The Book of life,

Dave M

Dave M

Loyal
Revelation 22,-18
19. and if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part from the Book of Life, from the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.

The book of life is mentioned in Gods word many times. Jesus even tells us in revelation 22 that if you mess around with the prophecy of revelation you are going to be removed from the book of life. That sure sounds like you had salvation, and lost it to me.

Revelations 3,-5
5. He who overcomes shall be clothed in white garments, and I will not blot out his name from the Book of Life; but I will confess his name before My Father and before His angels.

In Revelation 3 we see Jesus telling us we must overcome, this is a common theme throughout the book of revelation and used 8 times! And what a harsh warning it is, if we do not over come he will blot us out of the book of life. That sure sounds like you had salvation and lost it to me. It is so important to understand. Are you ready to die for the name of Jesus or would you deny him to stay alive?

Revelation 17,-8
The beast that you saw was, and is not, and will ascend out of the bottomless pit and go to perdition. And those who dwell on the earth will marvel, whose names are not written in the Book of Life from the foundation of the world, when they see the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.

And for those that think we all people start off in the book of life and if your blotted out that is not loosing salvation, in Revelation 17 we see clearly that not all people names are written in the book of life.

So my point is read the word for youself make your own decison, do not trust anyone who paints a easy path to heaven, no wear in Jesus word does he say it is easy, he tells us we must deny ourself, we must take up are cross, we must love him more then our family, that the path is narrow the way is hard and few find it. If you are not 100% commited to Jesus and his word you need to be, you are either all in are not in at all.

Do a self check to see. Do you have a personal relation ship with Jesus, is he the first person you run to when things are good, he is the first you run to when things are tough. Do you trust his word more then anything else in the world. Do a audit on your time, money, and thoughts, and you will know where your heart is. He should be in your every thought, you should be spending time with him alone, you should be producing fruit for the kingdom. Do you spend more money on pleasure and comfort and hobbies entertainment then on the kingdom. Check yourself, Jesus loves us, he will give you a new heart and spirit, but you have to be intentional with your relation ship with him, you will see God working in your life that you never thought possible.

Praise Jesus my King, he want to help us, because no way can we overcome with out him giving us the strength trust in him alone !
 
When someone tells the truth, all I can say is AMEN!

Someone will still say salvation cannot be lost even with the verses posted here.

From the very beginning the LORD said he will blot peoples name out to sin against him.

Exodus 32: 30 - 33
30 And it came to pass on the morrow, that Moses said unto the people, Ye have sinned a great sin: and now I will go up unto the Lord; peradventure I shall make an atonement for your sin.

31 And Moses returned unto the Lord, and said, Oh, this people have sinned a great sin, and have made them gods of gold.

32 Yet now, if thou wilt forgive their sin--; and if not, blot me, I pray thee, out of thy book which thou hast written.

33 And the Lord said unto Moses, Whosoever hath sinned against me, him will I blot out of my book.

So if someone name was in the book of life and he/she decides to sin against God willfully then that name will be blotted out.
 
Matthew 24:13

I know I don't have the strength to endure unto the end so when through faith and the Holy Spirit I do endure, all credit will be His.
 
Dave M said:
The book of life is mentioned in Gods word many times. Jesus even tells us in revelation 22 that if you mess around with the prophecy of revelation you are going to be removed from the book of life. That sure sounds like you had salvation, and lost it to me.
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All names start off in the book of life. There is only scripture that says they can be removed.

When Jesus tells His disciples to “rejoice, because your names are written in heaven” (Luke 10:20), He is implying that they should rejoice because their names have not been removed.

As for Rev 17:8, with your bolding and highlighting you appear to be pushing a twisting of the meaning.

Rev 17:8 The beast that you saw was, and is not, and will ascend out of the bottomless pit and go to perdition. And those who dwell on the earth will marvel, whose names are not written in the Book of Life from the foundation of the world, when they see the beast that was, and is not, and yet is.

The “Book of Life from the foundation of the world” is a noun. It does not establish Calvinistic foreknowledge or prove that these individuals never had their names written in the Book of Life.

Consider these passages concerning the Book of Life, God's desire for salvation, His impartiality, and individual accountability:
  • Revelation 3:5, Jesus promises not to blot out the overcomer's name from the Book of Life.
  • Exodus 32:32–33, God speaks of blotting a person out of His book.
  • Psalm 69:28, David speaks of the wicked being blotted out of the book of the living.
  • 1 Timothy 2:3–4, God desires all people to be saved and come to the knowledge of the truth.
  • 2 Peter 3:9, God is not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.
  • Ezekiel 18:23, God says He takes no pleasure in the death of the wicked, but desires that they turn and live.
  • Ezekiel 18:32, God says He has no pleasure in the death of anyone who dies.
  • Romans 2:11, there is no respect of persons with God.
  • Acts 10:34–35, God is no respecter of persons and accepts those from every nation who fear Him and work righteousness.
  • Deuteronomy 1:39, the children who did not yet know good from evil were distinguished from the rebellious generation facing judgment.
  • Jonah 4:11, God expresses concern for those who cannot discern between their right hand and their left hand.
 
KingJ said:
All names start off in the book of life. There is only scripture that says they can be removed.
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Can you provide scripture to prove this claim? Or you just want to defend your position?

This is how your name gets into the book of life

Malachi 3: 16 - 17
16 Then they that feared the Lord spake often one to another: and the Lord hearkened, and heard it, and a book of remembrance was written before him for them that feared the Lord, and that thought upon his name.

17 And they shall be mine, saith the Lord of hosts, in that day when I make up my jewels; and I will spare them, as a man spareth his own son that serveth him.
 
Dave M said:
pretty straight forward and easy to see --Revelations say otherwise whose names are not written in the Book of Life from the foundation of the world,
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You are making a reading blunder. It is a Calvinistic reading of Rev 17:8 and reaching for a verse that supports non-OSAS.

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But what about Revelation 13:8 and 17:8?

(1) In both these passages the words, “has not been written,” are in the perfect tense. Remember that the perfect tense, unaffected by context or a particular verbal idea, refers to completed past action with existing results. Depending on the verb and the context, the emphasis may be on the accomplished action, the consummative perfect. Or, the emphasis may be on the existing state, the results without any thought or emphasis on the past, the intensive perfect. And of course, if the context suggests, the emphasis can be on both the completion and results.

(2) The verb used to illustrate the intensive perfect in grammar after grammar is the word “to write,” graptein, which in the perfect, gegraptai, means “to stand written.” When the negative “no” is added, it could mean: (a) it was never written in the book, or (b) it does not stand (remain) written. Why does it not remain written? If the above proposal is correct it is because their names are blotted out at death because they had refused to believe in the Lord Jesus Christ.

(3) Some might argue that in Revelation 13:8 and 17:8 the names of the beast worshippers are already viewed as removed from the book of life, that is removed or absent from the book of life before death. But those mentioned in these two passages are the earth dwellers, those who worship and marvel at the beast and who receive his mark. Receiving the mark of the beast is a clear indication of complete rejection of Jesus Christ; it demonstrates that the possessor of the mark has reached such a place or condition of hardness that it precludes repentance or faith in Christ. Receiving the mark of the beast, then, terminates one’s chance to receive Jesus Christ. It is equivalent to death for Tribulation people. It is proof they will never receive Jesus Christ, and God knows this absolutely. This is similar to the unpardonable sin of blasphemy against the Holy Spirit that could only occur during the life of Christ on earth (Matt. 12).

(4) By contrast compare Isaiah 4:1-3 and Daniel 12:1. Both of these passages anticipate the blessings of the millennium following the Tribulation. Further, they are dealing with the remnant, those left at the end of the Tribulation who were not killed by the beast and who did not receive his mark, those whose names are still recorded in the book of life. These believers will go into the millennium and will experience its blessings.

(5) What about the words “from the foundation of the world”? In Revelation 13:8 these words are grammatically connected with “the Lamb who has been slain.” Literally the Greek reads, whose names “do not stand written in the book of life of the Lamb, who was slain from the foundation of the world.” This statement compares with Acts 2:23 and 1 Peter 1:20. It is the Lamb whose death was ordained from the foundation of the world. In Revelation 17:8, however, the construction is different. Here “from the foundation of the world” is connected with “the book of life.” Literally the Greek says, “whose names do not stand written in the book of life from the foundation of the world.” The book itself exists from the foundation of the world. The removal of names does not occur until death, or in this case, until they take the mark of the beast.


 
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JunoTheServant said:
Can you provide scripture to prove this claim? Or you just want to defend your position?
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There is no scripture that explicitly states your name is in the book of life from day 1.

I arrive at it from these two facts.

1. There is only scripture that states your name can be removed.

Revelation 3:5 says Christ will not blot out the name of the one who overcomes. Exodus 32:33 also speaks of God blotting someone out of His book.

2. God is just.

The consequence of not having one's name in the Book of Life is being cast into the lake of fire (Revelation 20:15).

Therefore, if you teach what you and @Dave M do, you would be representing God as unjust and Job says it should be unthinkable for God to pervert justice Job 34:12.

Just = God will not send babies and children to eternal punishment.

JunoTheServant said:
This is how your name gets into the book of life
Malachi 3: 16 - 17
16 Then they that feared the Lord spake often one to another: and the Lord hearkened, and heard it, and a book of remembrance was written before him for them that feared the Lord, and that thought upon his name.

17 And they shall be mine, saith the Lord of hosts, in that day when I make up my jewels; and I will spare them, as a man spareth his own son that serveth him.
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You are quoting a separate book.

In addition to the book of life, there are other categories of records or books mentioned in Scripture. These are:

(1) Book of Wars: Numbers 21:14. This was a collection of war songs celebrating the glorious acts of God on behalf of Israel.

(2) The Book of Jasher: Joshua 10:13; 2 Samuel 1:18. This was an early chronicle of the history of Israel.

(3) Book of Remembrance: Malachi 3:16-17; Psalm 56:8. This was a book of remembrance for special blessings and rewards for faithfulness.

(4) Book of Those Physically Alive (a dooms day book): Exodus 32:32-33. This refers to a register of the physically living. To be blotted out meant to experience physical death (cf. Exodus 17:14; Deut. 29:20; Psalm 9:5-6).

(5) The Book of Works: Revelation 20:12-13. This consists of a record of the deeds of unbelievers as a basis of their judgment proving they all fall short of the righteousness of Jesus Christ (Dan. 7:9-10; Rom. 3:19-24).

 
KingJ said:
You are quoting a separate book.
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Book of remembrance and the book of life is the same book.
KingJ said:
(3) Book of Remembrance: Malachi 3:16-17; Psalm 56:8. This was a book of remembrance for special blessings and rewards for faithfulness.
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Again the book of life reminds God to spare you. Hence why the thief said "remember me when you comest into thy kingdom". The fact that God said he spare them meant he is talking about the book of life. Anyone who gets life is spared from death.
KingJ said:
In addition to the book of life, there are other categories of records or books mentioned in Scripture. These are:

(1) Book of Wars: Numbers 21:14. This was a collection of war songs celebrating the glorious acts of God on behalf of Israel.

(2) The Book of Jasher: Joshua 10:13; 2 Samuel 1:18. This was an early chronicle of the history of Israel.

(3) Book of Remembrance: Malachi 3:16-17; Psalm 56:8. This was a book of remembrance for special blessings and rewards for faithfulness.

(4) Book of Those Physically Alive (a dooms day book): Exodus 32:32-33. This refers to a register of the physically living. To be blotted out meant to experience physical death (cf. Exodus 17:14; Deut. 29:20; Psalm 9:5-6).

(5) The Book of Works: Revelation 20:12-13. This consists of a record of the deeds of unbelievers as a basis of their judgment proving they all fall short of the righteousness of Jesus Christ (Dan. 7:9-10; Rom. 3:19-24).
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There is no book of works. The book of life or the book of remembrance are those that belong to Christ. Everyone else who is written in this Earth will die. The book of Jasher is a book just like the book of Joshua that is not in the bible. You literally made up number 4 & 5.
 
JunoTheServant said:
Book of remembrance and the book of life is the same book.

Again the book of life reminds God to spare you. Hence why the thief said "remember me when you comest into thy kingdom". The fact that God said he spare them meant he is talking about the book of life. Anyone who gets life is spared from death.

There is no book of works. The book of life or the book of remembrance are those that belong to Christ. Everyone else who is written in this Earth will die. The book of Jasher is a book just like the book of Joshua that is not in the bible. You literally made up number 4 & 5.
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Christian interpreters differ on whether Malachi's Book of Remembrance is identical to the Book of Life or is a distinct record. Some commentators connect them, while others distinguish their purposes. Therefore, neither position should be presented as an uncontested biblical fact. The question is which interpretation is best supported by the relevant passages of Scripture and, most importantly, which is consistent with God's clearly revealed character.

I have explained that my view represents God as just and yours as unjust. You need to focus your next reply on that fact.

God is just = Fact not up for debate.

Job 34:12 It is unthinkable that God pervert justice.

Your focus needs to be on Rev 20:15.

Rev 20:15 anyone not found written in the Book of Life is cast into the lake of fire.

I am presenting the argument that you are teaching that babies and children will be cast into the lake of fire.

Thereby defying many other Scriptures as Scripture is crystal clear that:

1. God is just Job 34:12,
2. He spares children from His wrath Num 14:29 and
3. Welcomes them into heaven / promised land / is always close to them 2 Sam 12:22-23, Deut 1:39, Matt 18:10.
 
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