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Mark of the Beast

What a thought-provoking thread!
Remnant, I have seen the kind of numerology-Bible code stuff as what you showed here, but somewhere I remember seeing it w/ the number also coming out if you use the name Bill Gates. (I don't know if they were joking or not, but it did surprise me!) I don't know enough about that sort of thing to get too concerned with it.
Mostly I wanted to replt to Polaris' post. I don't know, again, whether it's about pre-Trib, Post-Trib or Mid-. I know what u r saying tho, about our ignorance of what's going on in the REST of the world. I love to read Voice of the Martyrs stuff, b/c I believe we MUST keep the TRUTH of the world on the front of our minds. I'm almost surprise dthat there aren't any of the coleseums--lions vs Christians--on the Sports channels....
My prayer, Polaris, is that IF it is God's will for me to be there for a Tribulation, of the magnitude we read about in the Word, that He would give me and mine the STRENGTH to HONOR HIM, and I thank Him that I know HE is faithful, and would NOT leave us there, w/o lifting our spirits UP....
I suggest anyone that is bothered by theis thread, go buy "Jesus Freaks" asap.
The Spirit of the Lord is on us, and He HAS annointed us to spread the Good News, and proclaim FREEDOM to the Captives..... ;o)
 
Abbie, I realize that you may have seen that type of numerology, but that was just one of the clues of finding out the beast.

Please turn to Revelation 13.

Rev 13:1 And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy.

John see a beast. a beast always means it is a kingdom. Daniel 7:17.

Dan 7:17 These great beasts, which are four, are four kings, which shall arise out of the earth.

Secondly the beast rises out of the sea..waters represent peoples and nations... REvelations 17:15.

Rev 17:15 And he saith unto me, The waters which thou sawest, where the ***** sitteth, are peoples, and multitudes, and nations, and tongues.

It has seven heads and ten horns. Heads represent kings and mountains. the horns represent kings or kingdoms.

Rev 17:9 And here is the mind which hath wisdom. The seven heads are seven mountains, on which the woman sitteth.
Rev 17:10 And there are seven kings: five are fallen, and one is, and the other is not yet come; and when he cometh, he must continue a short space.
Rev 17:12 And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive power as kings one hour with the beast.
Rev 17:13 These have one mind, and shall give their power and strength unto the beast


A little clarity here. Sometimes horns represent actual kings themselves and sometimes they represent nations.

Dan 8:21 And the rough goat is the king of Grecia: and the great horn that is between his eyes is the first king.

the names of blasphemy.

There are 3 bible definitions for blasphemy.

Here they are:

Joh 10:33 The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God.

Mar 2:7 Why doth this man thus speak blasphemies? who can forgive sins but God only?

Luk 5:21 And the scribes and the Pharisees began to reason, saying, Who is this which speaketh blasphemies? Who can forgive sins, but God alone?


Rom 2:23 Thou that makest thy boast of the law, through breaking the law dishonourest thou God?
Rom 2:24 For the name of God is blasphemed among the Gentiles through you, as it is written.



Moving along....

Rev 13:2 And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority.

Dan 7:4 The first was like a lion, and had eagle's wings: I beheld till the wings thereof were plucked, and it was lifted up from the earth, and made stand upon the feet as a man, and a man's heart was given to it.
Dan 7:5 And behold another beast, a second, like to a bear, and it raised up itself on one side, and it had three ribs in the mouth of it between the teeth of it: and they said thus unto it, Arise, devour much flesh.
Dan 7:6 After this I beheld, and lo another, like a leopard, which had upon the back of it four wings of a fowl; the beast had also four heads; and dominion was given to it.
Dan 7:7 After this I saw in the night visions, and behold a fourth beast, dreadful and terrible, and strong exceedingly; and it had great iron teeth: it devoured and brake in pieces, and stamped the residue with the feet of it: and it was diverse from all the beasts that were before it; and it had ten horns.


Here what we have so far. A nation rises out of many nations. It has seven heads which are the mountains in which it sits. thirdly, it blasphemes. in other words, it thinks it can forgive sin. It thinks he is god on earth and claims to keep the commandments of God. This beast power must be a Christian or think its christian religion because its claims to be commandment keeping.

The beast is partly made up of Babylon, Media Persia and Greece and Rome.
The lion represents babylon, the bear represents media/Persia, the leopard represents greece and the dragon represents Rome.

This kingdom would be made of the various nations.
Only one kingdom fits this model. The Papacy gets its religion from Old Babylon. For instance, Christmas was already being kept before the Christ ever lived. It was actually the winter feast they kept for the sun God. Easter or Ishtar was the god of fertility. In the spring at the same time we now celebrate Easter. Its gets it cruelty from the Media/Persians. In the antiquities of history, there is inscription about how a certain king buried over 100 of people alive in a wall!! They were known throughout as one of the most cruelest people on the planet. The bible even mentions how cruel they were.

Isa 13:17 Behold, I will stir up the Medes against them, which shall not regard silver; and as for gold, they shall not delight in it.
Isa 13:18 Their bows also shall dash the young men to pieces; and they shall have no pity on the fruit of the womb; their eye shall not spare children.


The papacy uses the system of Greece when it comes to schooling. For instance, degree and doctorates were a big thing with the Greeks. This was the problem with schools in Jesus' day. They had been educated by the Greek philosophy so long that they were no longer able to teach about God properly. They made mention about how could christ teach....when he didn't have a degree or letters.


Joh 7:14 Now about the midst of the feast Jesus went up into the temple, and taught.
Joh 7:15 And the Jews marvelled, saying, How knoweth this man letters, having never learned?


The papacy is only the extended version of the Roman government. All that Rome was, he still continues. Rome controlled the kings of nations; the were a world police. Whenever a problem arised they were sticking there nose in it. they taxed the people to death.

As for roman culture: They were known for cruel and unusual entertainment. WIld orgies and gay bathhouses. Gladiator sports.


As i said before. Abbie...here is some more clues. I still have several more of which i will show you. GBU
 
God sends us future events before he does them. That is why he is a father to us because would a a loving parent not tell his childeren things that are commimg in the future. Like in Revealation is one form of prophecy, Isaiah is one too, and Daniel is one too. I will tell you prophecy in these books and reveal things to you that did not know. First of all the beasts in the bible the lion the bear the lepard and then the dragon with the 10 horns and these are the kingdoms and and powers. The lion is babylon, the bear is meta-persia the leperd was greece and the dragon with 10 horns rome and the horns are the 10 powers that were formed after rome was distroyed. Now to THE BEAST IN REVELATION( THE ONE THAT RISES OUT OF THE SEA)and the beast in revelation 13 is the catholic chruch, the beginning it says that the beast rose out of the sea and having 7 heads(7 remaining kings since 3 of the 10 kings were distroyed due to their disbelive) and 10 horns(divided europe after the fall of rome) and 10 crowns(monarchy) and on its heads a blashemous name and this means that the name of the head is blasphemous i will get into this later and the see means multitudes of people and them it goes in to say now the beast that i saw was like a lepard, his feet were like a feet of a bear and his mouth was that of a loin and the dragon gave him his power, his throne, and great authority and this means that the catholic church will get its power from rome and constantine gave the papacy power in 538 bc which continues for 42 months. Int he bible a day means a year in prophecy(42x30=1260 days witch means1260 years). In 1798 the papacy was distroyed by napolian and that is when in the bible it says that after 42 months then the head will be wounded. The wound was healed in 1929 in the signing of a roman pact which gave papcy back its power. It was signed by cardinal gaspari and the roman govenor musilini. the discription of the beast the roman empire had all these nations and powers and the beast will be a world wide power as the catholic church is influencal to world politics and is a world power and also it was a world power and the 666 it means total abonimation to god. The catholic church has that mark and it is vicarius filii dei and as you do with politicans at the time you place roman numberals for each leter and v=5 I=1 C=100 A=0 R=0 I=1 U=5 S=0 F=0 I=1 L=50 I=1 I=1 D=500 E=0 I=1 and all this ='s to 666 and this is name means vicar of the son of god and it is an abomination to god and the beast has power to change times and laws like the sabath and the 10 commandments. Now to the second beast that ries out of the earth.

Some things in prophecy are real and fake(symbolic) the symbolic things are the objects in the prophecy like the lampstands stand for the tribes of israel the woman is the church or a power that will diseve the nations and the nations will make a national law that will kill thoes that do not worship on that day and that day is sunday the pagan day.
THE BEAST THAT RISE OUT OF THE EARTH.
In the bible it says that as one goes into captivity another shall rise up. In 1798 America was rose to power by defeating the brittish army and winning their independence. Then it says the beast shall rise out of the earth. The earth means an unpopulated place as the waters and the earth are opposits. Like America it rose out of an unpopulated place. Then the beast will have 2 horns and will be a lamb. In the bible the horns mean divisions of power like the 10 horns out of the dragon after fome fell there was 10 divisions or diffrent coiuntries that originate from the power that perseded it. Like america had a democrat and republican that is what the 2 horns mean and notice that the beast that ries out of the sea has now crowns like the first beast the first beast has monarchy and that is what the crowns mean a king and a queen. This country has no king or queen so the power will not have any crowns. In the bible lambs mean a new thing. Like Jesus he is the lamb and he started a new covenant between God and us. In the future this country will speak like the first beast and will pass laws that forbid you to worship on saturday the true sabath and if you worship on saturday you will be killed for it. They will call it the national sunday law. It will start with the catholic church the first beast and will affect all the world. The religious freedoms that we have will not be here in the end.
 
Thats why Jesus fed five thousand to demonstrate for us to do the same works as He, if there are millions who reject the mark, they will need to be fed by those who are mature in the faith of the grace of God though Jesus Christ
 
I read the whole post! I understand where you are coming from, and the book of Revelation has fascinated me! This post has genuinely opened my eyes.
 
Robear ty for the response but your tone seems to be on the not so friendly side... Please understand that not everyone understands at the same level.. Also could you maybe then show us what you are talking about ty Joyfully ~ Jlu
 
revelation unvield

I'm still reading up on this subject (It's very interesting) but I found this website a while back [edited by admin: no links without permission!!] they have some interesting articles about almost everything you could shake a stick at and then some, concerning the Bybel and some of the misconceptions we persieve as truth and they give scriptual evidence to their statements and refrain from speculating.

Hope it helps
 
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First I would like to apologize to you all for not abiding by the rules - I was out of line- Sorry

Next I would like to re-post that link on this day 9/11/2005, so here goes http://www.gnmagazine.org/ .Take a look and hopefully it wil mean to you as much as it did to me.
(with permision from Chad )
Chad said:
Its a good link. I will allow you to post this in lounge. )

Phumba said:
I'm still reading up on this subject (It's very interesting) but I found this website a while back [edited by admin: no links without permission!!] they have some interesting articles about almost everything you could shake a stick at and then some, concerning the Bybel and some of the misconceptions we persieve as truth and they give scriptual evidence to their statements and refrain from speculating.

Hope it helps
 
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Mark of the Beast....

When I was in prison I was telling one of my cell mates some information given to me back in the late 80's about this microchip that could be a part of the system of the Beast. Another cell mate heard us talking and said yea I have a magazine where they are advertising it. He showed me an advertisment of RFID's put out by Verichip. Everything in that advertisement confirmed what I was told over 10 years earlier. Then we seen an advertisement in the newspaper about it. Anyway I was compelled to do a study on the subject and was blown away by what I found. Here is a little food for thought on the subject. One of the first things God showed me is that the devil is a liar and a counterfieter of all that is true. Exodus 13:16And it shall be for a token upon thine hand, and for frontlets between thine eyes: for by strength of hand the LORD brought us forth out of Egypt. Then you go to Revelations 13:16 (interesting to note its the same chapter and verse as what God did in Exodus) And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads:
After seeing that I was convinced that the enemy of our souls is trying to mock God and His ways. I agree with a comment I read in this thread by Betty Miller: (The devil has so deceived the world, even the church. For example, even the church is full of divorces because the government and society say it's acceptable. They also say abortions are acceptable, so we have abortions even in the church. The beastly system has crept into the church and we're being marked by it. Many have it in their minds that divorce and abortion are acceptable, then they've committed those deeds with their hands. They've been marked in their minds and on their hands without even knowing it. They're waiting for some tattoo, thinking they'll refuse it when it comes, yet they're already receiving the spiritual mark of the beast. Should they come to a literal mark, they'll not be able to refuse it because the beast system has already become such a part of them. If we're not getting our minds marked with the Word of God (reading and meditating in the Bible and obeying it's commands), when the hour comes for a literal mark we'll not be able to say no to the system.)
If the RFID's are a part of the system of the Beast then the only way we as believers can refuse it is to refuse the lies of the enemy now. The Lord is the strength of my life, not man, money, or material possesions.
 
One additional comment I would like to make is this. I believe that Revelation 3:7-12 where Christ addresses the Philadelphia church tells us two things.

First: Chist has nothing against this church and He sets before them an open door that no one may close

Second: He promises that He will keep them "from" the hour of temptation that will come upon all the earth. This I believe is the Pre-tribulation rapture.

I believe this rapture is confirmed in Rev 4:1-2 when Christ calls John to come up hither as a symbol of the rapture of all the true and faithful christians prior to the opening of the first seal which marks the beginning of the 7 years of tribulation.

Now there will be many other luke warm Christians that because of a lack of a true salvation, or as some say a full surrender to Christ, will not be raptured but will be left behind. These will be those that Christ was talking about when He said many in that day will say to me Lord, Lord,....... but I will say depart from me ye workers of iniquity as I never knew you.

For any of us who may find ourselves in that position, we must immediately repent and surrender fully to Christ and the Holy Spirit and prepare to endure some of the most terrible and frightening times ever upon the earth. Many of these "left behind christians" will suffer martyrdom for their faith and thus wash their robes in Christ's blood and be saved.

Sadly also, many will become disillusioned, rebel and choose the world and the beast and be lost for eternity.

Isaiah and Daniel have much to say about this time of the end as does the book of Matthew chapter 24.

We must be diligent in our Faith, watchfully prepared and daily in our commitment to our Lord so that we walk in the Spirit and keep our first love by daily prayer and reading of the Word, praying always and quick to love and forgive our neighbor that we may be counted as members of Christ's Philadelphia church.

I say as Christ said let he who has ears hear
 
Deacon Bob,

The seven churches are seven periods of the church history. The church at Ephesus was the church of the disciples. The Laodicea church begin in 1844.

There is no seven year tribulation coming. This theory is based upon catholic priest named Riberra. This was part of the plan of the Catholic Church' Counter Reformation to stop men like Martin Luther, Zwigli, and Calvin from interpreted the scriptures that point out the Catholic church in Revelation and Daniel.

The scriptures where you have the 7-year tribulation is the final week of the 70 weeks in Daniel. The only problem is that 70 weeks in continuous. In text, it says the Messiah would be cut off in the midst of the week. the middle of the week is 3 1/2 days...in bible prophecy thats 3 1/2 years. This is exactly how long Jesus ministry was. In 34 AD, The gospel begins to be preached to the Gentile world. Exactly 3 1/2 years after the death of Christ. When Stephen sees Jesus standing at the right hand of God, the judgement of the Abraham' descedents is complete.

The Seventy weeks was the probation for the Jewish Church. Christ re-established the church under himself. The Jews were cut off unless they were to accept Christ just like the gentile now. Thank you for you response Deacon Bob
 
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Remnant:

You ahd I will have to agree to disagree about the tribulation. I simply do not see it the way you do. I am going to leave it right there.
 
Remnant said:
Deacon Bob,
The seven churches are seven periods of the church history. The church at Ephesus was the church of the disciples. The Laodicea church begin in 1844.
There is no seven year tribulation coming. This theory is based upon catholic priest named Riberra. This was part of the plan of the Catholic Church' Counter Reformation to stop men like Martin Luther, Zwigli, and Calvin from interpreted the scriptures that point out the Catholic church in Revelation and Daniel.
The scriptures where you have the 7-year tribulation is the final week of the 70 weeks in Daniel. The only problem is that 70 weeks in continuous. In text, it says the Messiah would be cut off in the midst of the week. the middle of the week is 3 1/2 days...in bible prophecy thats 3 1/2 years. This is exactly how long Jesus ministry was. In 34 AD, The gospel begins to be preached to the Gentile world. Exactly 3 1/2 years after the death of Christ. When Stephen sees Jesus standing at the right hand of God, the judgement of the Abraham' descedents is complete.
The Seventy weeks was the probation for the Jewish Church. Christ re-established the church under himself. The Jews were cut off unless they were to accept Christ just like the gentile now. Thank you for you response Deacon Bob

Please list scripture to back up everything, I am curious how you came to the conclusion that the Laodicean Church came about in 1844??????
 
Thank you DeaconBob3, I value your comment and input, it makes more sense to me the way you laid it out. :)
 
Quote: Remnant - "The Seventy weeks was the probation for the Jewish Church. Christ re-established the church under himself. The Jews were cut off unless they were to accept Christ just like the gentile now."

The Bible says that Christ came unto his own(the Jews) but His own received Him not.

When the Jews did not accept Christ as their Saviour, Daniel's 70 weeks was suspended to allow the Gentile church age. That church age will conclude at the moment the 7 year peace treaty discussed in Daniel is signed. That will be the beginning of Daniel's 70th week and the beginning of the 7 years of tribulation.


That does not mean that the Jews are cut off permanently. Jeremiah 3:8 tells us that God was so upset with the sinful jewish tribes that made up Israel that he divorced Himself from them and scattered them. Jeremiah goes on to say that the Jewish house of Judah was also sinful, but He did not divorce them. [Remember that the Jewish nation at that time was composed of two parts; Judah and Israel. There were 10 tribes in Israel and two tribes in Judah]

Then in Exekiel 37:(all) we read how the Lord promises to return the scattered Israelites to their homeland. Then Isaiah 59: 20-21 tells us that all Isreal will be saved. Zechariah 12:10 reveals that the jews will acknowledge Him who was pierced as their Saviour.

Ezekiel 38 and 39 describe a national awakening in Israel. Could it be that during this war time as described in Ezekiel that this national awakening shall take place

and finally let us remember that Paul writes in Romans 9, 10 & 11 that God is far from done with Israel and that the blindness and hardening are only temprary until the full number of Gentils are come in (Romans 11:25). Paul's expectation is that all Israel will be saved.

I write this so that there is no confusion on the issue of the Christian Church replacing Israel. That is a false and misguided teaching and the bible is clear that the Jewish people are God's chosen and they are still the apple of his eye. In Fact in Romans 11 Paul reminds us that the Gentile branches of Christ's church are supported by the Jewish roots Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. (Romans 11:16, 18)
 
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My husband has a question . . .

Hi everyone! I could really use your help with this one.

My husband has a question about the devil, and that is;

Why is the devil so powerful?

Why would GOD make the devil so powerful?
 
The devil cannot make us sin. He can, however, tempt us to sin.
Christ overcame the devil.

James tells us:

James 4:7
7 Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you.
KJV

The devil is not supernatural. He cannot read our minds. But he is very observant and he keeps extensive records.

Peter tells us:

1 Peter 5:6-8
6 Humble yourselves therefore under the mighty hand of God, that he may exalt you in due time:
7 Casting all your care upon him; for he careth for you. (upon the Lord)
8 Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour:
KJV

When we repent, surrender to Christ and walk in the Spirit we have nothing to fear for the Lord is with us always. It is when we walk in the flesh that the troubles overtake us.

As Christ said on the cross; "It is finished" He, Christ, overcame sin and death for all of us. It is for us to choose Christ and to trust and obey.
 
Thank you DeaconBob3

The devil cannot make us sin. He can, however, tempt us to sin.

Christ overcame the devil.

James tells us:

James 4:7
7 Submit yourselves therefore to God. Resist the devil, and he will flee from you.


It is for us to choose Christ and to trust and obey.

Thank you DeaconBob3, I will share all you said with my husband.

Chad also shared some good info., with me as well. I've qoute it below.

Technically, it is us humans that give the devil power. Remember, it is our will to either obey GOD or disobey GOD (and follow satan). So, the more we open our selves up to the devil, the more power he has over us. Multiply this per every human that does not obey GOD, and that sums up satan's power. He has no power against a believer unless the believer sins and opens themselves up to the devils attacks. If we do not obey the devil, he is powerless against us because we have Christ who dwells within us.
 
well discussion towards the beast wont stop but it might end up funny if we interpreted it wrongly. Until God reveals the identity of the beast we will only spend time discussing. i believe the beast would come when human beings r not that prepared to face him. Whatever i am more satisfied to leave the book of revelation as it is. Nice discussion though.
 
Who are the beasts spoken of in the Bible? Are they not men themselves?

In our natural state without the Lord we are as subject to chance as are those we (from our seemingly lofty position) would call beasts. All of us, both man and animal return to the dust. [see Ecc 3:18-20]

God warned man to put a difference between the clean and unclean beasts to keep his soul from also becoming unclean. [see Lev 20:25]

Some beasts have been saved, but for what if not to keep seed alive upon the face of the earth? [see Gen 7:2-3]

But…receiving the seed does not guarantee that fruit will come forth does it? [see Luke 8:11-15]

But a very few God has seen as righteous before Him. [see Gen 7:1 & Matt 7:14]

Man has his own honor but abideth not rather perishes like the beasts and without really understanding [Ps 49:12, 20]

Nebuchadnezzar puffed himself up, but he found out that he really was only a beast in the eyes of God [see Dan 5:21] How are we better than Nebuchadnezzar when we remember that God is no respecter of persons? [Acts 10:34]

Even Paul said: ‘If after the manner of men I have fought with beasts at Ephesus, what advantageth it me, if the dead rise not? …”[I Cor 15:32].

Paul recognized his frailty and so must we also by humbling ourselves and praying and seeking His face. [II Chron 7:14]

The beasts within us must die so that we might truly have Life. [I Cor 15:36]

“But these speak evil of those things which they know not: but what they know naturally, as brute beasts, in those things they corrupt themselves.” [Jude 10]

“I saw a beast rise up out of …[me and you]…

“And I beheld another beast coming up out of …[me]…

“And deceiveth… [me and you]… by means of those miracles which he had power to do…

“Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord have we not…. in thy name dome many wonderful works?

And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you….”

And [I or you] had power to give [false] life unto the image of the beast…”

“Here is wisdom. Let him that hat understanding count the number of the beast for it is the number of [me or you]...”

“So foolish was I, and ignorant: I was as a beast before thee.” Ps 73:22

But then look to the wisdom which is Christ Jesus [see I Cor 1:30] and let that wisdom kill her beasts [Prov 9:2] in us before it is too late for “the night cometh, when no man can work” [John 9:4]

Yes, kill ‘her beasts’ and present out bodies a living sacrifice as our reasonable service [see Rom 12:1]

Perhaps then we will be among “ …them that [have] gotten victory over the beast…” within [me and you].
 
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