Is Rapture going to happen Before the Tribulation or After?

[The✞savior]

It makes no sense, I'm trying to get my mind into it, but I don't understand this, can somebody please explain

 

[RJ]

It makes no sense, I'm trying to get my mind into it, but I don't understand this, can somebody please explain

As in the days of Noah and Lott, Jesus will gather his church before God's wrath!

 

[Travis]

As in the days of Noah and Lott, Jesus will gather his church before God's wrath!

Amen,

Right before God pours out His wrath, he will gather his own out from amongst the world, so they do not partake in His wrath.

Genesis 7
12 And rain fell upon the earth forty days and forty nights. 13 On the very same day Noah and his sons, Shem and Ham and Japheth, and Noah's wife and the three wives of his sons with them entered the ark,
​

The exact same day that Noah and his sons got on the ark, the flooding began.

Genesis 19
16 But he lingered. So the men seized him and his wife and his two daughters by the hand, the LORD being merciful to him, and they brought him out and set him outside the city. 17 And as they brought them out, one said, "Escape for your life. Do not look back or stop anywhere in the valley. Escape to the hills, lest you be swept away." ...

22 Escape there quickly, for I can do nothing till you arrive there." Therefore the name of the city was called Zoar. 23 The sun had risen on the earth when Lot came to Zoar. 24 Then the LORD rained on Sodom and Gomorrah sulfur and fire from the LORD out of heaven.​

The moment that Lot and his daughters came to Zoar, the LORD rained on Sodom and Gomorrah sulfur and fire.

Likewise, as soon as the bride of Christ is out from among the world, God's wrath will be poured out upon it.

John 16
33 I have said these things to you, that in me you may have peace. In the world you will have tribulation. But take heart; I have overcome the world."​

We are not promised freedom from tribulation. But, we are promised freedom from the wrath of Almighty God, if we are in Christ Jesus.

Blessings,

Travis

 

[norapture]

Amen Travis , we will be kept from his day of wrath, cause no one will be able to with stand his wrath.
Cause he will utterly destroy , the ones left, on that day.

 

[The✞savior]

As in the days of Noah and Lott, Jesus will gather his church before God's wrath!

Oh my, i seriously tough it was after the Tribulation, I'm going to Pray about this, because i fell like i'm backsliding from jests a little bit

 

[The✞savior]

Also after the Rapture can you still be safe, even if you didn't take the mark of the beast

 

[norapture]

I also believe it is after tribulation, just before his wrath.
I do not believe the tribulation, is Gods wrath.
Just like the Egypt, many plagues
took place, but Gods people was still in Egypt.
But when they went out by the Red Sea, and crossed over.
Then Gods wrath fell on pharaoh, and his men (the wicked )
The Red Sea destroyed, them all.
Just like Lot, the same day Lot left
the cities, it rained hellfire, and destroyed the wicked.
Just like in the days of Noah, the same day Noah entered the ark
The flood came and destroyed the wicked
And when the Church leaves, Gods wrath will destroy the wicked, the same day, no one can stand in his wrath, he will destroy all the wicked in one day
See most believe the plagues, in Revelation is the wrath.
But we see his people, sealed in Revelation, for they will not receive of the plagues.
Just like in Egypt, with Moses, and Pharaoh.
But they suffer Pharaoh's wrath, and the Church , will suffer Satan's
wrath, and many be killed

 

[just-a-servant]

I also believe it is after tribulation, just before his wrath.
I do not believe the tribulation, is Gods wrath.
Just like the Egypt, many plagues
took place, but Gods people was still in Egypt.
But when they went out by the Red Sea, and crossed over.
Then Gods wrath fell on pharaoh, and his men (the wicked )
The Red Sea destroyed, them all.
Just like Lot, the same day Lot left
the cities, it rained hellfire, and destroyed the wicked.
Just like in the days of Noah, the same day Noah entered the ark
The flood came and destroyed the wicked
And when the Church leaves, Gods wrath will destroy the wicked, the same day, no one can stand in his wrath, he will destroy all the wicked in one day
See most believe the plagues, in Revelation is the wrath.
But we see his people, sealed in Revelation, for they will not receive of the plagues.
Just like in Egypt, with Moses, and Pharaoh.
But they suffer Pharaoh's wrath, and the Church , will suffer Satan's
wrath, and many be killed

I agree. We will see tribulation, but not wrath. They are two distinct and different things.

IMHO,
just-a-servant

 

[savedtoserve]

Before,or after we just need to keep looking up and keep ourselves in complete obedience to God , I give grateful thanks that Christ's church WILL BE taken up to dwell with our Saviour Jesus for ever.
Believe in Christ, repent of sin and ask forgiveness of Jesus and follow Him as He leads and you will be with Him in Glory. Thank you Jesus for Salvation thank you for being my life

 

[The✞savior]

Before,or after we just need to keep looking up and keep ourselves in complete obedience to God , I give grateful thanks that Christ's church WILL BE taken up to dwell with our Saviour Jesus for ever.
Believe in Christ, repent of sin and ask forgiveness of Jesus and follow Him as He leads and you will be with Him in Glory. Thank you Jesus for Salvation thank you for being my life

I recommend Daily repentance even if we didn't do anything wrong

 

[Travis]

even if we didn't do anything wrong

If you can accomplish that, let me know how you did so. Cause that sounds about in the realm of impossibility =D

 

[Dovegiven]

I also believe it is after tribulation, just before his wrath.
I do not believe the tribulation, is Gods wrath.
Just like the Egypt, many plagues
took place, but Gods people was still in Egypt.
But when they went out by the Red Sea, and crossed over.
Then Gods wrath fell on pharaoh, and his men (the wicked )
The Red Sea destroyed, them all.
Just like Lot, the same day Lot left
the cities, it rained hellfire, and destroyed the wicked.
Just like in the days of Noah, the same day Noah entered the ark
The flood came and destroyed the wicked
And when the Church leaves, Gods wrath will destroy the wicked, the same day, no one can stand in his wrath, he will destroy all the wicked in one day
See most believe the plagues, in Revelation is the wrath.
But we see his people, sealed in Revelation, for they will not receive of the plagues.
Just like in Egypt, with Moses, and Pharaoh.
But they suffer Pharaoh's wrath, and the Church , will suffer Satan's
wrath, and many be killed

Why would Jesus have the surviving Church rise to meet him in the air only to continue back down with him? The scriptures do say his saints will accompany him, but what purpose in makig much of us rising moments before his landing at Jerusalem?

I do not believe the tribulation, is Gods wrath.
Just like the Egypt, many plagues
took place, but Gods people was still in Egypt.

While the deaths of the first born was still underway, Israel escaped in the night. They didn't hang around for the calamity, but left after taking the passover meal. That would put us looking at possibly "Mid Trib" at the latest.

[QOTE]But when they went out by the Red Sea, and crossed over.
Then Gods wrath fell on pharaoh, and his men (the wicked )
The Red Sea destroyed, them all.[/QUOTE]
But not before Israel was safely on the other side.

Just like in the days of Noah, the same day Noah entered the ark
The flood came and destroyed the wicked

Noah and family were inside the ark before the destruction, riding above and over the flood to safety after it.

The account of wrath poured out in Revelation is absolutely terrible. Those not killed are starved or die from lack of water, this alone killing off a third of earth's population Revelation 8:10-11 (KJV)
10 And the third angel sounded, and there fell a great star from heaven, burning as it were a lamp, and it fell upon the third part of the rivers, and upon the fountains of waters;
11 And the name of the star is called Wormwood: and the third part of the waters became wormwood; and many men died of the waters, because they were made bitter.
There are enough plagues in that book to kill off most people. There's no mention of God protecting the Church. He will retain a remnant of the tribes Israel for his glory after the tribulation, the Church already safely harbored with Jesus until he returns. What we don't know is who the angels will collect to escape that, no doubt many hoping they will.... won't.
Today is the day of salvation. We have the rest of today to settle that with the Lord. Every new day we wake up to ought to have us making certain or redemption is not just based on hope. I hear it all the time even in the churches. "Well, of course we can't know we'll make it, but I sure hope I will." ******* BULLETIN******** Yes, we had better know for sure. Otherwise it would be like someone wanting to cross the ocean on a ship. "I don't know whether I have a ticket for passage or not, but I sure hope I sail with that ship!"

 

[RJ]

Oh my, i seriously tough it was after the Tribulation, I'm going to Pray about this, because i fell like i'm backsliding from jests a little bit

• backsliding from Jesus? Why?
• Why would God not spare his church from the great Tribulation?

 

[Travis]

Why would Jesus have the surviving Church rise to meet him in the air only to continue back down with him? The scriptures do say his saints will accompany him, but what purpose in makig much of us rising moments before his landing at Jerusalem?

That question can be turned back around just the same. If Jesus is just taking us up to heaven, why not just translate us straight there? Why come all the way down to earth to gather us into the air, and then go back to heaven? Kind of pointless if one is not going to stick around after coming all that way.

Acts 1
10 And while they were gazing into heaven as he went, behold, two men stood by them in white robes, 11 and said, "Men of Galilee, why do you stand looking into heaven? This Jesus, who was taken up from you into heaven, will come in the same way as you saw him go into heaven."​

When Jesus comes back, hes going to come down the same way he went up.

Zechariah 14
1 Behold, a day is coming for the LORD, when the spoil taken from you will be divided in your midst. 2 For I will gather all the nations against Jerusalem to battle, and the city shall be taken and the houses plundered and the women raped. Half of the city shall go out into exile, but the rest of the people shall not be cut off from the city. 3 Then the LORD will go out and fight against those nations as when he fights on a day of battle. 4 On that day his feet shall stand on the Mount of Olives that lies before Jerusalem on the east, and the Mount of Olives shall be split in two from east to west by a very wide valley, so that one half of the Mount shall move northward, and the other half southward. 5 And you shall flee to the valley of my mountains, for the valley of the mountains shall reach to Azal. And you shall flee as you fled from the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah. Then the LORD my God will come, and all the holy ones with him. 6 On that day there shall be no light, cold, or frost. 7 And there shall be a unique day, which is known to the LORD, neither day nor night, but at evening time there shall be light. 8 On that day living waters shall flow out from Jerusalem, half of them to the eastern sea and half of them to the western sea. It shall continue in summer as in winter. 9 And the LORD will be king over all the earth. On that day the LORD will be one and his name one.
​

Blessings,

Travis

 

[RJ]

We are not promised freedom from tribulation. But, we are promised freedom from the wrath of Almighty God, if we are in Christ Jesus.

No freedom from day to day tribulation in our life but freedom from the "Great Tribulation", absolutely!:thumbsup:

 

[norapture]

Dove may I ask which resurrection, that you will be raised at, if you die before the Lord returns?
Cause in Revelation 20:4
It says the ones that was beheaded, cause they didn't
worship the beast, neither his image, neither received his mark
Lived and reigned with Christ a
1000 years
Verse 5 says that this is the first resurrection
Verse 6 says Blessed and holy is
he that has part in the first
resurrection, that they reign with
him 1000 years

Sounds like to me these in verse 4
Went threw the tribulation, and
didn't worship the beast, and some
got beheaded(killed) but got
resurrected in the first
resurrection.
And if this is the first resurrection, which according to scripture it is.
How does all believers get
resurrected, before the first
resurrection?

 

[Eric E Stahl]

In 2 Thessalonians 2:6-12 we are told that the mystery of iniquity is restrained by he (A person) who letteth (controls or restrains) until he is taken away. He is the Comforter or Holy Spirit who will reprove the world of sin and righteousness and judgment see John 16:7-8. Since the Holy Spirit will never leave us (a born again Christian) nor forsake us, when he is taken away we are taken to heaven with him. We call this the rapture of the saints. After the rapture God begins to judge the people of earth. The first judgment is God sending strong delusion to everyone that heard the truth of the gospel of Jesus and received not the truth or Jesus. Those people will be caused to believe the lie of the antichrist and follow him.

The first seal judgment is the beginning of wrath. The believers are taken to heaven before the antichrist is given his crown by God.

 

[norapture]

Eric how does a man, that does not have the Holy Ghost, not take the mark, or worship the beast?
By his on power?
Even Peter denied the Lord 3 times, before he got the Holy Ghost.
So what keeps those in Revelation 20 from worshiping the beast , so much they will die first.
Nowhere in scripture, does it say the Holy Ghost goes to heaven.
Do you not no that the Holy Ghost , is Christ in you, the hope of glory.
And Jesus Christ said in Matthew, I will be with you even until , the END of the WORLD

 

[Dovegiven]

Dove may I ask which resurrection, that you will be raised at, if you die before the Lord returns?
Cause in Revelation 20:4 It says the ones that was beheaded, cause they didn't
worship the beast, neither his image, neither received his markLived and reigned with Christ a 1000 years
Verse 5 says that this is the first resurrection
Verse 6 says Blessed and holy is he that has part in the firstresurrection, that they reign withhim1000 years

Sounds like to me these in verse 4 Went threw the tribulation, and didn't worship the beast, and somegot beheaded(killed) but got resurrected in the first resurrection. And if this is the first resurrection, which according to scripture it is.
How does all believers get resurrected, before the first resurrection?

This really needs a couple hour lesson to answer properly, but I'll give you the shortest answer I think is possible. You need to go read and study the chapters I refer to to get more understanding. If you are using a good study reference Bible yu will find links to more background.

There are two major resurrections.
Let's move the second resurrection out of our way. The second resurrection is of the irreconcilable wicked dead 1,000 after the tribulation, at the judgment seat of God. No Christians will be present for that.They will remain in hell until that time, their bodies resting in the dust from which we all come, then all the lost from Adam's time until then will be raised to their feet, in their restored bodies, with their soul and spirit intact, full memories restored.

The first resurrection begins with that of Jesus from the grave, the First Resurrection consisting of phases that end the moment of his Second Coming at the end of the tribulation. All stages of that apply only to the righteous old testament saints, and to all the dead in Christ, and all those alive in Christ and taken up alive in the rapture before the tribulation.

Jesus was first fruit, resurrected by the power of God.
Immediately after Jesus arose came a small resurrection that is quite significant. It stands as a confirmed hope (a TYPE) of us saints knowing we have our own resurrection as Jesus promised. We can hang our hope on a fact of that possibility.
Matthew 27:50-53 (KJV)
50 Jesus, when he had cried again with a loud voice, yielded up the ghost.
51 And, behold, the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom; and the earth did quake, and the rocks rent;
52 And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose,
53 And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.

They are the friends of God from the beginning, some listed in Hebrews 11. They were in the old testament situation of all dead spirits with souls inhabiting Sheol, divided into two sections, the pit for the wicked, and Paradise as Jesus put it in the upper section below earth's surface. They had not received the Promise of the Spirit. When Jesus began his days and nights in death, part of that time he enered Paradise, preached his gospel to them, then led Captivity out, and up through their graves.
Ephesians 4:8-10 (KJV)
8 Wherefore he saith, When he ascended up on high, he led captivity captive, and gave gifts unto men.
9 (Now that he ascended, what is it but that he also descended first into the lower parts of the earth?
10 He that descended is the same also that ascended up far above all heavens, that he might fill all things.)

Some say that applied to the Ascension of Jesus taking saints up with him. There is no record of that in Mark 16:19. Angels do the harvesting. Jesus ascended alone into the clouds. He visited the hell he made, not fearing that his soul would be left there in corruption, to rescue people held there that were due to be rescued, having no prior provision to qualify for Heaven, but righteous enough to be held over to hear the gospel from Jesus. Jesus 'covered all the bases'.

A second resurrection phase is our spiritual one. We are dead to sin from analogy of being crucified with him, buried, then raised to new life. Nothing about that has to do with the physical body. It is ongoing.
1 Corinthians 15:20-24 (KJV)
20 But now is Christ risen from the dead, and become the firstfruits of them that slept.
21 For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead.
22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.
23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming.
24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power.

The scriptures use the TYPE of the original OT field harvest sequence, God having set patterns for people to know how he does things. The main harvest (First Fruits) was collected from most of the crops before the feasts. The next step was to leave some crops in the field for the poor and needy to glean (the Gleaning). In the New Covenant the Gleaning translates to souls harvested during the Church season which is ended when Jesus appears in the clouds to receive those souls, dead and buried, and still alive alike. When he makes that appearance we are said to be with him in the clouds, not in Heaven. We'll return to earth with him at the end of the tribulation. So while the primary First Fruit harvest is in storage off season, the fields are gleaned, then nothing is left in nature for the poor and needy depending on gleanings. God takes care of them (us). He does that with what we have termed the Rapture. Enoch and Elijah were raptured alive, not yet dead and buried, so there is a precedent.
John 5:28-30 (KJV)
28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,
29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.
30 I can of mine own self do nothing: as I hear, I judge: and my judgment is just; because I seek not mine own will, but the will of the Father which hath sent me.

The Church is taken off earth before world-wide wrath of unimaginable horror unfolds. We are not appointed to God's wrath. That's why it's important to be part of the First resurrection before then. Blessed are they who do.
1 Thessalonians 4:14-18 (KJV)
14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.
15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.
16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
18 Wherefore comfort one another with these words.

Once all the children of God in Christ are taken out of the way of God's wrath upon the disobedient, the wrath of God proceeds. Yet, in the world there will be some who will not serve Antichrist, but will devote to Jesus, but at the cost of martyrdom, heads removed.
During the tribulation many will die who at last believe the gospel, possibly preached by preachers that know the way, but had not taken it to heart in time to escape the terror. The internet will be full of answers those inhabitants of earth need to understand what happened to them. Their dead bodies may well not be buried, left in heaps to rot, but when Jesus comes for his Second Coming, he will resurrect them just like he did in the rapture before the tribulation. Until he sets foot in Jerusalem to reign, their souls will be kept with him those months and days, which John saw in Rev. 20:4, who will be equally qualified to rule and reign with Jesus as will be the saints of the raptured Church. When they are resurrected, that marks the end of the First Resurrection. There is no other until 1,000 years later when only the damned are raised up out of the dusts of the earth.

Some Christians say they are not worried about going through the tribulation. It's a lot easier to say on this side of it that we would keep our faith intact while the executioner is about to behead a believer.

Rather than put that up to a last minute final decision, make sure (certain) your salvation today, and enjoy a well founded hope of rescue like Noah and his family enjoyed.

 

[Dovegiven]

Eric how does a man, that does not have the Holy Ghost, not take the mark, or worship the beast?
By his on power?
Even Peter denied the Lord 3 times, before he got the Holy Ghost.
So what keeps those in Revelation 20 from worshiping the beast , so much they will die first.
Nowhere in scripture, does it say the Holy Ghost goes to heaven.
Do you not no that the Holy Ghost , is Christ in you, the hope of glory.
And Jesus Christ said in Matthew, I will be with you even until , the END of the WORLD

There is nothing to verify the Holy Spirit returns to Heaven at any time. The pattern is for the Holy Spirit to always be with earth, as in the beginning before there was a creation. It doesn't say in Genesis he was on earth, but hovering over it. He is "taken out of the way" in the sense of no longer having significant business with man so as not to interfere with the wrath being poured out. Men will be on their own completely, but some will become Christians even in that wrath, not fearing death, and will be sealed like us here are sealed, in their case but for a matter of days compared to our years, at least 7 from now, or less if it's true the Antichrist is already exercising his 8 year reign. We won't be here to know for sure who it is.