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Leaving Christianity

The 'this' is the basis of this thread?
...
That this belief is true. That I am saved and that saving then also leads to a baptism in spirit, or at the very least a sense that God is there with me.. experienced or felt in some way or another.

(I hope this isn't going to turn into a line of socratic questioning, which is just a trick to make another person feel dumb?)
This is hopeless.
Dear LostButTrying,
No not hopeless, and that is the amazing wonder of Jesus. We can make ourselves feel that hopeless state, but in Jesus Christ it doesn't exist when we are focused in Him and for Him.

No socratic question here :smile:

Just trying to get to what you felt, did upon the day you came before the Lord in submission, to receive His Grace. There is a moment in time when faced with the Eternal that we realize how wanting we are of Him and the unworthiness of ourselves in being given even His attention. That we sorrow for what we have done, and then Glory in His acceptance of us anyway through His Son.

Was there such a time for you? Did you feel not just the unworthiness of yourself, but the lifting up, the uplifting/filling of your Spirit that He has smiled up you a forgiven sinner?

This the entirety of what I've written and is what can never be taken away from you!!! This is what you should, need to have. For all the Words in Scripture cannot explain what it means to feel wanting, less then nothing, and then that moment when you are more with Him then you've ever been in your life. This is your birth, your newness in life that you'd never known before. This is what can never be taken away from you and always a place of remembrance of how great a gift you were given and had opened on that faithful day!!! This is the moment of rejoicing you should have even in remembrance for even in Heaven that was the case for you on that day!!! (Luke 15:10)

Do you not remember?

Loving you in Christ Jesus.
Nick
<><
 
Was there such a time for you? Did you feel not just the unworthiness of yourself, but the lifting up, the uplifting/filling of your Spirit that He has smiled up you a forgiven sinner?
I felt the unworthiness and believed what I had heard, but no, I haven't had the lifting up.

I know I'm unworthy, but believed the promise that God would love me anyway and would forgive me because of the sacrifice Jesus made for me, made for me despite everything. I was amazed that such a thing would be possible and possible for me, but I believed in it happening...
... then it didn't.
 
What I experienced was an inner peace in my heart that hadn't been there before.

John 3:16 "For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son that who so ever believeth in Him -- will not perish, but have everlasting life."

You are part of 'the world'. And Romans 5:8 " But God demonstrates Hi own love toward us, in that while we were still sinner, Christ died for us. vs 9 Much more then, having now been justified by His blood, we shall be saved from wrath through Him. vs 10 "For if when we were enemies we were reconciled to God through he death of His son, much more, having been reconciled, we shall be saved by His life. vs 11 "And not only that, but we also rejoice in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom we have now received the reconciliation."
 
Maybe that thought about demonic oppression? But could that stand against God? I don't really understand these things... you would think I'd know more about it growing up in a family that regularly worked with demons... but I never took notice of that sort of thing.
I don't think demons and Satan have much power really.
 
@LostButTrying -- Satan's aim is to blind our eyes to his real power and that he's the greatest liar that's ever existed. Satan knows that he's doomed to spend eternity in lake of fire and brimstone and That is talked about in the end of book of Revelation. He wants as much company as he can get. And he Also knows that once a person discovers just how horrible hell really Is, they'll want 'out' and quickly. But it won't be possible.

The oppression -- satan knows us -- our internal make-up. He knows how to make 'us' ineffective As Christians. I've experienced a bit of Depression in my life -- it was Not fun. For a few weeks or so, I felt like I was in a black hole -- just wanted to curl up and sleep my way out of that inner feeling. It finallly lifted. That's Depression.

Oppression would be like what you've been experiencing. God is Stronger than satan. And there is such a thing as 'spiritual warfare'. Ephesians 6 talks about the armor of God.

IF satan can keep us busy questioning our salvation or 'waiting' for 'something', then we are sort of "on the shelf" We're not doing anything For God. And that's fine with satan. Cause he doesn't want us doing anything For God. He wants us to feel like we're in 'limbo'. And -- that's sort of where I'm at. Everyone has 'something' in their lives and I'm no exception. All of my adult life -- 46 yrs of it had been with a husband -- he was the leader. All of a sudden he's Gone. In heaven with His Savior -- but still not Here. I'm having to re-invent myself. Not easy --not very much fun. Lots of people / women in my age bracket are in the same situation. What 'we' need is lots of spiritual encouragement.

I can feel the Holy Spirit working in me. Not in a Big Bang way. But in Little , tiny things. I think that the fact that 'we' Are feeling these ways is showing that the Holy Spirit Is within us.

And, as we Do share -- other people can identify with us. No one is really Alone.

Often it's the case -- when we're living in the midst OF -- we're too busy living to see anything else. Something will happen to help us 'see' a bit better. God's Word is the answer -- and I'm reminding myself of That, Too.
 
I felt the unworthiness and believed what I had heard, but no, I haven't had the lifting up.

I know I'm unworthy, but believed the promise that God would love me anyway and would forgive me because of the sacrifice Jesus made for me, made for me despite everything. I was amazed that such a thing would be possible and possible for me, but I believed in it happening...
... then it didn't.
So you did feel it!!!! You just don't realize it. What did you say "I was amazed..." In other words "wonder"! These are sentiments that one feels when one experiences something out of the ordinary! Do a search in Scripture on those words and see what you get.

What exactly were you looking for when you repented? Some truly out of this world experience? Everyone who truly repents and comes to the Lord feels/experiences something, which you did! I've always believed that no two are alike in this. Some believe that they must have a "Damascus Road" experience for it to be real, or to start speaking in tongues. It doesn't have to be that way and in many cases it is not.

It can be just as simple as feeling a peace come upon you, or a joy, or as you yourself have said, an "Amazement"!!! When we start to dissect this experience or even compare it to others. We are actually chipping away at what God has given us each personally and the reality by doing so, makes it only less in only our own minds!

Sadly, humanity is all about comparisons, and the need to have that uniqueness, but when they actually receive it, they can barely recognize it and when they do, they diminish it, for want or expectations of something more. Those Heavenly experiences may still await you, but know this. In Christ Jesus you will experience, if not in this life, surely upon the moment of our last breath something so amazing that anything else will be as if it never happend. What did Paul say "To be absent in the Body is to be present with the Lord"? Brother, don't you realize that in Christ Jesus we have Eternity and what awaits us is so much more then what we can quantify at this moment in time, in the temporal bodies we now reside in?

So, I ask you again. What were you expecting? :smile:

If you are even after reading this feeling doubtful. Then rededicate yourself! Go to the Alter in a Church and on bent knees or in your room, or even in the middle of field somewhere...probably kinda cool & wet in the UK now a days, but still. Do this and bring it before God. Speak from your heart, and let your Spirit cry out to Him. Folks in UK aren't much for the emotions, unless they're knocking down a pint. But, do it and know for sure. He is there and He is listening. In Christ you will know that no self made or other stronghold can stand against the power of God! What did the man seeking healing for his child tell Jesus in tears? "I believe, Help my unbelief!!"

With the Love of Christ Jesus, I'll continue to be praying for you.
YBIC
Nick
<><
 
So you did feel it!!!!
No, I felt the excitement that it would happen, the expectation, the relief you feel when you get to the bus stop in good time for bus to turn up... 'great, I've made it'... then, the bus is late, so you keep waiting, all the time thinking, 'It's sure to be here soon.' Then it slowly dawns on you. 'it's not coming.'
It's not coming!
Then your heart sinks and everything turns to ash. 'It was never coming.'
I never experienced the Holy Spirit, I experienced the excitement that I might experience it, that it was coming, it never came.
Please stop trying to tell me it has, if it had it would be undeniable, even if it subtle, it would have changed me in some way forever.
Do you really imagine I haven't prayed, that I haven't knelt before before the altar holding my arms wide for Jesus.
Maybe as you say, the true value of my belief won't be experienced until I stand before God.

I can tell myself that... I think you are right, I think I've always known you are right. It isn't necessary that I will experience some change. If I truly believe then that doesn't matter. So it must be that I have not truly believed. I've only fooled myself. Satan fooled me into thinking I believed when I didn't.
So I am left with this... I am not a believer, I don't have faith, It's over for me.
I'm going to stop now. I'm sorry.
 
No, I felt the excitement that it would happen, the expectation, the relief you feel when you get to the bus stop in good time for bus to turn up... 'great, I've made it'... then, the bus is late, so you keep waiting, all the time thinking, 'It's sure to be here soon.' Then it slowly dawns on you. 'it's not coming.'
It's not coming!
Then your heart sinks and everything turns to ash. 'It was never coming.'
I never experienced the Holy Spirit, I experienced the excitement that I might experience it, that it was coming, it never came.
Please stop trying to tell me it has, if it had it would be undeniable, even if it subtle, it would have changed me in some way forever.
Do you really imagine I haven't prayed, that I haven't knelt before before the altar holding my arms wide for Jesus.
Maybe as you say, the true value of my belief won't be experienced until I stand before God.

I can tell myself that... I think you are right, I think I've always known you are right. It isn't necessary that I will experience some change. If I truly believe then that doesn't matter. So it must be that I have not truly believed. I've only fooled myself. Satan fooled me into thinking I believed when I didn't.
So I am left with this... I am not a believer, I don't have faith, It's over for me.
I'm going to stop now. I'm sorry.
Dear Brother,
And I believe this to be true. No, don't be sorry and don't give up. That is exactly what the Adversary wants you to do.
God knows on whether you believe on whatever day you confessed and repented. I sought for your sake for you to know of that one moment in time whereby you did this. That you may have done this over and over again is not the point. Why? Because what you must always remember that no matter what you do (works), or expect (supernatural experience), that Salvation is by God's Grace in Jesus Christ. You may know the below verses, and realizing the truth of them is necessary for you to have the peace and stop the conflict you are experiencing.

For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; [it is] the gift of God, not of works, lest anyone should boast. For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand that we should walk in them. Ephesians 2:8-10

That you are tying up the Supernatural experience with your Salvation will never work, and will draw you no closer to being at peace with the knowledge of God's Grace working in your life.

Here's a devotional for you to read that touches on the Holy Spirit, by a Sister in Christ.

I will continue to pray for you Brother, and as I said before. I believe this to be true. Don't give up on the most precious gift ever given.
With the Love of Christ Jesus.
YBIC
Nick
<><
 
You are kind. You are a good person.
I can't anymore.
Yes you can and the Spirit of God will help you do so.

Don't give up on Him, because He will never cast you aside or desert you even though it may not appear that way now. I know the flesh is weak. A battle faced everyday. Yet, it's not our victory over it, for all we are required to do is stand, because the Victory is through Jesus! I know you tire. There is an Eternal Rest that we have to look forward to. Hold on to that. For the things of the world promise you everything, and will always leave you empty longing for more in the lies it tells. Jesus offered Himself so that you might have more and is best said this way:

For all things [are] for your sakes, that grace, having spread through the many, may cause thanksgiving to abound to the glory of God. Therefore we do not lose heart. Even though our outward man is perishing, yet the inward [man] is being renewed day by day. For our light affliction, which is but for a moment, is working for us a far more exceeding [and] eternal weight of glory, while we do not look at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen. For the things which are seen [are] temporary, but the things which are not seen [are] eternal. 2 Corinthians 4:15-18

I won't give up on you, and will continue to pray for you dear friend. Many, and I include myself here, have endured trials and tribulations in this life, and even as it nears ending, we still rejoice in what awaits, for as Paul said, in 2 Timothy 12 For this reason I also suffer these things; nevertheless I am not ashamed, for I know whom I have believed and am persuaded that He is able to keep what I have committed to Him until that Day.

With the Love of Christ Jesus.
YBIC
Nick
<><
 
Firstly, I would like to thank you all for your kindness and patience with me... and for keeping faith when I was struggling. Truly, God has been working through you.
I have rediscovered my faith, and in fact found the real connection with Jesus that I have been longing for.
Jesus had spoken to me, not in words but in a way I can't put into words.... all I can say is that my world has changed and I know now that I have found the true way.
Now things make sense to me and I know the truth.
I know with a certainty that is greater than myself that the Roman Catholic Church is where true salvation lies. I was always prejudiced against the RC church, but that was Satan grappling with me. I feel like a dark cloud has lifted from me and I see the light of the true church.
Thank you all so much. God bless.
 
@LostBut Trying --- I can hardly believe what I'm reading. You Do realize that the RCC church holds to beliefs that are NOT Biblical. Most of their beliefs are not in God's Word.

What is it that the RCC teaches that you find satisfying?
 
Thank you Sue for your love and guidance. I have found the true path, my heart feels new again. That's all I can say really.
 
@LostButTrying -- the very most important you can ever find is having Jesus Christ as your personal Savior. Trust in Him. Is that what you have actually done -- placed your trust / faith in Jesus Christ?
 
Hi Sue,
Yes I have. And putting my trust in the True Faith, His Church, it's Traditions and it's Authority is what Jesus has guided me to. This is what makes Jesus most happy. I know it 100%.
 
Friend please don't be discouraged... Jesus is the only truth and according to my personal experience if u ever get distracted from his ways u will surely(100%) enter into some kind of mental problems.... This is how we are designed by him... I don't know Ur problem but don't be discouraged..
What I personally feel is that he gives more preference to faith before helping... Let me explain it...

You know a life of a God's child is "being more "than 'doing more'... He wants you to " be" more eligible for being his Child and so he is putting more and more problems so that we learn the techniques of having patience.... Here "patience" doesn't mean to wait for long time...
Here ' patience ' means not to fear your problems and have patience in the form of faith in Jesus to counterattack it .
It is to make you believe in him blindly and turn back to Ur problems and say that " How much ever great u become , my God is far more greater than you. You no longer have authority on me as I command you and Ur kingdom to get destroyed in the name of JESUS"...

What I personally feel that God wants us to know the authority given to us... Do u remember after the creation , human beings were given the authority over everything he created.. It means that everything will go as we command.. Again let me explain u..

See ,Jesus came on earth to show us a perfect example of us to stay on Earth. Hey faced many problems but do you remember he always commanded the problems to go away instead losing faith.. He never feared...
For gaining this authority we need to train our self to have the character of a faithful child like Jesus.

A real life situation: will u want someone to give u attention only in need and not in other good situations. So let not it happen will Jesus even ... Turn to him..

As a result don't loose Ur faith but be happy that your life is filled with trails and temptation for u to train u.
Looks ridiculous to hear buts that's the truth .read James chapter 1,2.
Learn to be positive in Ur life ... Seek the the Kingdom of God first .. He will command u to be in the topmost .. Believe this... Let not the evil get authority over u ever friend.. I pray in the name of Jesus....
Amen
 
Firstly, I would like to thank you all for your kindness and patience with me... and for keeping faith when I was struggling. Truly, God has been working through you.
I have rediscovered my faith, and in fact found the real connection with Jesus that I have been longing for.
Jesus had spoken to me, not in words but in a way I can't put into words.... all I can say is that my world has changed and I know now that I have found the true way.
Now things make sense to me and I know the truth.
I know with a certainty that is greater than myself that the Roman Catholic Church is where true salvation lies. I was always prejudiced against the RC church, but that was Satan grappling with me. I feel like a dark cloud has lifted from me and I see the light of the true church.
Thank you all so much. God bless.
Dear Brother,
Alleluia!!! I am so happy to hear that you have returned to the faith. To the RCC...not so much. :smile: However, there are believers there as well. Those who belong to the Body of Christ which is the one truth church with Jesus Christ at the Head. So, I rejoice for you and with you that Jesus has answered what we could not, and of course had hoped that it would be so for you.

We thank our Heavenly Father that our prayers have been answered for you. Continue to study His Word, and walk in faith brother. If ever you need to bounce anything off someone who only desires the Love of Christ for you. You have Brothers and Sisters in Christ Jesus here who will gladly give you ear, and break bread with you.

With the Love of Christ Jesus Dear Brother.
YBIC
Nick
<><
 
Firstly, I would like to thank you all for your kindness and patience with me... and for keeping faith when I was struggling. Truly, God has been working through you.
I have rediscovered my faith, and in fact found the real connection with Jesus that I have been longing for.
Jesus had spoken to me, not in words but in a way I can't put into words.... all I can say is that my world has changed and I know now that I have found the true way.
Now things make sense to me and I know the truth.
I know with a certainty that is greater than myself that the Roman Catholic Church is where true salvation lies. I was always prejudiced against the RC church, but that was Satan grappling with me. I feel like a dark cloud has lifted from me and I see the light of the true church.
Thank you all so much. God bless.
That's great news. Praise God!

I pray that for you this is the start of a lifetime following and loving Jesus.
 
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