Is The Life of The Soul Eternal ?

[Butch5]

Hello there,

I have just read a post by a brother in Christ, who states that the soul is eternal. Rather than derail the thread in which it was posted I thought it best to start a new thread, in order for this subject to be discussed. For I do not believe that the Scriptures testify that the soul is eternal (ie., immortal): for example in Ezekiel 18:4, God says:- 'Behold, all souls are mine; as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is mine: the soul that sinneth, it shall die.'

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

I think many believe the soul is eternal because of a misunderstanding of what the soul is. A study through the Bible of the word soul will clearly show that the soul is one's life. It's a living being. In Scriputre the word soul is used two ways, concretely it is a living being. When used abstractly it speaks of life itself. In either case it is directly tide to physical life.

 

[Butch5]

Greetings Chris,

for starters, are 'eternal' and 'immortal' the same 'thing'?

Also, i suppose your title,
Is The Life of The Soul Eternal ?
begs the question, what is the 'life of the soul' and can we determine that in a straightforward way from Scripture - ie without too much 'presumption' and some definite Biblical quotes, etc.

Thank you for starting this thread.


Bless you ....><>

Hi Br. Bear,

I believe we can. We just need a starting point.

 

[Butch5]

Greetings Brother,

it is generally considered to be from Genesis 2:7
And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.

Interesting to note that The LORD God breathed into his nostrils and in John 20:22 we read:
And when He (Jesus) had said this, He breathed on them, and saith unto them, Receive ye the Holy Ghost:


Bless you ....><>

That's a good point. What I see from this is that this spirit, in both cases, is something of God Himself.

 

[Butch5]

'And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground,
and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life;
and man became a living soul.'
(Gen 2:7)

Hello @Br. Bear,

Forgive me for not responding earlier,

No, the words 'eternal' and 'immortal' are not the same, I agree. Perhaps I should have asked, 'Is The Soul Immortal?' For that is how I wished the subject heading to be understood.

If we take Genesis 2:7 as our guide in regard to the question you posed, 'What is the life of the soul?' Then man (Adam) became a living soul when God breathed into His nostrils the breath of life: and we know from Ecclesiastes 12:7 that the spirit (ie.., the breath of life) goes back to God at death, and therefore man must then cease to be a living soul.

'The Spirit of God hath made me,
and the breath of the Almighty
hath given me life.'
(Job 33:4)

'Remember, I beseech Thee,
that Thou hast made me as the clay;
and wilt Thou bring me into dust again?
(Job 10:9)

Thank you.
In Christ Jesus
Chris

Hi Chris,

That's an easy one to answer. Paul says the Father alone has immortality .

 

[Butch5]

@complete
Greetings Chris,




what then do we do with passages from the Bible such as those B-A-C @B-A-C shared? Somehow they all need to 'fit together' in order for the 'doctrine' to be sound.




Bless you ....><>

Hi Br. Bear,

All of those passages are easily understood for the point of view @complhas expressed. We just have to consider our presuppositions.

 

[complete]

@complete
Greetings Chris,

what then do we do with passages from the Bible such as those B-A-C @B-A-C shared? Somehow they all need to 'fit together' in order for the 'doctrine' to be sound.

Bless you ....><>

Hello @Br. Bear,

Thank you for responding.

I believe I have addressed the references given by @B-A-C: but if there are others that he feels he would like to bring forward I would be glad to consider them. Yet, if we cannot agree that death means the absence of life: in which the faculties associated with living no longer operate, such as consciousness, sight, hearing, feeling, thinking, talking, then we will never resolve this. For in order for someone to experience torment, then they have to be alive. In death there is no consciousness, no sensory ability, for life is extinct.

I believe that the Scriptures give ample evidence that death means the absence of life, and therefore consciousness: so the possibility of Hell being a place of eternal conscious punishment for the unbelieving dead, is not something that can possibly be true. And that the second death, for mortal man, must mean destruction, for again death is the absence of life and therefore consciousness, so the possibility of torment taking place following that death is not possible either.

I believe that hell is the place of the dead, whether it be the grave, or the fires of end time destruction: and that the soul is the whole person, body and spirit combined, making a living soul, and that the soul that sinneth it shall surely die: and as all have sinned and come short of the glory of God, then all die. Only by believing on the Lord Jesus Christ as Saviour and Lord can there be any hope of life everlasting: for it is a gift of God given to those who so believe, and experienced in resurrection, and not before.

Within the love of Christ our Saviour,
Chris

 

[Born Again 2004]

So , you eventually find "The Doctrine " not sound in your mind...then what ?

 

[Brother Paul]

It is interesting the Bible separates the soul from the spirit.

1Thes 5:23; Now may the God of peace Himself sanctify you entirely; and may your spirit and soul and body be preserved complete, without blame at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.
Heb 4:12; For the word of God is living and active and sharper than any two-edged sword, and piercing as far as the division of soul and spirit, of both joints and marrow, and able to judge the thoughts and intentions of the heart.

1Cor 15:45; So also it is written, "The first MAN, Adam, BECAME A LIVING SOUL." The last Adam became a life-giving spirit.

( It says "it is written", but I'm not sure where this was written in the OT )

Matt 10:28; "Do not fear those who kill the body but are unable to kill the soul; but rather fear Him who is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.

Now while the soul may be able to die ( be destroyed ) it seems the spirit is never destroyed.

It seems some souls will be preserved.

Heb 10:39; But we are not of those who shrink back to destruction, but of those who have faith to the preserving of the soul.
Jas 5:20; let him know that he who turns a sinner from the error of his way will save his soul from death and will cover a multitude of sins.

If we go back to to 1 Cor 15 for a moment.

1Cor 15:44; it is sown a natural body, it is raised a spiritual body. If there is a natural body, there is also a spiritual body.
1Cor 15:45; So also it is written, "The first MAN, Adam, BECAME A LIVING SOUL." The last Adam became a life-giving spirit.
1Cor 15:46; However, the spiritual is not first, but the natural; then the spiritual.
1Cor 15:47; The first man is from the earth, earthy; the second man is from heaven.
1Cor 15:48; As is the earthy, so also are those who are earthy; and as is the heavenly, so also are those who are heavenly.
1Cor 15:49; Just as we have borne the image of the earthy, we will also bear the image of the heavenly.

Verse 45 says Adam was a soul, but Jesus was a life-giving spirit. Then it proceeds to say one is natural from the earth, the other is spiritual from heaven.
Verse 44 says if there was ever a natural body, there will also be a spirit. But just because everyone has a spirit, doesn't mean everyone is "alive" in the Spirit ( uppercase S ).
Your spirit is not the Holy Spirit.

We have a couple of annihilationists here on TalkJesus who seem to believe that if you aren't saved, when you die you simply cease to exist.
The Bible doesn't seem to support that.

John 5:28; "Do not marvel at this; for an hour is coming, in which all who are in the tombs will hear His voice,
John 5:29; and will come forth; those who did the good deeds to a resurrection of life, those who committed the evil deeds to a resurrection of judgment.

Acts 24:15; having a hope in God, which these men cherish themselves, that there shall certainly be a resurrection of both the righteous and the wicked.

Even the wicked are resurrected. They will face the judgment. But even then they won't "die". ( as in cease to exist )

Rev 14:9; Then another angel, a third one, followed them, saying with a loud voice, "If anyone worships the beast and his image, and receives a mark on his forehead or on his hand,
Rev 14:10; he also will drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is mixed in full strength in the cup of His anger; and he will be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels and in the presence of the Lamb.
Rev 14:11; "And the smoke of their torment goes up forever and ever; they have no rest day and night, those who worship the beast and his image, and whoever receives the mark of his name."

Rev 20:10; And the devil who deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are also; and they will be tormented day and night forever and ever

Matt 25:46; "These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life."

Mark 9:43; "If your hand causes you to stumble, cut it off; it is better for you to enter life crippled, than, having your two hands, to go into hell, into the unquenchable fire
Mark 9:48; where THEIR WORM DOES NOT DIE, AND THE FIRE IS NOT QUENCHED.

The word "soul" as translated can refer to that animation force (bios life) usually associated with having awareness, the ability to choose, the ability to emote or feel, etc. but it is often used interchangeably with the idea of an individual. This any individual person. What sets man apart is Ruah or spirit which no other animal has.

 

[complete]

The word "soul" as translated can refer to that animation force (bios life) usually associated with having awareness, the ability to choose, the ability to emote or feel, etc. but it is often used interchangeably with the idea of an individual. This any individual person. What sets man apart is Ruah or spirit which no other animal has.

Hello @Brother Paul,

It would seem by the first few verses containing reference to 'the breath of life', that the word ' Ruach' ( 'spirit' ) is used for both man and beast:-

' And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground,
and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; ( Heb. Neshamah = breath H5397 )
and man became a living soul.'
(Gen 2:7)

'And they went in unto Noah into the ark,
two and two of all flesh, wherein is the breath of life.' ( Heb.Ruach = breath H7307 )

'And all flesh died that moved upon the earth,
both of fowl, and of cattle, and of beast,
and of every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth,
and every man:
All in whose nostrils was the breath of life, ( Heb. Ruach and Neshamah [H5397 & H7307] = breath )
of all that was in the dry land, died.
(Gen 7:21-22)

' The Spirit' ( 'Ruach' - H7307 ) 'of God hath made me,
and the breath;' ( 'Neshamah ' - H5397 ) 'of the Almighty
hath given me life.'
(Job 33:4)

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[complete]

So , you eventually find "The Doctrine " not sound in your mind...then what ?

Hello @Born Again 2004,

Were you responding to me? If so what doctrine am I not finding 'sound'? And what do the words, 'then what?' refer to?

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris