spiritual giants.

Scripture talks about willfully sinning which means one knows better but does not care.
That is totally different from one learning to overcome any Ares of their life and misses the mark and repents and tries again.

We learn to walk in the Spirit and over come the flesh.

Scripture tells us to walk in the Spirit and we won't gratify the flesh.

This to is a learning process.
It takes time for a new Christian to learn how to do so.

Blessings

 

[Wired 4 Fishen]

Not really, though in some cases it may be.
It is written..."Moreover if thy brother shall trespass against thee, go and tell him his fault between thee and him alone: if he shall hear thee, thou hast gained thy brother." (Matt 18:15)
Though this format isn't exactly a face to face arena, I feel it qualifies as meeting the above verse's intent.

When some one is pointing out faults in others, is not walking in love nor come close to Matthew 18:15

You use scripture stating If A Brother Sins Against you up against one who finds fault with those who disagree with him and falsely accuses them and speaks wrongly about them.

How can that be?
My guess is that you did not read what the quote was too that you quoted and replied to.
I mean That's the only reason I can think of that would have you say that its the same thing.

I believe you know better then that.
Blessings

 

[Gabriel Kinson]

I just remembered the story of Hezekiah's son Manasseh, who repented after being taken into captivity. Keep in mind, he was one of the most evil kings Judah ever had. God restored him and he had a complete change of character from his former self.

 

[At Peace]

This makes no sense at all.
repented of their repentance.
I have not said anything of the sort .
Blessings to you

If a man turns from sin, (repents of sin), and then "turns back" to sin, he has repented of his repentance from sin.
That in no wise manifests that one has been reborn of God's seed. (1 John 3:9)

 

[Wired 4 Fishen]

If a man turns from sin, (repents of sin), and then "turns back" to sin, he has repented of his repentance from sin.
That in no wise manifests that one has been reborn of God's seed. (1 John 3:9)

Again you are confusing scripture.

1John3:9
This is referring to one who knows not to but does it anyway.

One does not care
One wants to anyway
Willfully or on Purpose.

That has no bearing on a believer learning to walk upright in Christ.

One may miss the mark 50 times in a day and truly be repetitive as one learns to walk in the spirit and God will hold nothing against them.

Blessings

 

[At Peace]

Here are two
2 Samuel 12
David did some serious repentance and God honored it.

I didn't see the word "repent" in that chapter.
I do see an admission of sin, and read of the Lord's having "put away thy sin".
But I see nothing of David vowing never to sin again.

2 kings 20
Hezekiah also did some serious repenting.
In both cases it was the gift of repentence.

What did Hezekiah repent of?
In the third verse of that chapter we see..."I beseech thee, O Lord, remember now how I have walked before thee in truth and with a perfect heart, and have done that which is good in thy sight." (2 Kings 20:3)
God both healed him and extended his life 15 years.

Your definition of "repent" must surely be different than the bible's, so what is your definition?

 

[B-A-C]

I didn't see the word "repent" in that chapter.
I do see an admission of sin, and read of the Lord's having "put away thy sin".
But I see nothing of David vowing never to sin again.

David's writing of repentance concerning Bathsheba was in Psalm 51. I don't see the words "repent" or "repentance"
here either, but I think it would be difficult to refute David is "repenting" here.

 

[At Peace]

So by this then are you saying once you yourself had repented then you never sinned again?

That is correct.
My repentance from sin was real.

Scripture tells us the Power of sin over us has been broken.
This means we can overcome sin
This does not say if we truly repent we can't sin again.
If it were as you say then every born again believer would be Spiritual giants..

You are denying your own words!
Spiritual giants?
In some manner, like if compared to those who still walk in the flesh instead of in the Spirit, I guess you are correct.

Scripture talks about willfully sinning which means one knows better but does not care.
That is totally different from one learning to overcome any Ares of their life and misses the mark and repents and tries again.

I hope you realize that you are defending your "right" to commit sin.
It is written..."There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear it." (1 Cor 10:13)
Why don't you believe this?

We learn to walk in the Spirit and over come the flesh.

Romans 6:3-6 tells us how to kill the flesh, by baptism into Christ's death.
If you are still trying to transform yourself, you haven't believed that God has already accomplished what you are trying to do.

Scripture tells us to walk in the Spirit and we won't gratify the flesh.

You can substitute the words "light" and "darkness" for "Spirit" and "flesh".
So obey the exhortations of Paul and remain obedient to God!

This to is a learning process.
It takes time for a new Christian to learn how to do so.

That isn't biblical...or reasonable.
How can you serve the old man?
He is dead!....(if you repented of sin and were baptized into Christ and into His death, burial, and resurrection.)

 

[At Peace]

When some one is pointing out faults in others, he is not walking in love nor come close to Matthew 18:15
You use scripture stating If A Brother Sins Against you, in the context of one who finds fault with those who disagree with him, and falsely accuses them and speaks wrongly about them.
How can that be?
My guess is that you did not read what the quote was too that you quoted and replied to.
I mean That's the only reason I can think of that would have you say that its the same thing.
I believe you know better then that.
Blessings

I reworded your post for better understanding, by me, so if I have gone too far in my correction, let me know, please.
As I was the target of the original accusation, and have actually taken no offense from it, I feel you are kinda off base for intervening.
If you have a matter against...(I can't remember who), you should deal with him personally.

 

[At Peace]

I just remembered the story of Hezekiah's son Manasseh, who repented after being taken into captivity. Keep in mind, he was one of the most evil kings Judah ever had. God restored him and he had a complete change of character from his former self.

Wouldn't that, shouldn't that be a "shadow" for our own repentance from sin?

 

[At Peace]

Again you are confusing scripture.
1John3:9
This is referring to one who knows not to but does it anyway.
One does not care
One wants to anyway
Willfully or on Purpose.
That has no bearing on a believer learning to walk upright in Christ.
One may miss the mark 50 times in a day and truly be repetitive as one learns to walk in the spirit and God will hold nothing against them.
Blessings

1 John 3:9 concerns who is, and who isn't born of God's seed.

Wouldn't "missing the mark" infer an aimed at goal?
Those whose "aim" is to please God have been given every tool necessary for the completion of that "goal".

All sin is done on purpose. (James 1:14-15)
You are insinuating that Christians don't care, will do evil anyway, and on purpose.
That isn't the people Christ died for.

 

[At Peace]

David's writing of repentance concerning Bathsheba was in Psalm 51. I don't see the words "repent" or "repentance"
here either, but I think it would be difficult to refute David is "repenting" here.

Hi BAC.
Folks of the OT could "turn from" wicked deeds, but had yet to be give the gift of repentance from ALL sin.
They couldn't yet be reborn.
That is why the Law still provided sacrifices for sins.
We don't have that...convenience(?)... anymore.
Quit committing sin, or die.