Bill
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Indeed
Tribulation Outtakes
- Thread starter Beetow
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Beetow
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● Rev 13:7-8 . . And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to
overcome them; and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and
nations. And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not
written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.
Because we're talking about all kindreds, and tongues, and nations; then I think we
may safely assume that the "saints" in this case are possibly anyone and everybody
that can be counted as loyal to God; both Jew and Gentile. This may or may not
refer to armed conflict but for sure it's related to oppression; and it's going to be
very effective if we reckon these saints to be the innumerable crowd depicted at
Rev 7:9-17.
The Beast's management practices are extreme, but not all that unusual. Take for
example modern communist China. It's very dangerous to be openly religious in
that country, and/or hold values that differ with the regime's, where they harvest
the organs of Falun Gong adherents without their consent. The situation in North
Korea is little better where God is second place to Kim Jong-Un.
* The Lamb slain "from the foundation of the world" reveals that Jesus wasn't a
stand-by paramedic sent to an unexpected train wreck, rather; he was designated,
and scheduled, to die on a cross for the sins of the world prior to God creating even
a single atom for the current cosmos. In other words: the cross was anticipated.
(cf. 1Pet 1:18-21)
_
overcome them; and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and
nations. And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not
written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.
Because we're talking about all kindreds, and tongues, and nations; then I think we
may safely assume that the "saints" in this case are possibly anyone and everybody
that can be counted as loyal to God; both Jew and Gentile. This may or may not
refer to armed conflict but for sure it's related to oppression; and it's going to be
very effective if we reckon these saints to be the innumerable crowd depicted at
Rev 7:9-17.
The Beast's management practices are extreme, but not all that unusual. Take for
example modern communist China. It's very dangerous to be openly religious in
that country, and/or hold values that differ with the regime's, where they harvest
the organs of Falun Gong adherents without their consent. The situation in North
Korea is little better where God is second place to Kim Jong-Un.
* The Lamb slain "from the foundation of the world" reveals that Jesus wasn't a
stand-by paramedic sent to an unexpected train wreck, rather; he was designated,
and scheduled, to die on a cross for the sins of the world prior to God creating even
a single atom for the current cosmos. In other words: the cross was anticipated.
(cf. 1Pet 1:18-21)
_
Bill
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The Saints are those who walk with God and live on the planet
Beetow
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● Rev 13:8 . . All inhabitants of the earth will worship the beast— all whose names
have not been written in the book of life belonging to the Lamb that was slain from
the world.
Everything is a foregone conclusion with God; nothing surprises Him. God foresaw
the forbidden fruit incident, He foresaw Cain and Abel, He foresaw the Flood, He
foresaw the Tower of Babel, He foresaw Sodom and Gomorrah, He foresaw the
Exodus, He foresaw the Holocaust, He foresaw all the folks who won't bow to the
Beast, and He has seen the Lake of Fire and the end of the world as we know it.
There are no new believers to God. He's already foreseen every one of them back
at the very beginning just as He's seen everything else ahead of time before it
comes to pass. Ergo: if somebody's name isn't already in the lamb's book of life,
then their name will never be in there because the book is closed; it's finished.
● Eph 1:3-5 . . Praise be to the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has
blessed us in the heavenly realms with every spiritual blessing in Christ. For He
chose us in him before the creation of the world . . . in love He predestined us to be
adopted as His sons through Jesus Christ, in accordance with His pleasure and will.
_
have not been written in the book of life belonging to the Lamb that was slain from
the world.
Everything is a foregone conclusion with God; nothing surprises Him. God foresaw
the forbidden fruit incident, He foresaw Cain and Abel, He foresaw the Flood, He
foresaw the Tower of Babel, He foresaw Sodom and Gomorrah, He foresaw the
Exodus, He foresaw the Holocaust, He foresaw all the folks who won't bow to the
Beast, and He has seen the Lake of Fire and the end of the world as we know it.
There are no new believers to God. He's already foreseen every one of them back
at the very beginning just as He's seen everything else ahead of time before it
comes to pass. Ergo: if somebody's name isn't already in the lamb's book of life,
then their name will never be in there because the book is closed; it's finished.
● Eph 1:3-5 . . Praise be to the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has
blessed us in the heavenly realms with every spiritual blessing in Christ. For He
chose us in him before the creation of the world . . . in love He predestined us to be
adopted as His sons through Jesus Christ, in accordance with His pleasure and will.
_
Beetow
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● Rev 13:9a . . He who has an ear, let him hear.
This particular ear refers to paying serious attention rather than merely auditory
perception. For example:
● Deut 29:2-5 . . Moses summoned all the Israelites and said to them:
. . .Your eyes have seen all that The Lord did in Egypt to Pharaoh, to all his officials
and to all his land. With your own eyes you saw those great trials, those miraculous
signs and great wonders. But to this day The Lord has not given you a mind that
understands or eyes that see or ears that hear.
In other words: Moses' people were attentive to God's providence; and at times
even took it for granted, but were indifferent to His counseling— oftentimes His
words went in one ear and right out the other, so to speak. Samuel was just the
opposite.
● 1Sam 3:20 . . And Samuel grew, and The Lord was with him, and did let none of
His words fall to the ground.
During the awful circumstances depicted and described in the book of Revelation,
quite a few folks are going to wake up and begin looking to the Bible for answers.
I'm guessing it will be difficult, and dangerous, trying to locate copies as I suspect
the Beast will initiate something similar to Mao Zedong's cultural revolution and/or
Ray Bradbury's Fahrenheit 451 to eradicate competing ideologies.
Nevertheless; just as certain agencies at the Federal level have failed to totally
suppress so-called misinformation relative to the Covid thingy, so the Beast will fail
to prevent every last ear from hearing.
_
This particular ear refers to paying serious attention rather than merely auditory
perception. For example:
● Deut 29:2-5 . . Moses summoned all the Israelites and said to them:
. . .Your eyes have seen all that The Lord did in Egypt to Pharaoh, to all his officials
and to all his land. With your own eyes you saw those great trials, those miraculous
signs and great wonders. But to this day The Lord has not given you a mind that
understands or eyes that see or ears that hear.
In other words: Moses' people were attentive to God's providence; and at times
even took it for granted, but were indifferent to His counseling— oftentimes His
words went in one ear and right out the other, so to speak. Samuel was just the
opposite.
● 1Sam 3:20 . . And Samuel grew, and The Lord was with him, and did let none of
His words fall to the ground.
During the awful circumstances depicted and described in the book of Revelation,
quite a few folks are going to wake up and begin looking to the Bible for answers.
I'm guessing it will be difficult, and dangerous, trying to locate copies as I suspect
the Beast will initiate something similar to Mao Zedong's cultural revolution and/or
Ray Bradbury's Fahrenheit 451 to eradicate competing ideologies.
Nevertheless; just as certain agencies at the Federal level have failed to totally
suppress so-called misinformation relative to the Covid thingy, so the Beast will fail
to prevent every last ear from hearing.
_
Beetow
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● Rev 13:9b-10 . . If anyone is destined for captivity, to captivity he goes; if
anyone kills with the sword, with the sword he must be killed. Here is the
perseverance and the faith of the saints.
I think that just might be a reiteration of the perseverance and the faith of Job;
where it's said:
"In all this, Job did not sin by charging God with wrongdoing." (Job 1:22)
"Though He slay me, yet will I trust in Him" (Job 13:15
That of the prophet Habakkuk:
"Although the fig tree shall not blossom, neither shall fruit be in the vines; the labor
of the olive shall fail, and the fields shall yield no meat; the flock shall be cut off
from the fold, and there shall be no herd in the stalls: Yet I will rejoice in The Lord,
I will joy in the God of my salvation." (Hab 3:17-18)
And that of the apostle Paul:
"Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? Shall trouble or hardship or
persecution or famine or nakedness or danger or sword? As it is written: For your
sake we face death all day long; we are considered as sheep to be slaughtered."
(Rom 8:35-36)
It's generally agreed among conservative Christians that no saved person will enter
the Tribulation; but there will be a large number of lost souls saved out of it;
though at great cost to their welfare. They mustn't allow their misfortunes during
that era to persuade them that they've bought into a fraud.
* Believers are not a protected species; nor are they insulated from the slings and
arrows of outrageous fortune.
When there's a pandemic, they get sick the same as everybody else. When there's
war, they get caught up in it. When there are economic catastrophes like the Great
Depression and the housing bubble of 2008, they lose their jobs and sometimes
their nest eggs. When there are shortages of goods and services, they have to
make do with what there is the same as everybody else. When the weather
becomes disagreeable with tornadoes, hurricanes, and flooding, they lose their
homes right along with non believers. Wild fires in California burn the homes of
believers the same as everybody else's homes. Believers get cancer, they get in car
wrecks, they get taken by crime, nature drops tree limbs on them, and the
postman delivers their mail to the wrong address, etc. etc. etc.
"I have told you these things, so that in me you may have peace. In this world you
will have trouble. But take heart! I have overcome the world." (John 16:33)
When peace like a river attendeth my way,
When sorrows like sea billows roll;
Whatever my lot, thou has taught me to say:
It is well, it is well, with my soul.
(Horatio P. Spafford, 1828-1888)
_
anyone kills with the sword, with the sword he must be killed. Here is the
perseverance and the faith of the saints.
I think that just might be a reiteration of the perseverance and the faith of Job;
where it's said:
"In all this, Job did not sin by charging God with wrongdoing." (Job 1:22)
"Though He slay me, yet will I trust in Him" (Job 13:15
That of the prophet Habakkuk:
"Although the fig tree shall not blossom, neither shall fruit be in the vines; the labor
of the olive shall fail, and the fields shall yield no meat; the flock shall be cut off
from the fold, and there shall be no herd in the stalls: Yet I will rejoice in The Lord,
I will joy in the God of my salvation." (Hab 3:17-18)
And that of the apostle Paul:
"Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? Shall trouble or hardship or
persecution or famine or nakedness or danger or sword? As it is written: For your
sake we face death all day long; we are considered as sheep to be slaughtered."
(Rom 8:35-36)
It's generally agreed among conservative Christians that no saved person will enter
the Tribulation; but there will be a large number of lost souls saved out of it;
though at great cost to their welfare. They mustn't allow their misfortunes during
that era to persuade them that they've bought into a fraud.
* Believers are not a protected species; nor are they insulated from the slings and
arrows of outrageous fortune.
When there's a pandemic, they get sick the same as everybody else. When there's
war, they get caught up in it. When there are economic catastrophes like the Great
Depression and the housing bubble of 2008, they lose their jobs and sometimes
their nest eggs. When there are shortages of goods and services, they have to
make do with what there is the same as everybody else. When the weather
becomes disagreeable with tornadoes, hurricanes, and flooding, they lose their
homes right along with non believers. Wild fires in California burn the homes of
believers the same as everybody else's homes. Believers get cancer, they get in car
wrecks, they get taken by crime, nature drops tree limbs on them, and the
postman delivers their mail to the wrong address, etc. etc. etc.
"I have told you these things, so that in me you may have peace. In this world you
will have trouble. But take heart! I have overcome the world." (John 16:33)
When peace like a river attendeth my way,
When sorrows like sea billows roll;
Whatever my lot, thou has taught me to say:
It is well, it is well, with my soul.
(Horatio P. Spafford, 1828-1888)
_
Beetow
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● Rev 13:11 . . .Then I saw another beast, coming out of the earth. He had two
horns like a lamb, but he spoke like a dragon.
This particular beast will be, from all appearances, a seemingly harmless individual,
viz: he won't have the look of a menace.
For example; German SS officer Heinrich Luitpold Himmler had the look of a classic
Mr. Milquetoast; but underneath that facade was an unbelievable capacity for
cruelty, subterfuge, and murder on a grand scale. In other words: you couldn't tell
at first glance that Himmler was a monster in whose opinion human lives are
inconvenient.
_
horns like a lamb, but he spoke like a dragon.
This particular beast will be, from all appearances, a seemingly harmless individual,
viz: he won't have the look of a menace.
For example; German SS officer Heinrich Luitpold Himmler had the look of a classic
Mr. Milquetoast; but underneath that facade was an unbelievable capacity for
cruelty, subterfuge, and murder on a grand scale. In other words: you couldn't tell
at first glance that Himmler was a monster in whose opinion human lives are
inconvenient.
_
Personally, I find thst I must say this: if there is 'tribulation,' those who will be needed most indeed will be Christians. Our focus should not be on leaving earth, as it is already in heaven, rather, our focus should be unquestionably to protect and to save others from death with the graces we've been given.
In the first place, the idea of completely separating two sides of mankind while one side is being obliderated is cruel and disturbing from the standpoint of my human perception. I would prefer to be here should such an event take place, as that would be opportunity and time to protect those whom I love, even the stranger. I assure you, our God is very merciful, and He does not others to parish, but be saved. Peace with solid solutions should always be the first thing on the table.
In the first place, the idea of completely separating two sides of mankind while one side is being obliderated is cruel and disturbing from the standpoint of my human perception. I would prefer to be here should such an event take place, as that would be opportunity and time to protect those whom I love, even the stranger. I assure you, our God is very merciful, and He does not others to parish, but be saved. Peace with solid solutions should always be the first thing on the table.
Beetow
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● Rev 13:11-17 . . .Then I saw another beast, coming out of the earth . . . and he
performed great and miraculous signs, even causing fire to come down from
heaven to earth in full view of men . . . he deceived the inhabitants of the earth and
ordered them to set up an image in honor of the beast . . . He was given power to
give breath to the image of the first beast, so that it could speak and cause all who
refused to worship the image to be executed.
The dimensions of the image aren't given but I should think it will be large enough
to be imposing.
For example: side by side statues of former North Korean leaders Kim IL Sung and
Kim Jong-IL, located on Mansu Hill in Pyongyang, are 22 meters (72+ feet) tall. If
one of those statues ever came to life, it would make quite an impression because
something that big would be very difficult to fake for even a top-notch magician like
David Copperfield.
* The Greek word translated "beast" refers to dangerous animals as opposed to
peaceful critters like goats, sheep, prairie dogs, and squeaky little gerbils.
_
performed great and miraculous signs, even causing fire to come down from
heaven to earth in full view of men . . . he deceived the inhabitants of the earth and
ordered them to set up an image in honor of the beast . . . He was given power to
give breath to the image of the first beast, so that it could speak and cause all who
refused to worship the image to be executed.
The dimensions of the image aren't given but I should think it will be large enough
to be imposing.
For example: side by side statues of former North Korean leaders Kim IL Sung and
Kim Jong-IL, located on Mansu Hill in Pyongyang, are 22 meters (72+ feet) tall. If
one of those statues ever came to life, it would make quite an impression because
something that big would be very difficult to fake for even a top-notch magician like
David Copperfield.
* The Greek word translated "beast" refers to dangerous animals as opposed to
peaceful critters like goats, sheep, prairie dogs, and squeaky little gerbils.
_
Bill
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Excellent
Beetow
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● Rev 14:6-7 . . And I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven, having the
everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every
nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people, announcing with a loud voice: Fear
God, and give glory to Him; for the hour of His judgment is come: and worship Him
that made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and the fountains of waters.
The everlasting gospel is a bounce from the very first chapter of Genesis; and
reiterated at Ps 19:1-4 and Rom 1:19-20. It's very elementary; pretty much all it
says is:
1) There's a supreme being.
2) People should not take Him lightly.
3) He deserves to be held in very high esteem.
4) There's a reckoning looming on the horizon.
5) The cosmos— all of its forms of life, matter, and energy —is the result of
intelligent design.
_
everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every
nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people, announcing with a loud voice: Fear
God, and give glory to Him; for the hour of His judgment is come: and worship Him
that made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and the fountains of waters.
The everlasting gospel is a bounce from the very first chapter of Genesis; and
reiterated at Ps 19:1-4 and Rom 1:19-20. It's very elementary; pretty much all it
says is:
1) There's a supreme being.
2) People should not take Him lightly.
3) He deserves to be held in very high esteem.
4) There's a reckoning looming on the horizon.
5) The cosmos— all of its forms of life, matter, and energy —is the result of
intelligent design.
_
Beetow
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● Rev 14:9-12 . . A third angel followed them and said in a loud voice: If anyone
worships the beast and his image and receives his mark on the forehead or on the
hand, he, too, will drink of the wine of God's fury, which has been poured full
strength into the cup of his wrath.
. . . He will be tormented with burning sulfur in the presence of the holy angels and
of the Lamb. And the smoke of their torment rises forever and ever. There is no
rest day or night for those who worship the beast and his image, or for anyone who
receives the mark of his name.
The holy city depicted at Rev 21:9-27 will never experience nightfall nor darkness.
On the basis of that, some have proposed that Rev 14:9-12 is entirely symbolic
because it says that the folks assigned to the burning sulfur will be given no rest
day or night in a place where supposedly there will be no night.
However "in the presence of" doesn't necessarily mean the site of the burning
sulfur is located inside the city's walls, mostly because Rev 21:27 says: "Nothing
impure will ever enter it, nor will anyone who does what is shameful or deceitful,
but only those whose names are written in the Lamb's book of life." And also Rev
22:14-15 which says: "Blessed are those who wash their robes, that they may have
the right to the tree of life and may go through the gates into the city. Outside are
the dogs, those who practice magic arts, the sexually immoral, the murderers, the
idolaters and everyone who loves and practices falsehood."
Though there will be neither day nor night inside the city that doesn't preclude the
possibility that there will be day and night outside. At any rate; I think we have to
expect there will be no breaks in the torment but that it will be perpetual 24/7/365
with neither intermission, nor interruption, nor time off for good behavior. That will
be an awful scene; quite possibly a rather ghastly tourist attraction. (Isa 66:23-24)
● Rev 14:12 . .This calls for patient endurance on the part of the saints who obey
God's commandments and remain faithful to Jesus.
People will find themselves caught in a sort of Catch 22, so to speak. If they follow
the Beast, they'll be safe from execution but end up in the sulfur. If they follow God
and His son Jesus, they'll be safe from the sulfur but end up executed.
● Rev 14:13 . . .Then I heard a voice from heaven say: "Write: Blessed are the
dead who die in the Lord from now on. Yes, says the Spirit, they will rest from their
labor, for their deeds will follow them."
One of the deeds sure to follow those folks is their decision to remain true to God
and His son Jesus instead of following the Beast. (cf. Matt 10:22)
_
worships the beast and his image and receives his mark on the forehead or on the
hand, he, too, will drink of the wine of God's fury, which has been poured full
strength into the cup of his wrath.
. . . He will be tormented with burning sulfur in the presence of the holy angels and
of the Lamb. And the smoke of their torment rises forever and ever. There is no
rest day or night for those who worship the beast and his image, or for anyone who
receives the mark of his name.
The holy city depicted at Rev 21:9-27 will never experience nightfall nor darkness.
On the basis of that, some have proposed that Rev 14:9-12 is entirely symbolic
because it says that the folks assigned to the burning sulfur will be given no rest
day or night in a place where supposedly there will be no night.
However "in the presence of" doesn't necessarily mean the site of the burning
sulfur is located inside the city's walls, mostly because Rev 21:27 says: "Nothing
impure will ever enter it, nor will anyone who does what is shameful or deceitful,
but only those whose names are written in the Lamb's book of life." And also Rev
22:14-15 which says: "Blessed are those who wash their robes, that they may have
the right to the tree of life and may go through the gates into the city. Outside are
the dogs, those who practice magic arts, the sexually immoral, the murderers, the
idolaters and everyone who loves and practices falsehood."
Though there will be neither day nor night inside the city that doesn't preclude the
possibility that there will be day and night outside. At any rate; I think we have to
expect there will be no breaks in the torment but that it will be perpetual 24/7/365
with neither intermission, nor interruption, nor time off for good behavior. That will
be an awful scene; quite possibly a rather ghastly tourist attraction. (Isa 66:23-24)
● Rev 14:12 . .This calls for patient endurance on the part of the saints who obey
God's commandments and remain faithful to Jesus.
People will find themselves caught in a sort of Catch 22, so to speak. If they follow
the Beast, they'll be safe from execution but end up in the sulfur. If they follow God
and His son Jesus, they'll be safe from the sulfur but end up executed.
● Rev 14:13 . . .Then I heard a voice from heaven say: "Write: Blessed are the
dead who die in the Lord from now on. Yes, says the Spirit, they will rest from their
labor, for their deeds will follow them."
One of the deeds sure to follow those folks is their decision to remain true to God
and His son Jesus instead of following the Beast. (cf. Matt 10:22)
_
Beetow
Active
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● Rev 16:3 . .The second angel poured out his bowl on the sea, and it turned into
blood like that of a dead man, and every living thing in the sea died.
Fresh blood is tolerable as far as odor goes, whereas the blood of a dead man is in
a state of putrefaction; and then adding to that the carcasses and the stench of
dead fish, and everything else, will make for quite a chowder to behold.
The Mediterranean is notable in the Bible; but whether that's the sea spoken of
here is uncertain. However, in Gen 1:10 "sea" pertains to the entirety of Earth's
oceans.
A rather curious sea is located at 1Kings 7:23-26 which suggests that any
accumulation of water, whether in an ocean or on land, can be called a sea, e.g.
ponds and lakes.
● Rev 16:4 . .The third angel poured out his bowl on the rivers and springs of
water, and they became blood.
The two passages tell of water pollution on a scale quite a bit more severe than that
of Egypt because this is global rather than limited to one specific country. Even so;
Egypt's was pretty bad because there was no clean water anywhere for either
cooking, drinking, laundry, hygiene, or sanitation. (Ex 7:19-20)
_
blood like that of a dead man, and every living thing in the sea died.
Fresh blood is tolerable as far as odor goes, whereas the blood of a dead man is in
a state of putrefaction; and then adding to that the carcasses and the stench of
dead fish, and everything else, will make for quite a chowder to behold.
The Mediterranean is notable in the Bible; but whether that's the sea spoken of
here is uncertain. However, in Gen 1:10 "sea" pertains to the entirety of Earth's
oceans.
A rather curious sea is located at 1Kings 7:23-26 which suggests that any
accumulation of water, whether in an ocean or on land, can be called a sea, e.g.
ponds and lakes.
● Rev 16:4 . .The third angel poured out his bowl on the rivers and springs of
water, and they became blood.
The two passages tell of water pollution on a scale quite a bit more severe than that
of Egypt because this is global rather than limited to one specific country. Even so;
Egypt's was pretty bad because there was no clean water anywhere for either
cooking, drinking, laundry, hygiene, or sanitation. (Ex 7:19-20)
_
lentz
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The tribulation period is God dealing with Israel(Jacob's Troubles). Everything spoken of in Revelation happens in Israel.(for the most part) The two witnesses,everything takes place in Israel for Israel. The Church will no longer be on Earth at that time.
Bill
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Did you use your gift discernment to figure this out?
lentz
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Didnt take much discernment. Its wrote out plain enough.
You say you will be one of the two wittnesses or somebody.
Tell me....what tribe are you from?
Everyone mentioned is Jew. 144000
Two witnesses. Everything.
