Salvation

[Chad]

WHAT DOES THE BIBLE SAY ABOUT....SALVATION?

What's Wrong With This World?

Everywhere in this world we find heartache, strife, sickness, poverty, injustice and a host of other ills. Why can't men live in peace and enjoy the good things in this earth? The Bible (God's book to mankind) gives us the answer to these questions and tells us how to find salvation and what that means. He tells us in His Book that all the troubles in the world are due to either my sin or someone else's. All of mankind is sinful, thus separated from the holiness of God.

"For all have sinned and come short of the glory of God" (Romans 3:23).

"For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord" (Romans 6:23).

What exactly is sin? If you asked ten different people, you might get ten different answers. Some might say that sin is "doing something wrong or breaking the law", while others might say that sin is "hurting another person or taking an innocent life." Still others might deny the very existence of sin, saying that there is no such thing as right or wrong-- in short, that there are no real absolutes in this world. However, most people agree (regardless of culture) that there are certain actions that are wrong, and should be punishable by fines, imprisonment or even death.

Even the person who "doesn't believe in right or wrong" would have a hard time observing a maniac rape and murder a small child, and say that what happened to them was not a crime.

Sin is a terminal disease that eats away at the very heart of this planet. It destroys individual people, families, cultures, even the earth itself. Our world is defiled by it, yet most people cannot even give a definition of the word, or grasp the true gravity of the situation. What is sin? Surely sin is more that ten different opinions from ten different people. Is there any final authority on this subject?

The Bible says that sin is a heart condition. It is a condition of rebellion against God, which stems from pride. The Bible even refers to pride as "original sin." The Hebrew definition of the word sin means "to miss the mark." God created us to be like Him, but our pride and rebellion make us fall far short of that purpose. Our actions, though they may be "sinful" are really only the fruit of our rebellion against God. Our outward actions merely mirror our true inner condition. It is our true inner condition that God is concerned with. He knows the "real you" better than you yourself do, because he sees "the inner man" and all your secret thoughts and motives.

"Nothing in all creation is hidden from God's sight. Everything is uncovered and laid bare before the eyes of him to whom we must give account." Hebrews 4:13 (NIV)

"If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us." 1 John 1:8

Though one may lead a "good life" on the outside, God looks on the heart. It is the nature of man to look on the outward, but outward appearances can be deceiving.

"Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye are like unto whited sepulchres, which indeed appear beautiful outward, but are within full of dead men's bones, and of all uncleanness. Even so ye also outwardly appear righteous unto men, but within ye are full of hypocrisy and iniquity." Matthew 23:27-28

We cannot deal with our sin by "cleaning ourselves up" the outside, when our problem is a heart condition. "Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whosoever committeth sin is the servant of sin." John 8:34 We are all slaves to our sinful nature, and we can only be cleansed from within.

Since sin is the root cause of all our troubles, we must deal with our sin first if we want less troubles in our lives. How do we get rid of sin? God tells us in His Word that by nature we are "...dead in trespasses and sin;" (Ephesians 2:1) and that we are "...alienated from the life of God..." (Ephesians 4:18). Just as a body without physical life is declared physically dead, so anyone who is separated from God is described in the Bible as spiritually dead. As long as we remain spiritually dead, we cannot know God.

We all need a new life. We need to be cleansed from sin and it's penalty (which is death) and restored to fellowship with God who made us all. That is what Jesus Christ (God's Son) meant when He said we "must be born again" (John 3:7). "...Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God" (John 3:3). Without the experience of the "new birth" we have no hope of enjoying the glories of heaven nor escaping the terrors of hell. Have you been born again?

The "new birth" is not a religion, not living up to a creed, not a set of rituals, nor joining a church or denomination. It's a transformation. Our old nature is changed and we receive a new one. Old things pass away and all things become new in Christ. We receive a new heart, new desires, new ideas, and a new direction because of this new nature. A birth is the coming into being of a new life which has the nature of its parents. When you were born the first time, you were made a partaker of the nature of natural man. When you are born again, you become a partaker of the divine nature (II Peter 1:4). God can become your heavenly Father.

The greatest attribute of God is that He is a God of love. He loves you and me. He loves all sinners and wants to save every one of us from hell and the terrible results of our sin. His Word tells us, "But God commendeth His love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us" (Romans 5:8). "For He hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him" (II Corinthians 5:21). God hates sin because of what it produces-- war, sickness, poverty, etc., but God loves the sinner.

God sent Jesus Christ, His only Son, so that we might have new, everlasting life. The Bible tells us, "For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in Him should not perish, but have everlasting life" (John 3:16). By His death, burial and resurrection, Jesus made a way for our salvation. He broke the power of sin and death, making it possible for us to have everlasting life. The life of God raised Jesus from the dead and He was the first born Son into the kingdom of God.

"Giving thanks unto the Father, which hath made us meet to be partakers of the inheritance of the saints in light: Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son: In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins: Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature: For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him: And He is before all things, and by Him all things consist. And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence" (Colossians 1:12-18).

Jesus Christ, the Son of God, was nailed to a cross by ungodly men for no sin of His own. He was an innocent man-- the only man who was ever perfect and sinless. He never sinned, yet He took your sins and mine by taking an unjust death. Because He did this willingly, He was raised from the dead by His Father and given life and authority over the powers of darkness. God now imparts that same life and authority to all those who come receiving His provision for their sin. "...the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin" (I John 1:7)

We must accept God's Word that says we all are sinners and know that it is sin that separates us from God and repent or "turn away" from that sin. Until we each acknowledge, and ask forgiveness for our own guilt, we will never be free from it. It will eventually lead us right into hell.

"The Lord is...not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance" (II Peter 3:9)

God wants to give us His power over sin. We cannot conquer sin without that power. God wants to give us life for death, beauty for ashes, health for sickness, joy for grief, peace for strife, love for hate. God's Word says, "...I am come that they might have life and that they might have it more abundantly" (John 10:10). Do you want abundant life? This abundant life comes only as we are born again and as we follow on and receive all that God promises us.

It isn't always easy following God, but nothing worthwhile ever was. You may be ridiculed and persecuted. You will face many temptations to fall back into your old nature. But you can be assured that God is with you, and He will give you power to overcome every one of them.

"But what things were gain to me, those I counted loss for Christ. Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord: for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and do count them but dung, that I may win Christ, and be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith." Phil 3:7-9

You can pray right now and ask God to come into your heart and receive the new birth. Simply talk to Him as you would talk to another person. You might pray a prayer similar to this:
[center:3e70849b96]
God, I do not know you personally, but I want to know you. I believe that
Your Word, the Bible is true. I repent for hardening my heart toward you,
and delighting myself in things you hate. I don't want to go to hell; I really
want to be free of my sin. Come into my heart and cleanse me of the guilt
of my sins and give me the power to overcome those sins. I want to be Your
child and learn of Your ways. Keep me from evil and save my soul.
I ask this in the name of Jesus Christ. Amen[/center:3e70849b96]

If you said that prayer and meant it from your heart, you are now a child of God. You will need to do four things faithfully every day so you will grow in God.

1. Read God's Word daily.

You need to read and study God's Word (the Bible) every day. This is how you will learn about God's ways and how to overcome your problems and troubles. His Word brings strength to your spiritual nature. If you do not have a Bible, make your first prayer request to God to supply you with one.

"Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth." (II Timothy 2:15).

"But thou hast fully known my doctrine, manner of life, purpose, faith, longsuffering, charity, patience, persecutions, afflictions, which came unto me at Antioch, at Iconium, at Lystra; what persecutions I endured: but out of them all the Lord delivered me. Yea, and all that will live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution. But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse, deceiving, and being deceived. But continue thou in the things which thou hast learned and hast been assured of, knowing of whom thou hast learned them; And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus. All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness: That the man of God may be perfect, thoroughly furnished unto all good works" (II Timothy 3:10-17).

2. Pray to God daily.

We must fellowship and talk to God if we are to hear His guidance and learn of His nature. We are promised that all of our needs shall be met if we will only ask the Father in the name of Jesus.

"And whatsoever ye shall ask in my name, that will I do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son If ye shall ask any thing in my name, I will do it. If ye love me, keep my commandments." (John 14: 13-15)

"Seek ye first the kingdom of God , and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you" (Matthew 6:33).

3. Seek Water Baptism and Fellowship with like believers.

(1.) Seek out a good Bible-believing church and share your decision to follow Christ with the body of believers there and ask to be water baptized. This will seal your commitment to Christ (See BIBLE ANSWERS for more about water baptism).

Ask the Lord to show you the people you are to pray and fellowship with on a daily basis. He does not want you to be alone in your Christian walk. We all need one another's prayers, encouragement, and love to grow in God.

"And let us consider one another to provoke unto love and to good works: Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching" (Hebrews 10:24-25).

4. Keep your heart pure before the Lord daily.

Ask God to cleanse you of all sin and impure thoughts and motives. Satan, our enemy, will try to break our fellowship with God by getting us back into sin or trying to get us angry at God. Guard against this by resisting the devil daily.

"Keep thy heart with all diligence; for out of it are the issues of life" (Proverbs 4:23).

"Submit to God. Resist the devil and he will flee from you" (James 4:7).

 

[justsavedvince]

From what I have been taught, Satan was an angel of God in heaven but then was cast out after thinking he was better than God when his pride got to him. Please correct my ambiguity, I don't know the specifics... but does this mean that a Christian can lose salvation? Satan knew that God was God, yet he still fell. I know God is God, does that mean i can fall too?

 

[Chad]

That is true. Satan thought he would be able to gain GOD's throne and overcome GOD's throne. Very stupid indeed, GOD rebuked him very well in response to that. That eternal rebuke we can call hell.

Christians can lose salvation if they walk away from GOD. That's about as simple and basic as one can possibly put it. As long as you are obedient to GOD and believe Christ as Savior, your salvation is secured as GOD promised.

 

[Amen!]

I was thinking about this. If we first believe and then reject God, we are essentially saying we can live life without Him, thereby saying we can do it better than God. Isn't that exactly what Satan did when he thought he could rise above and take God's throne?

 

[chinaski]

Christians can lose salvation if they walk away from GOD. That's about as simple and basic as one can possibly put it. As long as you are obedient to GOD and believe Christ as Savior, your salvation is secured as GOD promised.

But we all do this all the time. We chose to sin(disobedience) somtimes knowingly and sometimes unknowingly. Isn't that the same as turning away from GOD? We turn to him again for forgiveness ofcourse. Do you mean by "walking away from GOD" that we stop asking for forgiveness and choose to ignore our sin?
I think alot about theese questions.
There is a debate going on in Oslo churches atm about God's grace, enternal security and everything inbetween. Terribly confusing.

What exactly would cause one to loose ones salvation? Usually if a person would walk away from GOD I guess it would be because of doubt. Noone knowing the thruth would willing turn away. This would mean that at some point the doubt entered the believer without him knowing and as it grew it eventually lead to him loosing faith.
My prayer to GOD is that if I ever would fall away like this that I would be hit by a bus or something before it would be too late so I wouldnt loose my salvation. I have fallen from my faith ones and im scared it might happen again.

 

[Chad]

But we all do this all the time. We chose to sin(disobedience) somtimes knowingly and sometimes unknowingly. Isn't that the same as turning away from GOD? We turn to him again for forgiveness ofcourse. Do you mean by "walking away from GOD" that we stop asking for forgiveness and choose to ignore our sin?
I think alot about theese questions.
There is a debate going on in Oslo churches atm about God's grace, enternal security and everything inbetween. Terribly confusing.

What exactly would cause one to loose ones salvation? Usually if a person would walk away from GOD I guess it would be because of doubt. Noone knowing the thruth would willing turn away. This would mean that at some point the doubt entered the believer without him knowing and as it grew it eventually lead to him loosing faith.
My prayer to GOD is that if I ever would fall away like this that I would be hit by a bus or something before it would be too late so I wouldnt loose my salvation. I have fallen from my faith ones and im scared it might happen again.

How about this idea?

If you care for Salvation, take up your cross and follow Jesus. Its easy and He made very clear His grace is sufficient (when we sin, His grace abounds more).

The difference between one who seeks forgiveness and presses on and one who walks away from GOD and does not care any longer is Heaven and Hell.

2 Corinthians 12:9
But he said to me, "My grace is sufficient for you, for my power is made perfect in weakness." Therefore I will boast all the more gladly of my weaknesses, so that the power of Christ may rest upon me

Romans 5:9
Since, therefore, we have now been justified by his blood, much more shall we be saved by him from the wrath of God.

Romans 5:19-20
19For as by the one man's disobedience the many were made sinners, so by the one man's obedience the many will be made righteous. 20Now the law came in to increase the trespass, but where sin increased, grace abounded all the more, 21so that, as sin reigned in death, grace also might reign through righteousness leading to eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

 

[Nigh]

Matthew Henry's Concise Commentary says;

The proud resist God: in their understanding they resist the truths of God; in their will they resist the laws of God; in their passions they resist the providence of God; therefore, no wonder that God resists the proud...
...If we yield to temptations, the devil will continually follow us; but if we put on the whole armour of God, and stand out against him, he will leave us. Let sinners then submit to God, and seek his grace and favour; resisting the devil. All sin must be wept over; here, in godly sorrow, or, hereafter, in eternal misery. And the Lord will not refuse to comfort one who really mourns for sin, or to exalt one who humbles himself before him.

If we turn away from God we will weep over our sin in eternal misery. The key is to "turn back". If you are on your way to Topeka and you suddenly turn away from it, will you end up there? No, but if you turn back, you will once again be on the road to Topeka, and should end up there. As those filled with the Holy Spirit, we are convicted of our sin and would natrually be upset with ourselves for falling short 'again'. The Spirit illuminates the proper road signs letting us see that we are on the wrong path. It is then up to us to "turn around".

God bless,
Nigh

 

[gotime]

1Co 15:56 The sting of death is sin, and the strength of sin is the Law.

Rom 7:9 For I was alive without the law once. But when the commandment came, sin revived and I died.

Rom 7:8 But sin, taking occasion by the commandment, worked in me all kinds of lust. For apart from law sin was dead.

Rom 7:7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? Let it not be said! But I did not know sin except through the law. For also I did not know lust except the law said, You shall not lust.

Rom 3:20 because by the works of the Law none of all flesh will be justified in His sight; for through the Law is the knowledge of sin.

1Jo 3:4 Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.

Sin is breaking the Law of God His Ten Commandments which are based on love. this is how we know sin by the Law of right living.

 

[aksd]

There is no scriptural basis to the contention that one can loose salvation. This is just a derivation of human logic that confuses loosing rewards with loosing salvation; and taking only a few verses to support a theory, instead of looking at the Word of God in its totality.

We all sin even after our salvation, none becomes perfect. "1 John 1:8, 10 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His word is not in us."

That is why Jesus continues to plead before God as our advocate for us and deliver us. We loose our rewards because of sin, not our salvation."1 John 2:1,2 My little children, these things I write to you, so that you may not sin. And if anyone sins, we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous. And He Himself is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only but also for the whole world.
"

The context to both of the above quotations - the apostle John is writing to believers not unbelievers; and including himself and his other colleagues in the meaning and implication of these verses- he uses 'us' and 'we'; not 'you' or 'sinners' or 'they' etc.

Secondly, why have Jesus as an advocate if the matter were altready settled and the judgement of 'Lost Salvation' passed against the sinner?

Has God saved us so that we will continously live in dread of falling on His wrong side and incurring His wrath?

Would that fit in with His character of being a loving and merciful God?

Was the Prodigal Son (Luke 15:11-32) not gulity of deliberately, knowingly and wilfully turning away from his father and living a wayward life away from his home and father, by choice?

Was he not welcomed back and restored when he came back?

By contending that because of falling back in sin salvation is lost are we not behaving like his brother - reminding the father of all the bad things that the prodigal had done and all the good that he had done, therefore wanting retribution on the backslidden since they could not or did not maintain their status while we did - so we take on a 'holier than thou' attitude and pride in it, but God wants us to be understanding and caring - as the father explained to the brother of the prodigal son.

For those who are unaware, this discussion is currently on in two threads - 5 Ways to loose your salvation and Poll: Once Saved always saved. A fairly detailed exposition with the pros & cons of this topic can be found on both these threads.

 

[lettheredeemed]

Lift up your heads to the heavens and look upon the earth beneath: for the heavens shall vanish away like smoke, and the earth will wax old like a garment, and they they that dwell therein shall die in like manner: but my salvation shall be for ever, and my righteousness shall not be abolished. Isaiah 51:6

Now the God of peace, that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus Christ, that great shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant, Hebrews 13:20

 

[gotime]

There is no scriptural basis to the contention that one can loose salvation. This is just a derivation of human logic that confuses loosing rewards with loosing salvation; and taking only a few verses to support a theory, instead of looking at the Word of God in its totality.

Rev 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints: here [are] they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

It is possible to be saved and then not but only by our own choice God will not force either way we always have a choice.

the above verse shows the attributes of those who are saved they will both believe and obey. we can lose our salvation by either or both of these being stopped. eg. we can believe and not obey or obey and not believe.

sounds stunningly like the mark of the Beast

Rev 14:9 And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive [his] mark in his forehead, or in his hand,

Forehead in the bible means our belifes while hand ofter in other passeges refered to as right hand means our actions.

while the seal of GOd is the same
Deu 11:18 Therefore shall ye lay up these my words in your heart and in your soul, and bind them for a sign upon your hand, that they may be as frontlets between your eyes.

notice again here in deut God commands that His law be a sighn in the hand and forehead. this is why the JEws used to have texts of the law in a box strapped to their hand and foreheads. Granted this is not what GOd meant obviously. but rather our beliefe and obedience.

SO yes one can be saved and still become lost but only by thier own choice. I will also say that we are only Judged on the light given to us eg its not disobedience when you truley do not know it is etc blessings all.

 

[Cody]

Rev 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints: here [are] they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus.

It is possible to be saved and then not but only by our own choice God will not force either way we always have a choice.

the above verse shows the attributes of those who are saved they will both believe and obey. we can lose our salvation by either or both of these being stopped. eg. we can believe and not obey or obey and not believe.

sounds stunningly like the mark of the Beast

Rev 14:9 And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive [his] mark in his forehead, or in his hand,

Forehead in the bible means our belifes while hand ofter in other passeges refered to as right hand means our actions.

while the seal of GOd is the same
Deu 11:18 Therefore shall ye lay up these my words in your heart and in your soul, and bind them for a sign upon your hand, that they may be as frontlets between your eyes.

notice again here in deut God commands that His law be a sighn in the hand and forehead. this is why the JEws used to have texts of the law in a box strapped to their hand and foreheads. Granted this is not what GOd meant obviously. but rather our beliefe and obedience.

SO yes one can be saved and still become lost but only by thier own choice. I will also say that we are only Judged on the light given to us eg its not disobedience when you truley do not know it is etc blessings all.

That verse is talking about after the tribulation. The church is caught up in the air with Jesus before that stuff happens. But, maybe you don't believe in the pretribulation rapture.

If the power of God isn't there when you get saved, then yeah you can be unsaved because it wasn't by God, it was just a false salvation full of emotions, but if God saves you, then I believe He has the power to keep you. If you experience God's love, why would you completely turn your back on Him?

God knows His true sheep and He knows the goats. Lets not be the judge of who is saved and who is not. If you believe you can be unsaved. I dare you to turn your back on God. You're probably in shock. Wonder why? Maybe it's because one day God saved you, yet you was a sinner and something unbelievable happened and because of what God did you're striving to live by His will. If you're truly saved and get out of God's will, He'll let you know, believe me. God is our father and He's going to keep us in line.

God Bless you

 

[gotime]

That verse is talking about after the tribulation. The church is caught up in the air with Jesus before that stuff happens. But, maybe you don't believe in the pretribulation rapture.

If the power of God isn't there when you get saved, then yeah you can be unsaved because it wasn't by God, it was just a false salvation full of emotions, but if God saves you, then I believe He has the power to keep you. If you experience God's love, why would you completely turn your back on Him?

Your are right i do not beleive in a pretribulation rapture I believe that GOd will simply protect His people during it as He has always done. Reason being is I have seen not one biblical reason for this pretrib rapture at all.

but that aside the point i was making is one can be saved and then not saved to say otherwise is to say that once we accept GOd we lose our free choice and if we have no free choice then God is forcing us to stay saved. Though this is not normally something that one would do it is possible through sin. we can be truly saved but if we entertain sin somewhere down the track and do not ask for help from God then we can get to the point where we can chose to leave God. You are right GOd will do all He can to save and keep us saved all but one thing take away our free choice.

 

[lettheredeemed]

Your are right i do not beleive in a pretribulation rapture I believe that GOd will simply protect His people during it as He has always done. Reason being is I have seen not one biblical reason for this pretrib rapture at all.

but that aside the point i was making is one can be saved and then not saved to say otherwise is to say that once we accept GOd we lose our free choice and if we have no free choice then God is forcing us to stay saved. Though this is not normally something that one would do it is possible through sin. we can be truly saved but if we entertain sin somewhere down the track and do not ask for help from God then we can get to the point where we can chose to leave God. You are right GOd will do all He can to save and keep us saved all but one thing take away our free choice.

Would you be so kind as to show me your scriptural foundation for your belief that there will not be a pretrib rapture?

 

[gotime]

Would you be so kind as to show me your scriptural foundation for your belief that there will not be a pretrib rapture?

I will do if that is what you want give me time I will have to look up the texts Ill try have it done in today if i get the time otherwise give me a couple days blessings to you.

 

[gotime]

Would you be so kind as to show me your scriptural foundation for your belief that there will not be a pretrib rapture?

Will there be a rapture Yes. Will it be a secret NO!
Rapture means "to be carried away with power," and it is true that when Jesus comes the living righteous will be caught up to meet the Lord in the air (1 Thessalonians 4:17). But many have come to believe that this rapture will take place quietly-that faithful Christians all around the world will suddenly disappear and that life here on earth will continue for a seven-year period of tribulation. During this time, they say, many will be converted and have a "second chance" at salvation before Christ's final coming.
Although the secret rapture scenario may appear comforting at first glance, there is absolutely no scriptural support for it. The Bible plainly teaches that when Jesus comes again, every one of our senses will be bombarded with evidence!

His Coming Will Be Literal
"And when he had spoken these things, while they beheld, he was taken up; and a cloud received him out of their sight. And while they looked stedfastly toward heaven as he went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel; Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven." (Acts 1:9-11).
Heaven-sent messengers told the disciples that Jesus would return to this earth in the same manner He left. Christ left in the clouds, and He will come back in the clouds. He was visible when He left, and He will be visible when He comes again. He had a real body when He left, and He will return the same way.

His Coming Will Be Visible
"Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him." (Revelation 1:7).
"For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be." (Matthew 24:27).
"And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory." (Matthew 24:30).
When Christ comes, it will not be merely a local sighting or an isolated event. It will be visible across the entire world. His Coming Will Be Audible
"For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord." (1 Thessalonians 4:16, 17).
"The Lord shall roar from on high, and utter his voice from his holy habitation; he shall mightily roar upon his habitation; he shall give a shout." (Jeremiah 25:30).
"Our God shall come, and shall not keep silence: a fire shall devour before him, and it shall be very tempestuous round about him." (Psalm 50:3).
As you can see from the preceeding Scriptures, Christ's second coming will be loud! There will be shouts and trumpets and all kinds of noise. No one will accidentally miss it or be able to read about it in the newspaper the next day.

His Coming Will Be Emotional
"Men's hearts failing them for fear, and for looking after those things which are coming on the earth: for the powers of heaven shall be shaken. And then shall they see the Son of man coming in a cloud with power and great glory." (Luke 21:26, 27).
"And it shall be said in that day, Lo, this is our God; we have waited for him, and he will save us: this is the Lord; we have waited for him, we will be glad and rejoice in his salvation." (Isaiah 25:9).
When Christ returns, it will be an emotional day for the wicked and righteous alike. The lost will experience indescribable fear and anguish, while the saved will experience the perfect joy of eternal salvation.

His Coming Will Open the Graves
"And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day." (John 6:40).
"For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive. But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming." (1 Corinthians 15:22, 23).
"For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord." (1 Thessalonians 4:16, 17).
This is the Bible's description of the rapture. The dead in Christ will rise by His power and will meet Him in the air. Afterward the faithful who are still alive will also be caught up. It will not be a secret!

His Coming Will Destroy the Earth
"The earth is utterly broken down, the earth is clean dissolved, the earth is moved exceedingly. The earth shall reel to and fro like a drunkard, and shall be removed like a cottage; and the transgression thereof shall be heavy upon it; and it shall fall, and not rise again." (Isaiah 24:19, 20).
"And the heaven [sky] departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places." (Revelation 6:14).
"And there were voices, and thunders, and lightnings; and there was a great earthquake, such as was not since men were upon the earth, so mighty an earthquake, and so great. And the great city was divided into three parts, and the cities of the nations fell: and great Babylon came in remembrance before God, to give unto her the cup of the wine of the fierceness of his wrath. And every island fled away, and the mountains were not found." (Revelation 16:18-20).
This world will be uninhabitable by people after Christ comes. His coming will shake the very foundations of the earth.

His Coming Will Mean Final Judgment
"For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works." (Matthew 16:27).
"And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be." (Revelation 22:12).
It is at Christ's return that we will receive our final reward. Each person's decision will have already been made; there will be no second chance to convert. The time to make a decision to follow Christ is now!

 

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Basis for Confusion
With so much evidence in the Bible as to the manner of Christ's coming, how did people get the idea that the rapture will be a secret event
As with most deceptions, the secret rapture theory is based on a few texts which have been taken out of context. There are two main concepts in Scripture that have been used to substantiate a "secret" rapture.
The primary one is that Jesus will come as "a thief in the night." The secret rapture theory as- sumes this means that Christ will come secretly to steal away the righteous and carry them quietly to heaven.
Christ's coming is described as "a thief" several times throughout the New Testament. Let's look at one of these passages and see if it describes a secret rapture. "But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up." (2 Peter 3:10). That doesn't sound like a secret event, does it
In describing His return as a thief, Christ did not intend to show that it would be quiet, but that it would be sudden and unexpected-that the wicked would be taken by surprise. He said, "If the goodman of the house had known what hour the thief would come, he would have watched, and not have suffered his house to be broken through. Be ye therefore ready also: for the Son of man cometh at an hour when ye think not." (Luke 12:39, 40). Likewise, Paul told the Christians in Thessalonica, "But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief." (1 Thessalonians 5:4). God does not want His followers to be surprised. He wants us to be watchful and ready.
To further illustrate this truth, Jesus said,"No one can enter a strong man's house and plunder his goods, unless he first binds the strong man. And then he will plunder his house" (Mark 3:27, NKJV).
Can you picture a homeowner being oblivious to a robbery if the thief just broke into the man's house, tied him up and threw him in a closet, and then ransacked the place while searching for valuables Of course not!
In the same way, the day and hour of the second coming is a secret, but when the glorious event transpires, all will know!
The second concept used to support a "secret" coming is found in Luke 17:34-36: "I tell you, in that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other shall be left. Two women shall be grinding together; the one shall be taken, and the other left. Two men shall be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left."
Secret rapture proponents say this passage proves that the saints will suddenly disappear from the earth when Jesus returns. But let's take an honest look at the evidence and see what these verses actually teach.
In Luke 17:34-36, Jesus employs some of His favorite symbols to illustrate a simple point. At the end of time, there will be just two groups of people living upon the earth-the lost and the saved.
• "Two men in one bed." A bed generally connotes sleep, and Jesus used sleep as a symbol of death. He said to the disciples, "Our friend Lazarus sleepeth; but I go, that I may awake him out of sleep." "Then said Jesus unto them plainly, Lazarus is dead." (John 11:11, 14). In the resurrection at the last day, there will be two kinds of people sleeping in the grave-the lost and the saved.

• "Two women grinding together." In Bible prophecy, a woman is a symbol of a church (Jeremiah 6:2). Grinding grain represents working with the Word of God. When Christ comes in glory, there will be two kinds of churches-the false and the true. Both will be outwardly doing the same thing, but only one will be redeemed.

• "Two men in the field." The field represents the world (Matthew 13:38). When Jesus comes again, there will be two kinds of missionaries laboring out in the field-the false and the true. This is why He said, "Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name and in thy name have cast out devils and in thy name done many wonderful works And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity." (Matthew 7:22, 23).
Not Left Behind
Another common misconception contained in the secret rapture theory is that people will continue to live here on earth for several years after Christ's return. However, the Bible clearly teaches that when Jesus comes next, there will be no one left alive on this planet.
For example, in his prophecy about the end of the age, Jeremiah wrote:"I beheld the earth, and, lo, it was without form, and void; and the heavens, and they had no light. I beheld the mountains, and, lo, they trembled, and all the hills moved lightly. I beheld, and lo, there was no man, and all the birds of the heavens were fled. I beheld, and lo, the fruitful place was a wilderness, and all the cities thereof were broken down at the presence of the Lord, and by his fierce anger: (Jeremiah 4:23-26, emphasis added).
In another place he declared,"And the slain of the Lord shall be at that day from one end of the earth even unto the other end of the earth: They shall not be lamented, neither gathered, nor buried; they shall be dung upon the ground: (Jeremiah 25:33)
The prophet Isaiah describes the same dismal conditions in his prophecy of the state of the earth following the second coming. "Behold, the Lord maketh the earth empty, and maketh it waste, and turneth it upside down, and scattereth aboad the inhabitants thereof." "The land shall be utterly emptied, and utterly spoiled:for the Lord hath spoken this word: (Isaiah 24:1,3, emphasis added).
Last but not least, consider the following passage of Scripture:"And as it was in the days of Noe [Greek for 'Noah'], so shall it be also in the days of the Son of man. They did eat, they drank, they married wives, they were given in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark, and the flood came, and destroyed them all. Likewise also as it was in the days of Lot; they did eat, they drank, they bought, they sold, they planted, they builded; But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all. Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed:" (Luke 17:26-30, emphasis added).

 

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Notice that the wicked were detroyed on the same day that the Flood came to Noah and on the same day that the fire came to Sodom. Jesus emphasizes at both the beginning and the end of this passage that these earlier judgments, which destroyed all of the wicked, were examples of what would happen at His second coming. The Bible is crystal clear that life on earth does not continue for either man or beast after Jesus comes.
Through the Tribulation With Christ
The idea that the righteous will all be raptured out of the world just before the time of trouble and that only the wicked will be left behind to endure seven years of tribulation can be very appealing. Perhaps that is why this doctrine has gained such widestred acceptance. But the Bible clearly teaches otherwise.
The phrase "seven years of tribulation" does not appear anywhere in Scripture. However, Jesus did say that a terrible time of trouble would come upon the world just before His return and that it would be more intense than any other in the history of this world. In His great prophetic discourse on the Mount of Olives, Jesus made the following statement: "For then shall be great tribulation,such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be. And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect"s sake those days shall be shortened: (Matthew 24:21-22).
If the elect were not in the world during the great tribulation, they would not need the days to be shortened!
All throughout Scripture we see examples of the Lord saving His people though tribulation, not from it.
• Noah was not saved from the Flood, but through it.
• Daniel was not saved from the lions' den, but through it.
• Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego were not were not saved from the fiery furnace, but through it. In fact, Jesus went through it with them, and He will go through the great tribulation with us, as well!
• The children of Israel were not saved from Egypt before the plagues fell, but afterward. God demonstrated His love and power by preserving them in Egypt through the 10 plagues. In the same way, the righteous will be in the world when the seven last plagues fall (revelation chapter 16), but God will preserve them.
God never promises that our lives will always be easy. Christ prayed to His Father for His disciples, "I pray not that thou shouldest take them out of the world, but that thou shouldest keep them from the evil [one]" (John 17:15). Likewise, in 2 Timothy 3:12 Paul states, "All that will live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution." Paul also told a group of disciples that "We must through much tribulation enter into the kingdom of God" (Acts 14:22).
In His parable of the two home builders, Jesus taught that the storm comes to the wise man who builds on the rock just as surely as it comes to the fool who builds upon the sand (Matthew 7:24-27). The storm will come to all.
The good news is that God's children will survive the coming tribulation. They will endure by practicing some of the same survival skills used by the Great Basin bristlecone pine. Believed to be one of the oldest living trees on the planet, it can live more than 4,000 years. Found on lonely mountaintops, some of these ancient evergreens have weathered thousands of years of intense freezing wind, pounding rain, scorching sun, and violent electrical storms.
How do they manage to survive such harsh, adverse conditions They send their roots deep, wrap them tenaciously around a solid rock, and hang on.
In the same way, the saints will have to sink their roots of faith deep into the Word of God and cling tenaciously to the mighty Rock of Ages.
Remember that even though God does not always provide an escape from tribulation, He does promise to give us the power and strength to get through it. "I can do all things through Christ which strengtheneth me" (Philippians 4:13)
Times of Trouble
As we discuss the great tribulation to take place just before Jesus returns, keep in mind that there have been several other "times of trouble" for God's people in the past.
For example, the children of Israel endured 400 years of tribulation just before the Exodus (Acts 7:6). The early Christians also passed through a time of trouble immediately after the stoning of Stephen (Acts 8:1). From A.D. 303-313,during the era represented by the Smyrna church (Revelation 2:10), God's people suffered a 10-year period of tribulation. But perhaps the most notable time of trouble was the 1,260 years of intense persecution waged against true Christians during the Dark Ages. "And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days." "And when the dragon saw that he was cast unto the earth, he persecuted the woman which brought forth the man child" (Revelation 12: 6,13).
As dark as each of these times was for God's people none will compare with the final, great tribulation that is yet to take place. The great tribulation corresponds with the time during which the seven last plagues of Revelation chapter 16 will "fall. "And I saw another sign in heaven, great and marvellous, seven angels having the seven last plagues; for in them is filled up the wrath of God" (Revelation 15:1).
God's wrath will be directed against the ones who disobey His law, distort His truth, and oppress His people. "For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness " (Romans 1:18).
The great tribulation also coincides with the Battle of Armageddon. Both take place immediately before Christ's second coming. "And he gathered them together into a place called in the Hebrew tongue Armageddon. And the seventh angel poured out his vial into the air; and there came a great voice out of the temple of heaven, from the throne, saying, It is doneRevelation 16:16-17).
It is my belief that the great time of trouble will last only a month or two. Here are a few Scriptures that indicate it will be a short period of time.
Revelation 18:8 tells us, "Therefore shall her plagues come in one day." A "day" in Bible prophecy represents one literal year (Ezekiel 4:6;Numbers 14:34;Luke 13:32). So when Revelation says that "her plagues come in one day," it means within, or less than, one year's time.
Furthermore, the very nature of the seven last plagues-the rivers and seas turning to blood and the planet being scorched with great heat- would render it impossible for the human race to survive more than a month or two. This is why Jesus said, "And unless those days were shorened, no flesh would be saved; but for the elect's sake those days will be shortened" (Matthew 24:22, NKJV).

 

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Just Before the Plagues
Since the experience of the children of Israel just before the plagues fell on Egypt is a type, or symbol, of what will happen to God's people before the seven last plagues described in Revelation chapter 16, let's examine that story more closely.
After 400 years of slavery, the Israelites had become influenced by the religion of Egypt and had lost sight of God's law. So before Moses and Aaron met with the Pharaoh, they first met with the leaders of Israel to encourage a revival of commitment to God's law-including the Sabbath of creation (Exodus 4:29-31). The people responded wholeheartedly, which is why the Pharaoh got angry and said to Moses and Aaron, "You make them rest from their labor!" (Exodus 5:5, NKJV). Remember that the children of Israel knew the Sabbath was part of God's law before they ever came to Mount Sinai (Exodus 16:22-28).
Likewise, before the onset of the great tribulation, special attention will once again be called to the subject of worship and the Sabbath commandment. In Revelation 14:7, an angel calls God's people to "worship him that made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and the fountains of waters." The angel is clearly quoting from the Sabbath commandment, which says, "For in six days the Lord made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day" (Exodus 20:11).
A widespread rediscovery of the law of God, including the Sabbath truth, will be the alarm that wakes the dragon to fury. The devil hates the Sabbath because he knows that all love relationships are built upon time. If he can destroy the day that was set apart for God's people to spend quality time with their Creator, he can destroy the relationship. We see this happen over and over again between husbands and wives or between fathers and sons. If two people stop spending quality time together, soon the relationship will fall apart.
When the children of Israel responded to God's call to keep the seventh-day Sabbath holy, the Pharaoh became furious. He knew that as long as the people focused only on work, work, work, they would have no time to think about freedom. The devil is using the very same strategy today. His goal is to keep people so busy with work and so preoccupied with the cares of this life that they have no time to worship their Creator. He knows that if he can cause people to neglect the Sabbath rest, they will never have time to think seriously of salvation.
Looking down through history to the end of time, the Lord knew that His faithful people would keep the Sabbath of the fourth commandment. That is why, in connection with the tribulation, Jesus advises His followers to "pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day" (Matthew 24:20).
Another way in which this small time of trouble will resemble the period of time just before the plagues fell on Egypt is that God's people will be called upon to endure a period of bitter hardship. In Moses' day, the angry Pharaoh tried to turn the hearts of his Israelite slaves against their God by forcing them to produce the usual quota of bricks without providing the necessary straw.
In the same way, before the tribulation the government will use political and economic sanctions to pressure God's end-time people into re- ceiving the mark of the beast. During this time the saints will be called upon to share their faith in the face of stiff social, political, and religious opposition. "And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name" (Revelation 13:17).
When this fails to deter the people of God from obedience, there will be a final death decree. The Bible says, " And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed" (Revelation 13:15). At this time, the great tribulation begins and the seven last plagues start to fall.
The time of trouble begins with the wrath of the devil against God's obedient children (Revelation 12:17) and ends with the wrath of God against the ones who obey the beast (Revelation 14:9-10).
No Second Chance
The main reason this last period of time will be so intense is because it will come after probation closes for the lost. God gave the very first prophecy about it to His servant Daniel, who wrote, "At that time shall Michael stand up, the great prince which standeth for the children of thy people: and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book" (Daniel 12:1). Notice that when the great tribulation begins, the cases of all people will have been forever decided.
The door of salvation and grace will close for the world-just as the door on the ark closed seven days before the Flood began. At that time Jesus will declare, "He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still: and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still: and he that is holy, let him be holy still. And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give to every man according as his work shall be" (Revelation 22:11-12).
For the first time in the world's history, God's Spirit will be completely withdrawn from the lost. The unsaved will be given wholly over to demonic control. The saved will be forever sealed and the lost forever lost. No more changing teams!
God on Trial
If no one is converted by the plagues, then why does the Lord allow them
For thousands of years God's Spirit has worked in the hearts of men. But He has warned that this would not always be so (Genesis 6:3). Satan must have an opportunity to demonstrate what a world that is completely under his power would be like. And so God will finally allow the winds of strife to blow unhindered-but not before His servants are sealed (Revelation 7:1-3).
The great tribulation will prove to the universe that nothing-not even the worst conditions in the history of the world-would change the characters of those still alive upon the earth. God's people will trust Him no matter what, and His enemies will rebel agaist Him no matter what.
Sometimes adversity brings a lost soul to repentance, but as the seven last plagues are being poured out, the wicked will reveal that there are no longer any redeemable threads in their fabric. The following three verses prove this point:

 

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"The fourth angel poured out his vial upon the sun; and power was given unto him to scorch men with fire. And men were scorched with great heat, and blasphemed the name of God, which hath power over these plagues; and they repented not to give him glory" (Revelation 16:8-9).
"They blasphemed the God of heaven because of their pains and their sores, and did not repent of their deeds" (Revelation 16:11, NKJV).
"Men blasphemed God because of the plague of the hail; for the plague thereof was exceeding great" (Revelation 16:21).
No Need to Fear
Perhaps your picture of the great tribulation has always resembled this terrifying recipe:
"Pour the entire contents of Armageddon into a pressure cooker, then slowly mix in the seven last plagues with one full bottle of Jacob's trouble and one whole crushed Babylon. Next, evenly stir in two full boxes of wrath-one from God and one from Satan. Cover securely and cook on high."
We all seem to conjure up frightening images when we think of the coming tribulation. Do yourself a favor; try this instead. Picture Jesus in a fragile little boat on a dark sea, with the waves mounting and wind roaring. Mark 4:38-40 records the scene: "He was in the hinder part of the ship, asleep on a pillow: and they awake him, and say unto him, Master, carest thou not that we perish And he arose, and rebuked the wind, and said unto the sea, Peace, be still. And the wind ceased, and there was a great calm."
Then Christ said to them, "Why are ye so fearful how is it that ye have no faith" Jesus rested with the peace of a baby because He lived by faith in His heavenly Father. One message He delivered repeatedly throughout His ministry was "Fear not."
In John 16:33, Jesus said, "These things I have spoken unto you, that in me ye might have peace. In the world ye shall have tribulation: but be of good cheer; I have overcome the world."
God does not want us to live by fear, but rather by faith. "There is no fear in love; but perfect love casteth out fear: because fear hath torment. He that feareth is not made perfect in love" (1 John 4:18).
During the world's darkest hour and greatest trial, God will supply the greatest peace and faith. We need only to remember that Jesus is in the boat with us. Though the furnace be heated seven times over, we can pass safely through it if Jesus is at our side.
The ninety-first Psalm contains special promises for those living during the last great tribulation. It says, "You shall not be afraid of the terror by night, Nor of the arrow that flies by day, Nor of the pestilence that walks in darkness, Nor of the destruction that lays waste at noonday. A thousand may fall at your side, And ten thousand at your right hand; But it shall not come near you. Only with your eyes shall you look, And see the reward of the wicked" (Psalm 91:5-8, NKJV).
The Psalmist makes it clear we will be in the midst of the world during the plagues, yet remain untouched, if God is our refuge. "No evil shall befall you, Nor shall any plague come near your dwelling" (Psalm 91:10, NKJV).

Sorry lots of info but i find if I dont go through every thing then People just dont seem to see what im gettin at blessings hope this answeres your question.