once saved, always saved????

[Chad]

I once became exasperated with my life and failers and sincerely asked the Lord if He could just throw the book of my life away, and if we could start all over again...I got an immediate reply..."I cannot do that, for your salvation is in it, and I take you for better or worse...that's how much I really love you." humbled and alive, I felt soooooo loved

That was heart touching brother. Almost cried. GOD is amazing

I think once you accept Christ you are saved! BUT...if throughout your life, you turn away from Jesus and God, reject Him...and believe and idolize other things...then you are no longer saved.

I think the key to salvation is believing that Christ is the way, the truth, and the life. If you do not believe that, then you are not saved because the only way to the Father is through Christ Jesus.

John 3:16 "For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believes in Him shall not perish but have everlasting life."

Agree on this because Scripture says this clearly as well. The "Him" is Jesus Christ and only Jesus Christ will grant you grace, salvation.

I think that God has a list of people who are going to be saved in the end. That is what I think on this topic hope it helps

Well, in a way this is true because GOD knows for sure (by His infinite wisdom) who will ultimately accept Jesus Christ as Savior and die that way. However, ALL are welcomed to the offer of grace by GOD through Jesus Christ. We all have the choice to choose or reject Jesus as Lord and Savior, Son of GOD.

For all 8 people (as of current) who voted for this:

once saved always saved...no matter what (this means everything..even if you die as an athiest)

I hope you are no longer thinking this way. Why? It is not true (according to Scripture, for example John 3:16 and John 14:6) and not only that, makes no logical sense. How does one have salvation in Christ if they are atheists?

 

[SpiritLedEd]

I think that the "fear and trembling" referred to in the Philippians 2:12 citation is more like "great reverence" for God, not fear as we know it in the world.

SLE

 

[jiggyfly]

I think that the "fear and trembling" referred to in the Philippians 2:12 citation is more like "great reverence" for God, not fear as we know it in the world.

SLE

I totally agree with SLE, the greatest command is to love God not fear Him.

 

[Holly3278]

It depends on whether you are right with God or not at judgement day.

 

[trulyblezzed]

We are all sinners by nature and that's why we must "take up our cross daily". We constantly have to repent from our sinful actions, but keep in mind that true repentance is not only asking for forgiveness, but also turning away from the sinful act. Like if you go to a club and then ask for forgiveness, but then go to a club again the following weekend, it's not true repentance because you are doing the sinful act all over again! So no, I do not believe in once saved always saved. If that was the case, we would be in heaven with Whitney Houston, Jessica Simpson and anyone else who used to be Christian!

 

[MavMin]

If you can lose it then it is probabtion not salvation but I John 5:11-13 says it is salvation and you can know it.

 

[Cody]

Once saved, always saved. The Blood of Christ is permanent! We are sealed by the Holy Spirit! Once we're in God's hand, that's final. We can't be unborn of the Spirit, just like we can't be unborn of physical birth.

Ephesians 4:30
"And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption." KJV

John 10:29
"My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand." KJV

John 3:6-7
6 "That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again." KJV

Living for Christ comes naturally after someone truly gets saved. Is living for Christ the reason we go to Heaven? Is it anything we do that determines that we go to Heaven? NO! It's all God. If you think you live good enough to go to Heaven, you're badly wrong. We are filthy rags and we deserve an Eternal Hell, but it is only by the Blood of Christ that we are forgiven of our sins.

Romans 3:23
"For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;" KJV

Ephesians 2:8-9
8 "For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
9 Not of works, lest any man should boast." KJV

If you believe Jesus will cast you into Hell once you're born again, then you're calling Jesus Christ a liar. If you believe the Bible, then you won't believe Jesus will throw His people in a Lake of Fire because they didn't live good enough. Let me tell you something, no one lives good enough and the more and more I hear people go against Eternal Security, the more and more Salvation sounds like a human work salvation.

John 6:37
"All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out." KJV

Who are we to list off who's saved and who's not saved? Are we God? Do we know the real Christians or does God? I'm voting on God. He knows His sheep and they know His voice! Not everyone that says Lord, Lord will enter the kingdom of God.

John 10:27
"My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:" KJV

Matthew 7:21
"Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven." KJV

Don't deny the Power of God to keep His Sheep until the end!!!!

1 Peter 1:5
"Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time." KJV

 

[jiggyfly]

Once saved, always saved. The Blood of Christ is permanent! We are sealed by the Holy Spirit! Once we're in God's hand, that's final. We can't be unborn of the Spirit, just like we can't be unborn of physical birth.

Ephesians 4:30
"And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption." KJV

John 10:29
"My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand." KJV

John 3:6-7
6 "That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again." KJV

Living for Christ comes naturally after someone truly gets saved. Is living for Christ the reason we go to Heaven? Is it anything we do that determines that we go to Heaven? NO! It's all God. If you think you live good enough to go to Heaven, you're badly wrong. We are filthy rags and we deserve an Eternal Hell, but it is only by the Blood of Christ that we are forgiven of our sins.

Romans 3:23
"For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;" KJV

Ephesians 2:8-9
8 "For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
9 Not of works, lest any man should boast." KJV

If you believe Jesus will cast you into Hell once you're born again, then you're calling Jesus Christ a liar. If you believe the Bible, then you won't believe Jesus will throw His people in a Lake of Fire because they didn't live good enough. Let me tell you something, no one lives good enough and the more and more I hear people go against Eternal Security, the more and more Salvation sounds like a human work salvation.

John 6:37
"All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out." KJV

Who are we to list off who's saved and who's not saved? Are we God? Do we know the real Christians or does God? I'm voting on God. He knows His sheep and they know His voice! Not everyone that say Lord, Lord will enter the kingdom of God.

John 10:27
"My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:" KJV

Matthew 7:21
"Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven." KJV

Don't deny the Power of God to keep His Sheep until the end!!!!

1 Peter 1:5
"Who are kept by the power of God through faith unto salvation ready to be revealed in the last time." KJV

I guess the same can be said then about some "really being saved or not", too.

Please explain these scriptures Cody and try not to just post some more online sermons use your own words please.

John 15:1-8
1 I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman. 2 Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit. 3 Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you. 4 Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.
5 I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing. 6 If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned. 7 If ye abide in me, and my words abide in you, ye shall ask what ye will, and it shall be done unto you. 8 Herein is my Father glorified, that ye bear much fruit; so shall ye be my disciples.

I don't mind if others give their opinion but would appreciate if they would wait until Cody has posted his first. God bless

 

[Cody]

John 15:6
"If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned." KJV

That's pretty simple. That verse doesn't say a true believe will be cast into fire, it says that a person who proves not to be a true believer will be casted into fire. This passage is talking about true and false believers.

God Bless

 

[jiggyfly]

John15:2
Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit. KJV

Seems simple to me too, but verse 2 is one you seem to skip over, I wonder why?

 

[Cody]

Verse 2 is talking about those who are in church, but they are not truly followers of Christ. Religious people have the knowledge of the Bible, but we must be Born Again to be Saved.

Please read some of these verses. John 1:12,13; 3:14-18,36; 4:14; 5:25; 6:37,40,47; 10:27-30; 11:25; 17:2,3; 20:31. We must know the context of the whole book before we start interpreting single passages.

 

[jiggyfly]

Verse 2 is talking about those who are in church, but they are not truly followers of Christ. Religious people have the knowledge of the Bible, but we must be Born Again to be Saved.

Please read some of these verses. John 1:12,13; 3:14-18,36; 4:14; 5:25; 6:37,40,47; 10:27-30; 11:25; 17:2,3; 20:31. We must know the context of the whole book before we start interpreting single passages.

There is no mention of Church anywhere in this context of scripture. Jesus said "every branch in Me". What does it take to be in Christ, Cody? Does religious knowledge cause one to be found in Christ? How do you come to the opinion that in verse 2 Jesus is talking about those who go to church but are not born again or "true followers of Christ"???

by Cody John 15:6
"If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned." KJV

That's pretty simple. That verse doesn't say a true believe will be cast into fire, it says that a person who proves not to be a true believer will be casted into fire. This passage is talking about true and false believers.

Do you know what the word abide means? Webster says it means to remain, to continue or stay.I can not find anywhere in this context of scripture that talks about true believers and false believers and I even used the KJV, so please show me how you come up with this idea.

 

[MavMin]

Actually, the primary meaning of the words taketh away means to be lifted up.

1) to raise up, elevate, lift up
1a) to raise from the ground, take up: stones
1b) to raise upwards, elevate, lift up: the hand
1c) to draw up: a fish

If a tomato plant lies in the dirt it cannot produce fruit but if you lift it up, clean it off it will produce fruit. Christ can lift up a believer from the dirt to produce fruit. Seeing the next part speaks to pruning those who are producing a lot of fruit but not "quality fruit" it makes sense that both actions are redemptive in principle. Both are meant for the good of the plant.

 

[MavMin]

3. to bear away what has been raised, carry off
3a) to move from its place
3b) to take off or away what is attached to anything
3c) to remove
3d) to carry off, carry away with one
3e) to appropriate what is taken
3f) to take away from another what is his or what is committed to him, to take by force
3g) to take and apply to any use
3h) to take from among the living, either by a natural death, or by violence
3i) cause to cease

If you want to take it to its third meaning. There is a sin unto death yet that soul is saved. 1 Cor 3:10-15. The person has no fruit whatsoever but is in glory because he has the right foundation.

Paul also tells the same Church to cast out the couple living in incest in order to turn them over to the devil for the destruction of the flesh but says that their soul will be saved.

 

[Cody]

I don't believe it is talking about Christians in verse 2 because there is fruit in every Christian's life. Sometimes you have to look hard, but the fruit will be there if they are a true believer. If you believe those branches burned are referring to Christians, you're putting yourself in a difficult position. The burning of the branches would imply that once you lost your salvation, you could never get it back again. So brother, if you want to believe it that way, go ahead. Also thanks for using the King James Version. I don't know if you was trying to be smart or what, but thanks anyways.

Ephesians 2:10
"For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them." KJV

 

[jiggyfly]

Actually, the primary meaning of the words taketh away means to be lifted up.

1) to raise up, elevate, lift up
1a) to raise from the ground, take up: stones
1b) to raise upwards, elevate, lift up: the hand
1c) to draw up: a fish

If a tomato plant lies in the dirt it cannot produce fruit but if you lift it up, clean it off it will produce fruit. Christ can lift up a believer from the dirt to produce fruit. Seeing the next part speaks to pruning those who are producing a lot of fruit but not "quality fruit" it makes sense that both actions are redemptive in principle. Both are meant for the good of the plant.

What would you say is the plant?

How did you determine that verse 3 is referring to those who produce a lot of fruit lacking quality?

I'm interested in how you fit the "abiding" part into your interpretation of this context?

 

[Cody]

I believe Jesus is talking about two types of branches here. The branches of the true eleven disciples of Christ(bears fruit) and the branches of Judas, a false disciple of Christ(does not bear fruit). I say that because Jesus was talking to His disciples. I also it's obvious that Judas was never a true believer to start with.

John 6:70-71
70 "Jesus answered them, Have not I chosen you twelve, and one of you is a devil?
71 He spake of Judas Iscariot the son of Simon: for he it was that should betray him, being one of the twelve." KJV

Notice it says Judas is a devil. Judas was never a true believer and neither was the branches that didn't produce fruit.

 

[jiggyfly]

I don't believe it is talking about Christians in verse 2 because there is fruit in every Christian's life. Sometimes you have to look hard, but the fruit will be there if they are a true believer. If you believe those branches burned are referring to Christians, you're putting yourself in a difficult position. The burning of the branches would imply that once you lost your salvation, you could never get it back again. So brother, if you want to believe it that way, go ahead. Also thanks for using the King James Version. I don't know if you was trying to be smart or what, but thanks anyways.

Ephesians 2:10
"For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them." KJV

Can you support your conclusion of verse 2 with some scripture please?

Have you ever heard of purifying by way of fire or the refiner's fire.

It seems we have very different interpreting methods, yours is dictated by denominational doctrine and mine is not.

 

[MavMin]

Jesus is the Vine but a branch is part of the plant. In the dirt but attached to the branch is still abiding in the branch but it cannot produce fruit or at best a poor quality such as fleshly works thus it needs to be lifted up, shaen, cleaned and properly supported.

God does not renege. His gifts and callings are without repentance. A gift is a gift and He gives the gift of eternal life. Arminians do not undertsand the meaning of grace or gift. I need grace for I cannot earn nor keep salvation by works be they of law or flesh and only He can generate works of the Spirit in me so thus they are not mine but His. Therefore my salvation is His gift and whatever He does in me is His gift and that is why we will throw back the crowns He gives for we know the true source of the work(s) in us.

 

[Chad]

Do you know what the word abide means? Webster says it means to remain, to continue or stay.I can not find anywhere in this context of scripture that talks about true believers and false believers and I even used the KJV, so please show me how you come up with this idea.

I have to agree on this. Jesus is referring to His followers (us believers, the 'branches'). We are to abide in Him. This has absolutely nothing to do with unbelievers as they are already on their way to Hell as unbelievers of Christ in the first place.

John 15:6 refers to the judgment of believers at the judgment seat of Christ.

2 Corinthians 5:10

10For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.