Are the teachings of Jesus about the horror of Hell literal or metaphorical?

[Samson2020]

Math:7:13 " Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in there at:."

No New Testament had been ratified as of the time this was spoken. I.E. No righteous act (His crucifixion) had taken place yet so there was no Justification of ALL. Romans 5:18

James2:10 "Whoever keeps the whole law but stumbles at just one point is guilty of breaking all of it."

A true Christian is no longer under the law for it is simply the schoolmaster that brings us unto Christ. Rom 6:14 Gal 3:24 25

2Pet3:17 "Ye therefore, beloved, seeing ye know these things before, beware lest ye also, being led away with the error of the wicked, fall from your own steadfastness."

And that error would be trusting in anything other than the sacrifice of the Son of God for our sins.

2Pet1:5-7 "But also for this very reason, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue, to virtue knowledge, to knowledge self-control, to self-control perseverance, to perseverance godliness, to godliness brotherly kindness, and to brotherly kindness love."

???? not sure why this was added to your reply??

Christians need to seek the things that God has freely given otherwise they will fall by the wayside. Just like they freely received Christ and His righteousness.

Many many of those that claim to be Christians today are not for they have not been called nor chosen, but are rather assigned to false religion including false Christianity. In days
past the Catholic Church and the Spanish inquisition under Catholic authority were responsible for more deaths than many wars. Is this a good example of a true Christian organization?
We won't even speak to the sexual misconduct of the so called priests.

When a person meets Christ and is saved/ born again he/she is still a babe and needs to grow in Christ. By seeking the milk of the Word of God which are the Principles and Doctrines of the Ascended Christ. But if the babe does not grow it will be tossed to and fro by every wind of doctrine.

Very true if the babe has not been taught by the Holy Ghost for the only true truth is taught by Him. Not a man or any other source. 1 John 2:27

Curious why you chose to not confront any scripture used to validate my post. Though this truth is what sets one free from the horror of loved ones spending an eternity in your
misunderstood HELL.

God will bring ALL as He has proclaimed through Jesus John 12:32 , and Paul in Romans 5 and 1 Co 15
He began the process and will see it to completion contrary to anyones objections. They did not earn anything, as what they received was a gift, others have not yet received the gift
for the Father has not taught them, nor led them to Jesus.
As in all generations humans place God in a TIME box and think that He is incapable of finishing what He
started. However our Bible states that in the dispensation of the fullness of TIMES He might gather together in one, ALL things in Christ. God is not limited by time.
Eph 1:10 NLT "And this is the plan: At the right time He will bring everything together under the authority of Christ-everything in heaven and on earth."
Eph 1:10 KJV "That in the dispensation of the fullness of TIMES He might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which are on earth, even in Him.

 

[KingJ]

Have we ever considered that God started all of what has been written with a specific objective? And what exactly was/is that objective? Is it not sons of the Father who are conformed to
the image of Jesus, thus brothers?
Can anyone come to or believe in Jesus unless God teaches and draws them? What else is required to believe, is it not faith? And who is responsible for the giving of faith? Is it not God?
Indeed are not ALL things in the salvation process choices of the Father? And if this be true, then why would the Father want to eternally punish those that He did not choose in this first
death?

Would you mind clarifying your belief in simple terms please.

I take it you believe in annihilationism and Calvinism?

 

[Samson2020]

Would you mind clarifying your belief in simple terms please.

I take it you believe in annihilationism and Calvinism?

I would say no, in that if I were to categorize myself I would be a Unitarian and a Universalist. However that said what I see comes from no man as I was separated from the "church"
many many years ago and taught of the Holy Ghost pretty much exclusively.
These things you mention are not in my wheel house as I do not study other mens beliefs or statements of faith.

I believe there is 1 Almighty God, the Father of us ALL. And a Mighty God whose name we know as Jesus. For as of yet there is only one man that has ever been glorified and that
man was Gods Son in the flesh and now in the Spirit as well as He was the first and only begotten from among the dead as of yet.

I also believe that God will finish what He started as He intends to bring MANY Sons unto glory as this manifesting of these sons is what sets the creation free from the vanity it
was subjected to by Him for a higher purpose.

 

[KingJ]

I would say no, in that if I were to categorize myself I would be a Unitarian and a Universalist. However that said what I see comes from no man as I was separated from the "church"
many many years ago and taught of the Holy Ghost pretty much exclusively.
These things you mention are not in my wheel house as I do not study other mens beliefs or statements of faith.

I believe there is 1 Almighty God, the Father of us ALL. And a Mighty God whose name we know as Jesus. For as of yet there is only one man that has ever been glorified and that
man was Gods Son in the flesh and now in the Spirit as well as He was the first and only begotten from among the dead as of yet.

I also believe that God will finish what He started as He intends to bring MANY Sons unto glory as this manifesting of these sons is what sets the creation free from the vanity it
was subjected to by Him for a higher purpose.

I googled this:

Universalism, belief in the salvation of all souls

What are universalist beliefs?

Universalism is a religious denomination that shares many of the same beliefs as Christianity, but it does not accept all Christian teachings. Its followers believe that all persons can find salvation and that the souls of all people are in a constant search for improvement.

It is very understandable that some believe this. God is a good God.

Come place your vote here What to expect in hell.

 

[Samson2020]

Universalism is a religious denomination that shares many of the same beliefs as Christianity, but it does not accept all Christian teachings. Its followers believe that all persons can find salvation and that the souls of all people are in a constant search for improvement.

I said IF I had to categorize myself, I would be a UNIVERSALIST, however; using the definition you placed above I do not fit that niche exactly. As I mentioned before it is God that
started this and it is God that will finish it. The soul being in constant search for improvement???? God works all things after the counsel of His own will, so the soul is either made
to be a vessel to honor or dishonor at the whim of the Father. If the soul is changed from dishonor to one of honor this is the work of the Father as the dishonorable soul is unable
to change itself. I.E. cannot baptize itself with the Holy Ghost thus cannot be born again by its own volition.

I would like to include this as well for the skeptics:
1 Col 1:20 "And, having made peace by the blood of His cross, by Him to reconcile ALL things unto Himself; by Him, I say, whether they be
things on earth, or things in heaven."

Having quoted this verse the question is: How does this reconciliation take place? Over how many dispensations of time? Can this be a true statement if most souls are in a state of
eternal torment as believed by most?

1 Tim 4:9-11 This a faithful saying and worthy of all acceptation. For therefore we both labor and suffer reproach, because we
trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of ALL men, specially of those that believe. These things command and teach.

Two questions here. 1) How is it possible for God to be the Saviour of ALL men unless He eventually saves them ALL? Otherwise this verse is untrue.
2) Why specially those that believe? Because they are the ones to whom He has revealed His Son and His plan.

Lastly I never understood why anyone that actually understands that Jesus came to save men, not condemn them, could ever believe that the truth we are to
discover by continuing in His word that sets us free is the eternal torment of our family members, friends, children etc that were here according to Gods will
and timing, born into a Muslim, Buddhist family, or other world religion, and never called to know Jesus? Does this represent freedom to/for you???

 

[Garee]

I said IF I had to categorize myself, I would be a UNIVERSALIST, however; using the definition you placed above I do not fit that niche exactly. As I mentioned before it is God that
started this and it is God that will finish it. The soul being in constant search for improvement???? God works all things after the counsel of His own will, so the soul is either made
to be a vessel to honor or dishonor at the whim of the Father. If the soul is changed from dishonor to one of honor this is the work of the Father as the dishonorable soul is unable
to change itself. I.E. cannot baptize itself with the Holy Ghost thus cannot be born again by its own volition.

I would like to include this as well for the skeptics:
1 Col 1:20 "And, having made peace by the blood of His cross, by Him to reconcile ALL things unto Himself; by Him, I say, whether they be
things on earth, or things in heaven."

Having quoted this verse the question is: How does this reconciliation take place? Over how many dispensations of time? Can this be a true statement if most souls are in a state of
eternal torment as believed by most?

1 Tim 4:9-11 This a faithful saying and worthy of all acceptation. For therefore we both labor and suffer reproach, because we
trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of ALL men, specially of those that believe. These things command and teach.

Two questions here. 1) How is it possible for God to be the Saviour of ALL men unless He eventually saves them ALL? Otherwise this verse is untrue.
2) Why specially those that believe? Because they are the ones to whom He has revealed His Son and His plan.

Lastly I never understood why anyone that actually understands that Jesus came to save men, not condemn them, could ever believe that the truth we are to
discover by continuing in His word that sets us free is the eternal torment of our family members, friends, children etc that were here according to Gods will
and timing, born into a Muslim, Buddhist family, or other world religion, and never called to know Jesus? Does this represent freedom to/for you???

I would offer one way to look is that particular "all" is in respect to as many as the Father gave to the Son called the Elect. "As many as" reveals a remnant is in view.

John 1:12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:

Their names as born-again sons of God are written down in the lamb's book of eternal life from the foundation of the world. The six days the father did work And another book, the names of all that would be created.

The books (two) will be opened and compared. Whosoever name is not found in the lamb's book of eternal life. It will be like they were never born the first time. The book of life (everyone created) will be blank.

The former things will not be remembered or ever come to mind. New creatures not rebuilt or reconditioned.

Daniel 7:10 A fiery stream issued and came forth from before him: thousand thousands ministered unto him, and ten thousand times ten thousand stood before him: the judgment was set, and the books were opened.

Revelation 13:8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

Revelation 20:12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works

 

[Samson2020]

would offer one way to look is that particular "all" is in respect to as many as the Father gave to the Son called the Elect. "As many as" reveals a remnant is in view.

John 3:35 "The Father loveth the Son and hath given ALL things into His hand."
John 6:39 "And this is the Fathers will which hath sent me that of ALL which He hath given me (ALL THINGS) I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day."

: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works

And what would be the point of judging according to works if they were to never exist when the only thing that counts is whether or not you received the Holy Ghost, which an individual
cannot baptize themselves in. Nor can they believe in Jesus as the Son of God who died for their sins without God having mercy on them by giving them the faith necessary to believe?

As Jesus told Peter Matt 16:17 NLT "Blessed are you Simon son of John, because my Father in heaven has revealed this to you, YOU DID NOT LEARN THIS FROM ANY HUMAN BEING,
This He said in response to Peter answering that Jesus was the Christ, the Son of the living God. Matt 16:16

Now if Jesus says that no human could reveal that to Peter, then to whom could any human reveal this truth?
So then by Jesus' own words it's up to the Father to do the revealing.

 

[Bill Taylor]

I googled this:

Universalism, belief in the salvation of all souls

What are universalist beliefs?

Universalism is a religious denomination that shares many of the same beliefs as Christianity, but it does not accept all Christian teachings. Its followers believe that all persons can find salvation and that the souls of all people are in a constant search for improvement.

It is very understandable that some believe this. God is a good God.

Come place your vote here What to expect in hell.

You cannot be a Universalist and a Christian for Yashua was teaching facts and not some Wanna-be Dream Ideas.

 

[KingJ]

You cannot be a Universalist and a Christian for Yashua was teaching facts and not some Wanna-be Dream Ideas.

I don't agree. I would think a Christian who is a universalist knows God better then those who would espouse He torture souls eternally.

As 1 John 4:8 clearly says all who do not know love, do not know God, for God is love.

We all believe that people can change. Be rehabilitated. As such universalism is a completely understandable belief for any to have. The issue is that God is not a man. He knows who is beyond hope of rehab and those who will not change. This is why I believe universalism is false. Num 23:19, Jer 17:9-12.

 

[KingJ]

Two questions here. 1) How is it possible for God to be the Saviour of ALL men unless He eventually saves them ALL? Otherwise this verse is untrue.
2) Why specially those that believe? Because they are the ones to whom He has revealed His Son and His plan.

1. A good God gives 'true' free will to all. To save those who don't want to be saved would be doing evil to them. Many, like the devil himself I guess, are happier away from God. The verse you referencing needs a verse like 1 Tim 2:4 for context. God ''wishes'' that all be saved.

2. Not sure what your point here is. It seems like you are making a case for OSAS (once saved always saved). If so, I agree with OSAS. God will never abandon His children. Imagine that.

Lastly I never understood why anyone that actually understands that Jesus came to save men, not condemn them, could ever believe that the truth we are to
discover by continuing in His word that sets us free is the eternal torment of our family members, friends, children etc that were here according to Gods will
and timing, born into a Muslim, Buddhist family, or other world religion, and never called to know Jesus? Does this represent freedom to/for you???

Good point. Could not agree more.

We just need to understand that God has created a hell (Hades, lake of fire) for the wicked to exercise their free will choice to not be with Him.

I do believe that since God is good Psalm 136:1, light with no darkness in Him at all 1 John 1:5, hell will be as a nice a place as possible. But even with God trying to make it as nice a place as is possible, it is impossible for Him or anyone that is good, to do away with certain sufferings. Punishment for sin = fire. Unrepentant sinner = eternal separation.

As heart breaking as it will be, there is simply nobody in heaven that will want an unrepentant rapist, liar, thief, murderer 1 Cor 6:9-12 as a neighbor.

My whole view on torture in hell changed when I grasped that the underlying reason for people weeping and gnashing their teeth is due to separation Luke 13:28.

 

[Samson2020]

1. A good God gives 'true' free will to all. To save those who don't want to be saved would be doing evil to them. Many, like the devil himself I guess, are happier away from God. The verse you referencing needs a verse like 1 Tim 2:4 for context. God ''wishes'' that all be saved.

Well Romans 9:18 states "Therefore hath He mercy on whom He will have mercy, and whom He will He hardeneth." Pharoah was hardened a few times for God to accomplish His will.
No free will in either circumstance here.
Also Romans 9:21 "Hath not the potter power over the clay of the same lump to make one vessel unto honor and another to dishonor?" Free will?????
Ephesians 1:11 ....................being predestinated according to the purpose of Him that worketh ALL things after the counsel of His own will."

I must say here that freewill is a false doctrine. No offense intended but God has every tiny detail of all our lives on a constant path that terminates at HIS intended purpose for
every single one of us.
And I for one am grateful to understand that HIS intentions for me and you are extremely greater than we could ever imagine for ourselves.

As a side note, when I was a babe in Christ I was told to go pray for a man I did not know, but had just seen, by the Lord. I stopped and asked what to pray for for him. The
response I got was "I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy you know this." Then I was directed to look at Acts 3:6 in order to understand He was going to heal this man,
of what I did not know. Long story short bad heart and inoperable cancer. Both fixed.
Point was that He does whatsoever He will among us and we cannot do anything to stop Him or cause Him to do something that He has not already decided would be done
before the world was created as the works of God were finished BEFORE the foundation of the world.
God does not ask our permission, nor has He abdicated His throne in favor of our uneducated understanding. We see in part, prophecy in part etc... because we only know a small
part of what He is doing, though some have been given sight to see farther and more clear than others, but even they see only a part.

We just need to understand that God has created a hell (Hades, lake of fire) for the wicked to exercise their free will choice to not be with Him.

Again there is no free will. Did you choose to be born? Or when? How about what color, nationality, gender, or to what parents? Did you baptize yourself in the Holy Ghost? Or were
ALL these decisions made for you by your heavenly Father?
1 Peter 2:8 "....even to them that stumble at the word; being disobedient, whereunto they also were appointed."
"..... for the creation was subject to vanity, NOT WILLINGLY, but by reason of Him.......
Romans 8:32 NLT "For God has imprisoned everyone in disobedience so He could have mercy on everyone." Free will?????

I'll ask this question then let this go maybe. How might you imagine that God could bring ALL souls into eternal life if it is His intent? Is it possible that the second death also reaps
a harvest of new creatures that are sons of the living God, and possibly a third harvest as well?

Something to chew on can be found in Isaiah 59:21 "As for Me, this is My covenant with them, saith the LORD; My Spirit that is upon thee(Jesus), and My words which I have put
in thy mouth, shall not depart out of thy mouth, nor out of the mouth of thy seed, nor thy seed's seed, saith the LORD, from henceforth and for ever."
Keep in mind that Isaiah 9:6 tells us that Jesus shall be called everlasting Father............
Jesus never had any children but He does have His bride which are considered here to be His spiritual seed. Funny thing is this verse tells us that His seed has seed and all the seed
are spiritual seed. How is this possible? Remember He did say that there will come a time when nothing shall be impossible to us.

As heart breaking as it will be, there is simply nobody in heaven that will want an unrepentant rapist, liar, thief, murderer 1 Cor 6:9-12 as a neighbor.

These are those who are also spoken of in Romans 8:32, they just have not yet been made aware of their justification. That will come during the second or later death period.
For ALL have been justified by the one act of righteousness carried out by Jesus. Romans 5:18
In Romans 5 it continues by stating that as sin hath reigned unto death grace will reign through righteousness unto eternal life........
Saying in 20 that where sin abounded grace did MUCH MORE abound. Meaning that grace will cover ALL sin as He took away the sin of the entire world. That one act was the finishing
touch on the reconciliation of everybody.
Think about this, God decrees a condemnation on everyone ever created or born because of Adams disobedience thus sin entered and separation due to sin, but the giving of a sinless
humans life (Jesus) as a sacrifice for the sin wipes out the bill that the law charges for sin which is death. Death had its reign until Jesus was crucified and now life will reign because
of Him and the fact that God decreed that second decree in Romans 5:18 that ALL are justified because of the one righteous act.
Do we truly believe that God would condemn everyone because of Adams act of disobedience, and not provide a way for the same everyone to enter into life eternal because of
His sacrificing His only Son?
Tell me which act is more deserving of the decree, the original disobedience unto condemnation for ALL, or the laying down of a sinless life leading to life for all?
Again, no offense intended, and I hope none is taken.

"For behold the KINGDOM OF GOD IS WITHIN YOU" Luke 17:21
The only way to be thrown out is for you to not be born of the Spirit of God. We ALL have been partakers of that condemnation, and truly not because we wanted to. Even the
people who killed Jesus would not have done it if they had known who He was. But both theses things were/are the will of the Father for our good. 1 Co 2:8 Romans 8:28

 

[Bill Taylor]

I don't agree. I would think a Christian who is a universalist knows God better then those who would espouse He torture souls eternally.

As 1 John 4:8 clearly says all who do not know love, do not know God, for God is love.

We all believe that people can change. Be rehabilitated. As such universalism is a completely understandable belief for any to have. The issue is that God is not a man. He knows who is beyond hope of rehab and those who will not change. This is why I believe universalism is false. Num 23:19, Jer 17:9-12.

Revelation 20:14, Revelation 20:19, 20:15, Revelation 19:20, Matthew 18:8, Mark 9:47-48. Matthew 25:46, and many more.

Source: 18 Bible verses about Lake Of Fire,

 

[Samson2020]

We all believe that people can change. Be rehabilitated. As such universalism is a completely understandable belief for any to have. The issue is that God is not a man. He knows who is beyond hope of rehab and those who will not change. This is why I believe universalism is false

The problem here is you forget that ALL things ARE POSSIBLE with God. And the more sin that one is forgiven, according to Jesus, the more love comes from the one forgiven.
If less is forgiven then less love. More forgiven=more love.

 

[KingJ]

The problem here is you forget that ALL things ARE POSSIBLE with God. And the more sin that one is forgiven, according to Jesus, the more love comes from the one forgiven.
If less is forgiven then less love. More forgiven=more love.

I will not disagree or argue with you. I think this is a good view of God you have.

 

[KingJ]

Revelation 20:14, Revelation 20:19, 20:15, Revelation 19:20, Matthew 18:8, Mark 9:47-48. Matthew 25:46, and many more.

Source: 18 Bible verses about Lake Of Fire,

I think you are not reading that I do not agree with universalism.

 

[Bill Taylor]

I think you are not reading that I do not agree with universalism.

Then I bow my head and ask forgiveness, for you are right.

 

[Victor VanHeerden]

I googled this:

Universalism, belief in the salvation of all souls

What are universalist beliefs?

Universalism is a religious denomination that shares many of the same beliefs as Christianity, but it does not accept all Christian teachings. Its followers believe that all persons can find salvation and that the souls of all people are in a constant search for improvement.

It is very understandable that some believe this. God is a good God.

Come place your vote here What to expect in hell.

God is good wither He punishes people in hell or not. God is God. And he can do anything he desires without answering to man. Thinking that Biblical Hell is not a place of punishment by eternal torture and suffering but a much better place is not scriptural.

It is very understandable that some today do not believe this. Yet Lord Jesus, every single original Apostle, St Paul and every Church Father and majority theologians, preachers, evangelists, and scholars believe in Hell a place of unfathomable horror and destruction and punishment.

Those who believe hell is not soo bad are in the minority and are suffering from modern sensibilities - which is completely understandable.

 

[KingJ]

God is good wither He punishes people in hell or not.

Absolutely not. We understand what is good and evil just as God and the angels do Gen 3:22.

God has not got a separate code of ethics. Something like torturing those who choose sin full measure, IE those that go to hell, will be wicked from day one to eternity. The only spaces mankind and God may differ is on things like respecting the Sabbath, eating crayfish or sexual sins, like fornication and homosexuality.

We see Abraham interrogate God on the destruction of Sodom in Gen 18 and approve of His decision. We see Moses do likewise with God when the Hebrews had their golden calf in Exo 32. These two prophets, every other prophet and every single saint, will do likewise with God on eternal hell, if necessary. Which, I believe it will not be. We can already read that the angels are with God, watching as satan is placed in fire. God has got absolutely nothing to hide from good angels. Now why would that be....

God is God. And he can do anything he desires without answering to man.

This is true. Paul makes this point in Rom 9. Calvinists latch on to this out of context of all other scripture. The rest of scripture tells us what in fact God does decide to do with His omniscience and omnipotence. Namely, to be righteous in all His ways to the exclusion of none Psalm 145:17, light with no darkness 1 John 1:5, make Himself flesh and a lamb to the slaughter Isa 53:7.

As such, what you are stating and Calvinism, is a complete and utterly terrible misrepresentation of God.

Thinking that Biblical Hell is not a place of punishment by eternal torture and suffering but a much better place is not scriptural.

Please share what scripture you are referring to. Everyone who espouses a brazen bull type fire punishment or a Dante's inferno hell, are guilty of adding to scripture what is not there.

There is a warning at the end of the bible for anyone who does that.

It is very understandable that some today do not believe this. Yet Lord Jesus, every single original Apostle, St Paul and every Church Father and majority theologians, preachers, evangelists, and scholars believe in Hell a place of unfathomable horror and destruction and punishment.

I don't agree. There is no verse from any prophet stating brazen bull type punishment Brazen bull - Wikipedia.

Those who believe hell is not soo bad are in the minority and are suffering from modern sensibilities - which is completely understandable.

It is not modern thought. Prophets in the OT knew and taught of a truly good God. It is heresy that has made its way into the church. Telling people that God will torture them eternally ensures full attendance and increased offerings. There are many who have made small fortunes from writing books too.

I would not want to be one of these who are guilty of adding to scripture what is not there.

The ''ONLY' scripture in all the bible that gives a reason for weeping and gnashing of teeth is in Luke 13:28. IE Separation.

The 'ONLY' scripture that explains what type of suffering this 'fire in hell' is, is mentioned in Luke 16. IE Nothing comparable to a brazen bull style torture in fire.

I would love for you or any other to prove me wrong with actual scripture and not some book you read written by someone who had a bad dream or message void of scriptures from broken telephone.

 

[Victor VanHeerden]

Absolutely not. We understand what is good and evil just as God and the angels do Gen 3:22.

God has not got a separate code of ethics. Something like torturing those who choose sin full measure, IE those that go to hell, will be wicked from day one to eternity. The only spaces mankind and God may differ is on things like respecting the Sabbath, eating crayfish or sexual sins, like fornication and homosexuality.

We see Abraham interrogate God on the destruction of Sodom in Gen 18 and approve of His decision. We see Moses do likewise with God when the Hebrews had their golden calf in Exo 32. These two prophets, every other prophet and every single saint, will do likewise with God on eternal hell, if necessary. Which, I believe it will not be. We can already read that the angels are with God, watching as satan is placed in fire. God has got absolutely nothing to hide from good angels. Now why would that be....



This is true. Paul makes this point in Rom 9. Calvinists latch on to this out of context of all other scripture. The rest of scripture tells us what in fact God does decide to do with His omniscience and omnipotence. Namely, to be righteous in all His ways to the exclusion of none Psalm 145:17, light with no darkness 1 John 1:5, make Himself flesh and a lamb to the slaughter Isa 53:7.

As such, what you are stating and Calvinism, is a complete and utterly terrible misrepresentation of God.



Please share what scripture you are referring to. Everyone who espouses a brazen bull type fire punishment or a Dante's inferno hell, are guilty of adding to scripture what is not there.

There is a warning at the end of the bible for anyone who does that.



I don't agree. There is no verse from any prophet stating brazen bull type punishment Brazen bull - Wikipedia.



It is not modern thought. Prophets in the OT knew and taught of a truly good God. It is heresy that has made its way into the church. Telling people that God will torture them eternally ensures full attendance and increased offerings. There are many who have made small fortunes from writing books too.

I would not want to be one of these who are guilty of adding to scripture what is not there.

The ''ONLY' scripture in all the bible that gives a reason for weeping and gnashing of teeth is in Luke 13:28. IE Separation.

The 'ONLY' scripture that explains what type of suffering this 'fire in hell' is, is mentioned in Luke 16. IE Nothing comparable to a brazen bull style torture in fire.

I would love for you or any other to prove me wrong with actual scripture and not some book you read written by someone who had a bad dream or message void of scriptures from broken telephone.

Two of the greatest revivalist preachers come to mind. Johnathon Edwards and Charles Finney. Go to both on wiki. Edwards preached a sermon on Hell which led to a huge revival. Check it out. " sinners in the hands of an angry God". Don't come back and pooh pooh their sermons. When millions were saved and ended up in heaven because of their fiery preaching. People walking by who looked at Finney fell on their knees under Holy Ghost conviction of their wicked ways etc. In other words God worked using the sermons to save and deliver people bound by sin and shame. They preached openly on the horror of Hell.

 

[B-A-C]

Edwards preached a sermon on Hell which led to a huge revival. Check it out. " sinners in the hands of an angry God". Don't come back and pooh pooh their sermons. When millions were saved and ended up in heaven because of their fiery preaching.

Jesus Himself was probably one of the greatest "fire and brimstone" preachers. Guess who is speaking in all the verses below. Jesus wasn't afraid to put the fear of hell into people.

Matt 5:22; "But I say to you that everyone who is angry with his brother shall be guilty before the court; and whoever says to his brother, 'You good-for-nothing,' shall be guilty before the supreme court; and whoever says, 'You fool,' shall be guilty enough to go into the fiery hell.
Matt 5:29; "If your right eye makes you stumble, tear it out and throw it from you; for it is better for you to lose one of the parts of your body, than for your whole body to be thrown into hell.
Matt 5:30; "If your right hand makes you stumble, cut it off and throw it from you; for it is better for you to lose one of the parts of your body, than for your whole body to go into hell.
Matt 10:28; "Do not fear those who kill the body but are unable to kill the soul; but rather fear Him who is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.
Matt 18:9; "If your eye causes you to stumble, pluck it out and throw it from you. It is better for you to enter life with one eye, than to have two eyes and be cast into the fiery hell.
Matt 23:15; "Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites, because you travel around on sea and land to make one proselyte; and when he becomes one, you make him twice as much a son of hell as yourselves.
Matt 23:33; "You serpents, you brood of vipers, how will you escape the sentence of hell?
Mark 9:43; "If your hand causes you to stumble, cut it off; it is better for you to enter life crippled, than, having your two hands, to go into hell, into the unquenchable fire,
Mark 9:45; "If your foot causes you to stumble, cut it off; it is better for you to enter life lame, than, having your two feet, to be cast into hell,
Mark 9:47; "If your eye causes you to stumble, throw it out; it is better for you to enter the kingdom of God with one eye, than, having two eyes, to be cast into hell,
Luke 12:5; "But I will warn you whom to fear: fear the One who, after He has killed, has authority to cast into hell; yes, I tell you, fear Him!

Matt 11:23; "And you, Capernaum, will not be exalted to heaven, will you? You will descend to Hades; for if the miracles had occurred in Sodom which occurred in you, it would have remained to this day.
Matt 16:18; "I also say to you that you are Peter, and upon this rock I will build My church; and the gates of Hades will not overpower it.
Luke 10:15; "And you, Capernaum, will not be exalted to heaven, will you? You will be brought down to Hades!
Luke 16:23; "In Hades he lifted up his eyes, being in torment, and *saw Abraham far away and Lazarus in his bosom.

Matt 7:19; "Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire.
Matt 13:40; "So just as the tares are gathered up and burned with fire, so shall it be at the end of the age.
Matt 13:42; and will throw them into the furnace of fire; in that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
Matt 13:50; and will throw them into the furnace of fire; in that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.
Matt 18:8; "If your hand or your foot causes you to stumble, cut it off and throw it from you; it is better for you to enter life crippled or lame, than to have two hands or two feet and be cast into the eternal fire.
Matt 25:41; "Then He will also say to those on His left, 'Depart from Me, accursed ones, into the eternal fire which has been prepared for the devil and his angels;
Mark 9:43; "If your hand causes you to stumble, cut it off; it is better for you to enter life crippled, than, having your two hands, to go into hell, into the unquenchable fire,
Luke 17:29; but on the day that Lot went out from Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven and destroyed them all.
John 15:6; "If anyone does not abide in Me, he is thrown away as a branch and dries up; and they gather them, and cast them into the fire and they are burned.