The Two Witnesses? Dreams and Visions?

[Sue D.]

Ivar -- no one should be turning a blind eye towards anything that has to do with theirs or anyone else's eternal destination. Everyone will be either in heaven or hell for Eternity.

As we know the 'day' is approaching -- be it by the rapture taking place or each person's inevitable death -- though -- those being raptured up by Christ won't experience death.

However -- we Need to be showing concern for those we live around, work with, etc. even those we go to church with -- Am I truly a born-again believer. Not simply a 'believer' but a born-again one. That is essential.

The only 'sin unto death' is Not personally accepting Jesus Christ as 'our' personal Savior. Not accepting His gift of securing our personal salvation From hell and TO heaven. And the true heaven will be the New Jerusalem being brought down to earth by God, Himself. That is described in the last chapter or two of Revelation.

The New Testament assures believers that living a Christian life will Not be easy or pleasant , especially towards the 'end'. Because at some point in the future there Will be 7 years of tribulation and the last 3 1/2 yrs will be Great Tribulation. It's at That point that the Antichrist will make himself known. There have been many teachers who teach anti-Christ. Lots of them in todays' world. Anyone who teaches something rather than Jesus Christ as Son of God and His , death, burial and bodily resurrection and No works necessary on our part for our salvation -- praying through Jesus Christ to God -- no one else. are teaching false doctrine. They are teaching anti-Christ. Or even groups who take God's Word PLUS some other person's views to complete God's Word are in effect Adding To God's Word and we are told to Not do that.

 

[Sue D.]

A comment has been made that when both Catholics and Protestants can feel free to be who they are. That is 'showing love to each other' and That apparently is so 'we' can understand who the Two Witnesses are.

Sounds like you're saying -- we should just learn to love each other and that's enough. And we Should love one another -- not hating each other. However, doctrine Does make a difference. The RCC church Does teach differently than God's Word teaches. And No one 'gets saved' by means of their religion. But where does a person place their faith. No one's good works will earn them anything towards their personal salvation. The RCC Does promote purgatory and the Bible does Not.

Every born-again believer Should be a witness for Jesus Christ.

 

[Sue D.]

@Sue D.
what will happen to the people left?

They will continue to live here on earth -- at some point -- if they are still alive -- they will live through 7 years of tribulation. Lots of people won't survive most of that time. After those 7 years there will be the time when Jesus Christ Does return to earth and Will rule this world from Jerusalem. That will last for 1,000 years and satan will be bound in an abyss so he won't be able to influence the world. Then he will be loosed again but only for a short time. There Will be battles and just when God's people seem to be trapped -- God Will stop the enemy and the world, as we know it -- will come to an end. Final judgements and then those deserving hell will becast into their and those in heaven will be in New Jerusalem For Ever.

 

[Ivar]

They will continue to live here on earth -- at some point -- if they are still alive -- they will live through 7 years of tribulation. Lots of people won't survive most of that time. After those 7 years there will be the time when Jesus Christ Does return to earth and Will rule this world from Jerusalem. That will last for 1,000 years and satan will be bound in an abyss so he won't be able to influence the world. Then he will be loosed again but only for a short time. There Will be battles and just when God's people seem to be trapped -- God Will stop the enemy and the world, as we know it -- will come to an end. Final judgements and then those deserving hell will becast into their and those in heaven will be in New Jerusalem For Ever.

@Sue D.

Is there a mention of how many people specifically will be raptured?

 

[Sue D.]

Ivar -- the only people who will be raptured up by Jesus Christ will be those who have accepted Jesus Christ as personal Savior from all over this world. So , of course, there are no numbers. Each individual person CAN know that they are or are not amongst the 'saved' of this world. It's a personal decision that each person will make. Either for or against.

God is the only One with That information -- He's more concerned about each individual than in numbers.

 

[Ivar]

@Sue D.

Will the individuals raptured include the 144,000?

 

[Sue D.]

Well -- it will be kind of hard to be raptured up and out of here and be amongst the 144,000.

One reason For the 7 yrs Is so that God will be dealing Again with the non-believing Jews. Revelation 7 talks about them and vs 13 -14 identifies them.

'We' are presently in the time of the Gentiles -- but God is not finished with the Jewish people. The Jews are His chosen people.

 

[Ivar]

@Sue D.
So the non believing gentiles will be raptured and after tribulation, 144,000 elect of the seed of Israel who are still on earth will become chosen?

 

[Sue D.]

Ivar -- Anyone who is a non-believer will be left here on earth. Not raptured up.

Those who Are reached by the 144,000 Jews from the 12 tribes of Israel -- will be going out into the world to evangelize the Jewish population of non-believes.

There ARE Messianic Jews Now who will be raptured up. But those left here will be evangelized by the 144,000 Jews. The Rev. 7 passage says that multitudes from all over the world Will come to acknowledge Jesus Christ as their Savior.

 

[Ivar]

Ivar -- Anyone who is a non-believer will be left here on earth. Not raptured up.

Those who Are reached by the 144,000 Jews from the 12 tribes of Israel -- will be going out into the world to evangelize the Jewish population of non-believes.

There ARE Messianic Jews Now who will be raptured up. But those left here will be evangelized by the 144,000 Jews. The Rev. 7 passage says that multitudes from all over the world Will come to acknowledge Jesus Christ as their Savior.

@Sue D.
Is this scripture relevant concerning Rapture?

Joh 17:15 I pray not that thou shouldest take them out of the world, but that thou shouldest keep them from the evil.

 

[Bill]

Not g

A comment has been made that when both Catholics and Protestants can feel free to be who they are. That is 'showing love to each other' and That apparently is so 'we' can understand who the Two Witnesses are.

Sounds like you're saying -- we should just learn to love each other and that's enough. And we Should love one another -- not hating each other. However, doctrine Does make a difference. The RCC church Does teach differently than God's Word teaches. And No one 'gets saved' by means of their religion. But where does a person place their faith. No one's good works will earn them anything towards their personal salvation. The RCC Does promote purgatory and the Bible does Not.

Every born-again believer Should be a witness for Jesus Christ.

Not good when there is a misquote, and misunderstanding.

When both Christians and Protestants will learn it is ok to be who you are.

When Love is at the center of your hearts. (In referance to Jesus / God who is Love)

Only then will you understand the Witnesses. And you too will become God's Witnesses

 

[Bill]

A comment has been made that when both Catholics and Protestants can feel free to be who they are. That is 'showing love to each other' and That apparently is so 'we' can understand who the Two Witnesses are.

Sounds like you're saying -- we should just learn to love each other and that's enough. And we Should love one another -- not hating each other. However, doctrine Does make a difference. The RCC church Does teach differently than God's Word teaches. And No one 'gets saved' by means of their religion. But where does a person place their faith. No one's good works will earn them anything towards their personal salvation. The RCC Does promote purgatory and the Bible does Not.

Every born-again believer Should be a witness for Jesus Christ.

Sue, just to note. I like a lot of what you write. And i love your spunk. Better than many on different chat lines.

I prayed about how to respond, as you have a multi layered statement. I felt the Lord telling me not to get into an arguement. We would also go off topic as well.

So i leave you in Christ's Peace

Bill

 

[Sue D.]

@ Bill -- It's not my intention To argue over Scripture -- so -- what topic would you like to discuss.

 

[Sue D.]

@Sue D.
Is this scripture relevant concerning Rapture?

Joh 17:15 I pray not that thou shouldest take them out of the world, but that thou shouldest keep them from the evil.

Ivar -- you're lifting a verse out of it's intended context to say what you want it to say. I'm familiar with John 17 -- a beautiful, thought-provoking chapter. Two different subject areas,

 

[Ivar]

Ivar -- you're lifting a verse out of it's intended context to say what you want it to say. I'm familiar with John 17 -- a beautiful, thought-provoking chapter. Two different subject areas,

@Sue D.
Perhaps

I just find it interesting the words / prayer of Christ in relation to The Rapture.

 

[Sue D.]

Bill -- Ivar had included Catholics into the conversation. That Catholics and Protestants need to get on the same page -- again -- learn to love each other. And then correlated that with the Two Witnesses. The Two Witnesses are in Revelation and no one knows the identify of them. Lots of speculation, but no one really knows.

There Are those who feel that the RCC is the real, true Church. And that Protestants were wrong to leave it. I am a Protestant -- well -- conservative Baptist -- and Jesus Christ is the corner stone of the / His Church.

 

[Sue D.]

Ivar -- John 17 -- Jesus Christ is praying to His Father in heaven. The elect of God. This passage is simply Jesus Christ asking God the Father to protect His elect from the evil one until it is their time to be with God in glory. Nothing to do with the rapturing up of the saints by Jesus Christ in the future. He continues on to pray for the unity of all believers. The emphasis on 'all Believers'. Those who have accepted Jesus Christ as their personal Savior / Lord. Those who have placed their faith in Christ alone -- the cross -- His Blood -- sufficient for our salvation --- no works on our part is needed,

 

[Dakota]

I just don't know why god has given me scripture dreams. I mean I always beleived but when I witnessed them to non believers it's like oh Jesus nahh can't be cause the letter j wasn't invented until such and such. And the Jesus followers are like nah or just blow me off like I'm lying. But I swear to you brothers and sisters all my scripture dreams are mostly found in revelation and I dreamt of them me before I heard about them or red them literally all I knew was Jesus and he died so I can go to heaven and that there is a devil. I feel so rejected by everyone my own soon to be wife rejects the idea of god giving me dreams and she is a believer and goes to church faithfully.

 

[Dakota]

I pray daily that god heals this evil world and if it takes literally burning the whole world down to do so I just ask please Jesus hurry the world is evil and the children are becoming evil. Y'all should pray for his speedy return as I do and maybe he just will come faster than expected to fix our evil world. In the midst of spending time with family and friends and see other joy under something that reminds me how evil the world really is. Here where I am from in Louisiana a man poured boiling water down a 10 month olds diaper and beat it and the mother let it happen kept it at home for 2 days then seeked medical attention where the baby later died and a few months agona woman dowsed a baby down in gasoline on a tree and set it on fire. Jesus please heal the land whatever it takes father please.

 

[Sue D.]

Dakota -- we Are living in a very broken world. People Do crazy things. Jesus Christ will return for His own in His timing -- only God, the Father knows exactly when. And, yes, we Do see evil all around us. It won't be getting any better. Maybe we should pray that we will be faithful to God's Word. That we will have the confidence to reach out to the hurting people and share Christ with them -- the Gospel unto salvation.