Elect according to the foreknowledge of God

[romanianbeliever]

Hello @romanianbeliever,

Man can never be worthy of salvation though can he? If he could it would not have been necessary for the Lord Jesus Christ to take upon Himself the penalty for our sins and die in our place. That is why salvation is not of works, but entirely by grace.

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

Hi Chris,

God bless you and thank you for your response. Man cannot be worthy of salvation through his own works, salvation is by grace and through faith (Ephesians 2:8), an unmovable faith like that of Abraham. Romans 4:16

Grace teaches us to renounce ungodliness and worldly passions, and to live self-controlled, upright, and godly lives in the present age. Titus 2:12

Salvation is for those that will attain the image of Christ, through the work of the Holy Ghost and the members of the Church, the Body of Christ. (He gave the apostles, the prophets, the evangelists, the shepherds and teachers to equip the saints for the work of ministry, for building up the body of Christ, until we all attain to the unity of the faith and of the knowledge of the Son of God, to mature manhood, to the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ. Ephesians 4:11-13)

This is what apostle Paul was working on and praying for. (Teaching every man in all wisdom; that we may present every man perfect in Christ Jesus. Colossians 1:28 my little children, for whom I am again in the anguish of childbirth until Christ is formed in you! Galatians 4:19 and this also we pray, even your perfection. 2 Corinthians 13:9)

Why would he have worked at presenting men perfect in Christ Jesus if they were saved anyways?

 

[complete]

Hi Chris,

God bless you and thank you for your response. Man cannot be worthy of salvation through his own works, salvation is by grace and through faith (Ephesians 2:8), an unmovable faith like that of Abraham. Romans 4:16

Grace teaches us to renounce ungodliness and worldly passions, and to live self-controlled, upright, and godly lives in the present age. Titus 2:12

Salvation is for those that will attain the image of Christ, through the work of the Holy Ghost and the members of the Church, the Body of Christ. (He gave the apostles, the prophets, the evangelists, the shepherds and teachers to equip the saints for the work of ministry, for building up the body of Christ, until we all attain to the unity of the faith and of the knowledge of the Son of God, to mature manhood, to the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ. Ephesians 4:11-13)

This is what apostle Paul was working on and praying for. (Teaching every man in all wisdom; that we may present every man perfect in Christ Jesus. Colossians 1:28 my little children, for whom I am again in the anguish of childbirth until Christ is formed in you! Galatians 4:19 and this also we pray, even your perfection. 2 Corinthians 13:9)

Why would he have worked at presenting men perfect in Christ Jesus if they were saved anyways?

'For by grace are ye saved through faith;
and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Not of works, lest any man should boast.
For we are his workmanship,
created in Christ Jesus unto good works,
which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.'
(Eph 2:8-10)

Hello @romanianbeliever,

Paul was concerned about their 'state', but God had already secured their 'standing' before Him in Christ. They had been saved and sealed: but now they had to put off (by faith) the old man and his deeds, and put on the new man, which after God is created in true righteousness and holiness. It is the prize that can be lost, the crown of righteousness, but not salvation, that is sure

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[romanianbeliever]

Hello @romanianbeliever,

Paul was concerned about their 'state', but God had already secured their 'standing' before Him in Christ. They had been saved and sealed: but now they had to put off (by faith) the old man and his deeds, and put on the new man, which after God is created in true righteousness and holiness. It is the prize that can be lost, the crown of righteousness, but not salvation, that is sure

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

Chris, I had not realized I was writing with a madam.

I must warn you that you are sinning, as the Lord commands women to learn quietly with all submissiveness and does not permit a woman to teach or to exercise authority over a man, but to remain quiet. 1 Timothy 2:11 & 1 Timothy 2:12

I am basing my warning on the other posts I saw on your profile as you didn't have how to know my gender.

 

[complete]

Chris, I had not realized I was writing with a madam.

I must warn you that you are sinning, as the Lord commands women to learn quietly with all submissiveness and does not permit a woman to teach or to exercise authority over a man, but to remain quiet. 1 Timothy 2:11 & 1 Timothy 2:12

I am basing my warning on the other posts I saw on your profile as you didn't have how to know my gender.

Hello @romanianbeliever,

I am taking part in a discussion, on a forum, I am not seeking to teach, but to discuss. There is a difference, surely?

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[romanianbeliever]

Hello @romanianbeliever,

I am taking part in a discussion, on a forum, I am not seeking to teach, but to discuss. There is a difference, surely?

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

When a woman is explaining what Paul was concerned about and that sanctification is just a reward and not necessary for salvation, do you not consider it to be teaching?

'For by grace are ye saved through faith;
and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Not of works, lest any man should boast.
For we are his workmanship,
created in Christ Jesus unto good works,
which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.'
(Eph 2:8-10)

Hello @romanianbeliever,

Paul was concerned about their 'state', but God had already secured their 'standing' before Him in Christ. They had been saved and sealed: but now they had to put off (by faith) the old man and his deeds, and put on the new man, which after God is created in true righteousness and holiness. It is the prize that can be lost, the crown of righteousness, but not salvation, that is sure

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[complete]

When a woman is explaining what Paul was concerned about and that sanctification is just a reward and not necessary for salvation, do you not consider it to be teaching?

I suggest you re-read what I said, for this is not what I said at all.

 

[Brightfame52]

From my experience the Calvinistic belief of predestination is often linked to a less godly life because man doesn't need to be found worthy of salvation anymore, he is saved before the foundation of the world regardless of his deeds.

I believe you have been deceived.

 

[Butch5]

Thats True but not the physical nation of Israel.

It was the both. Israel as a nation was God's chosen people. Chosen does equate to salvation.

Right equivalent to the Church Rom 8:29-30

29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

30 Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

Eph 1:4

4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love

No. Romans 8:29-30 refers to the Jews. Not the church. Likewise, Ephesians 1:4 is speaking of the Jews. We need to keep these passages in context. In Romans 2:17 Paul turns his attention to the Jews in the Church at Rome.

17 Behold, thou art called a Jew, and restest in the law, and makest thy boast of God, (Rom. 2:1 KJV)

'You are called a Jew'. That's speaking to the Jews. He continues this discourse with the Jews in this Church until chapter 11 where he turns his attention to the Gentiles.

13 For I speak to you Gentiles, inasmuch as I am the apostle of the Gentiles, I magnify mine office: (Rom. 11:13 KJV)

What he said between 2:17 and 11:13 was addressed to the Jewish believers in the Church at Rome. Thus, those He foreknew were the Jews and people like Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob.

Likewise, In Ephesians he opens his letter to the saints and the faithful in Jesus Christ. They are two groups of people. Then we see him draw a contrast between these two groups with his use of personal plural pronouns. Of one group he says, we, us, our. Of the other group he says, you and your. His use of first and second person pronouns shows two groups. He goes on in chapter two to define these two groups as the Jews and the Gentiles.

Its much deeper than that. The word proginōskō also means

1. to have knowledge before hand
2. to foreknow
   1. of those whom God elected to salvation
3. to predestinate

And the word ginōskō does mean having an intimacy with like a husband and wife: Matt 1:25

And knew her not till she had brought forth her firstborn son: and he called his name JESUS.

Lk 1:34

Then said Mary unto the angel, How shall this be, seeing I know not a man?

She had no union with with a man

So to foreknow also denotes a foreunion of intimacy as Christ to His Church, and His Church is to be conformed to His Image, thats who Israel is, Christs Church in Union with Him.

They were in union with Him before the foundation Eph 1:4 ! And Christ is true Israel Isa 49:1-3

Listen, O isles, unto me; and hearken, ye people, from far; The Lord hath called me from the womb; from the bowels of my mother hath he made mention of my name.

2 And he hath made my mouth like a sharp sword; in the shadow of his hand hath he hid me, and made me a polished shaft; in his quiver hath he hid me;

3 And said unto me, Thou art my servant, O Israel, in whom I will be glorified.

I would submit that, to know, when used in the intimate sense is a metaphor. We don't define words by their metaphorical use. Ginosko means to know. Pro means before. The word proginosko only appears 5 times in Scripture and every time it can be understood to simply know in the past.

KJV Acts 26:5 Which knew me from the beginning, if they would testify, that after the most straitest sect of our religion I lived a Pharisee.
KJV Rom. 8:29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
KJV Rom. 11:2 God hath not cast away his people which he foreknew. Wot ye not what the scripture saith of Elias? how he maketh intercession to God against Israel, saying,
KJV 1 Pet. 1:20 Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you,
KJV 2 Pet. 3:17 Ye therefore, beloved, seeing ye know these things before, beware lest ye also, being led away with the error of the wicked, fall from your own stedfastness.

These are the five places that proginosko appears. As you can see each talks of knowing in the past.

But, we don't have to wonder who they are. Paul tells us who they are that God foreknew. They are the Jews.

I say then, Hath God cast away his people? God forbid. For I also am an Israelite, of the seed of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin.
2 God hath not cast away his people which he foreknew. Wot ye not what the scripture saith of Elias? how he maketh intercession to God against Israel, saying,
3 Lord, they have killed thy prophets, and digged down thine altars; and I am left alone, and they seek my life.
(Rom. 11:1-3 KJV)

Paul tells us that those God foreknew are the Israelites. That fits perfectly with the context. As I pointed out, this section between 2:17 and 11:13 is addressed to the Jewish believers in the Church at Rome.

 

[Butch5]

From my experience the Calvinistic belief of predestination is often linked to a less godly life because man doesn't need to be found worthy of salvation anymore, he is saved before the foundation of the world regardless of his deeds.

I think the translation, "foundation of the world" is inaccurate. We can also translate the phrase this way, the casting down of the system. What would the casting down of the system be? It would be when God kicked Adam out of the garden and put the curse on the ground. Translated this way, It also removes this idea that people were chosen before the creation of the world.

Also, that passage that they claim teaches that is misunderstood. It's actually speaking of Israel, not people being saved.

 

[complete]

@Butch5 said:-
... Likewise, In Ephesians he opens his letter to the saints and the faithful in Jesus Christ. They are two groups of people. Then we see him draw a contrast between these two groups with his use of personal plural pronouns. Of one group he says, we, us, our. Of the other group he says, you and your. His use of first and second person pronouns shows two groups. He goes on in chapter two to define these two groups as the Jews and the Gentiles. ... '

Hello Butch5,

I would like to address all of your post, but have to confine myself to this portion at the moment:-

* If what you say is true concerning the opening verses of Ephesians chapter one, the sense would be as follows:-

'Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ,
Who hath blessed us (not you) with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ:
According as He hath chosen us (not you) in Him before the foundation of the world,
that we (not you) should be holy and without blame before Him in love:
Having predestinated us (not you) unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to Himself,
according to the good pleasure of His will,
To the praise of the glory of His grace,
wherein He hath made us (not you) accepted in the beloved.
In whom we (not you) have redemption through His blood,
the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of His grace;
Wherein He hath abounded toward us (not you) in all wisdom and prudence;
Having made known unto us (not you) the mystery of His will,
according to His good pleasure which He hath purposed in Himself:
That in the dispensation of the fulness of times
He might gather together in one all things in Christ,
both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; even in Him:
In Whom also we (not you) have obtained an inheritance,
being predestinated (us and not you) according to the purpose of Him
Who worketh all things after the counsel of His Own will:
That we (not you) should be to the praise of His glory, who first trusted in Christ.
In Whom ye also (not us) trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth,
the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed,
ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,
Which is the earnest of OUR inheritance (not yours)
until the redemption of the purchased possession,
unto the praise of His glory.'
(Ephesians 1:3-14)

* Looked at in this way the error of the suggestion becomes apparent I believe.

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[complete]

It was the both. Israel as a nation was God's chosen people. Chosen does equate to salvation.

No. Romans 8:29-30 refers to the Jews. Not the church. Likewise, Ephesians 1:4 is speaking of the Jews. We need to keep these passages in context. In Romans 2:17 Paul turns his attention to the Jews in the Church at Rome.

17 Behold, thou art called a Jew, and restest in the law, and makest thy boast of God, (Rom. 2:1 KJV)

'You are called a Jew'. That's speaking to the Jews. He continues this discourse with the Jews in this Church until chapter 11 where he turns his attention to the Gentiles.

13 For I speak to you Gentiles, inasmuch as I am the apostle of the Gentiles, I magnify mine office: (Rom. 11:13 KJV)

What he said between 2:17 and 11:13 was addressed to the Jewish believers in the Church at Rome. Thus, those He foreknew were the Jews and people like Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob.

' For whom He (God) did foreknow (of the Jews),
He also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of His Son (Jews not Gentiles),
that He (Christ Jesus) might be the firstborn among many brethren (Jews not Gentiles).
Moreover whom He did predestinate (Jews not Gentiles), them He also called:
and whom He called (Jews not Gentiles), them He also justified (Jews not Gentiles):
and whom He justified (Jews not Gentiles), them He also glorified (Jews not Gentiles).
(Rom 8:29-30)

Hello @Butch5,

Above is one of the references you say applies to Jews only, but when you look at what it implies (in green) it shows that this cannot be correct.

Thank you
In Christ Jesus

 

[Brightfame52]

butch

No. Romans 8:29-30 refers to the Jews. Not the church. Likewise, Ephesians 1:4 is speaking of the Jews.

You wrong on both accounts, both of those scriptures refer to the Body of Christ

It was the both. Israel as a nation was God's chosen people. Chosen does equate to salvation.

Wrong, the Nation was callled, but only a remnant within the nation was chosen, that was the church

17 Behold, thou art called a Jew, and restest in the law, and makest thy boast of God, (Rom. 2:1 KJV)

Yeah that part way back in chpt 2 was about the jew, but chpt 1 :18ff was about the gentile among them. Paul was buiding his case that both were under sin Rom 3:9

What then? are we better than they? No, in no wise: for we have before proved both Jews and Gentiles, that they are all under sin;

Paul tells us that those God foreknew are the Israelites. That fits perfectly with the context. As I pointed out, this section between 2:17 and 11:13 is addressed to the Jewish believers in the Church at Rome.

God foreknew all chosen in Christ, and predestinated them to be conformed to the Image of His Son, the Head of the Body the Church Rom 8:29-30

Thats why Paul knew that God didnt cast away the foreknown among the jews, and he was thankful he was one of the foreknown, from among the jews, and was proof God still loved some jews from the castaway nation !

 

[Butch5]

Hello Butch5,

I would like to address all of your post, but have to confine myself to this portion at the moment:-

* If what you say is true concerning the opening verses of Ephesians chapter one, the sense would be as follows:-

'Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ,
Who hath blessed us (not you) with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ:
According as He hath chosen us (not you) in Him before the foundation of the world,
that we (not you) should be holy and without blame before Him in love:
Having predestinated us (not you) unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to Himself,
according to the good pleasure of His will,
To the praise of the glory of His grace,
wherein He hath made us (not you) accepted in the beloved.
In whom we (not you) have redemption through His blood,
the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of His grace;
Wherein He hath abounded toward us (not you) in all wisdom and prudence;
Having made known unto us (not you) the mystery of His will,
according to His good pleasure which He hath purposed in Himself:
That in the dispensation of the fulness of times
He might gather together in one all things in Christ,
both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; even in Him:
In Whom also we (not you) have obtained an inheritance,
being predestinated (us and not you) according to the purpose of Him
Who worketh all things after the counsel of His Own will:
That we (not you) should be to the praise of His glory, who first trusted in Christ.
In Whom ye also (not us) trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth,
the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed,
ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,
Which is the earnest of OUR inheritance (not yours)
until the redemption of the purchased possession,
unto the praise of His glory.'
(Ephesians 1:3-14)

* Looked at in this way the error of the suggestion becomes apparent I believe.

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

Hi Chris,

I'm really busy at the moment and will reply as time allows. Let me say this, this issue with the pronouns isn't really open for debate. It's the interpretation required by the text. It's not my opinion. The text requires that interpretation. The rules of language are fixed. They're not open to interpretation. It's the same in both the English and the Greek. His use of first and second person pronoun requires two groups.

Having said that in the first part of the chapter he tells them what God has done for the Jews. Then in verses 13 and 14 he says "and you" AFTER you heard the Gospel. Then he goes on to say he prays that God will give this same thing to the Gentiles he's writing to.

 

[Butch5]

butch



You wrong on both accounts, both of those scriptures refer to the Body of Christ



Wrong, the Nation was callled, but only a remnant within the nation was chosen, that was the church



Yeah that part way back in chpt 2 was about the jew, but chpt 1 :18ff was about the gentile among them. Paul was buiding his case that both were under sin Rom 3:9

What then? are we better than they? No, in no wise: for we have before proved both Jews and Gentiles, that they are all under sin;



God foreknew all chosen in Christ, and predestinated them to be conformed to the Image of His Son, the Head of the Body the Church Rom 8:29-30

Thats why Paul knew that God didnt cast away the foreknown among the jews, and he was thankful he was one of the foreknown, from among the jews, and was proof God still loved some jews from the castaway nation !

I don't have time to address your whole post now but can you show from the context that both passages apply to the body of Christ?

 

[Butch5]

' For whom He (God) did foreknow (of the Jews),
He also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of His Son (Jews not Gentiles),
that He (Christ Jesus) might be the firstborn among many brethren (Jews not Gentiles).
Moreover whom He did predestinate (Jews not Gentiles), them He also called:
and whom He called (Jews not Gentiles), them He also justified (Jews not Gentiles):
and whom He justified (Jews not Gentiles), them He also glorified (Jews not Gentiles).
(Rom 8:29-30)

Hello @Butch5,

Above is one of the references you say applies to Jews only, but when you look at what it implies (in green) it shows that this cannot be correct.

Thank you
In Christ Jesus

Hi Chris, please note that I said it was addressed to the Jews and was about the Jews. I didn't say it only applies to the Jews. When Paul is speaking of the past, God foreknew, he is speaking "about" Israel.

Your words in green are correct. God didn't call the Gentiles, He called Israel. God didn't predestined the Gentiles. He predestined Israel, etc. Paul gore's on in Chapter 11 to state that those God foreknew are Israelites. It's not in question

You see, that's why Paul says in Romans 11 that through Christ the Gentiles are grafted into Israel. That's how the promises apply to the Gentiles, they become Israel

 

[Brightfame52]

I don't have time to address your whole post now but can you show from the context that both passages apply to the body of Christ?

Thats fine, you in error anyway !

 

[Butch5]

Thats fine, you in error anyway !

You didn't explain how, in context, it refers to the church. Please explain.

 

[Brightfame52]

That He should see the Holy One !

Acts 22:14

14 And he said, The God of our fathers hath chosen thee, that thou shouldest know his will, and see that Just One, and shouldest hear the voice of his mouth.

The word for see here is the greek word eidō and is the same word used for see in Jn 3:3

3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

And the word does mean understand; But Paul saw Him both with the eye of understanding through the New Birth, and He of course saw Him Physically with His own eyes on the road to damascus, which qualified Him to be an Apostle.

However all the Elect of God, whom Christ did die for, have been Chosen to see Jesus with the eye of understanding through New Birth ; for to see Jesus is to see the Kingdom of God, and this seeing is a precursory to believing in Him Jn 6:40

40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Jesus through His Ministers does open their eyes, the eyes of their understanding Acts 26:28

18 To open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan unto God, that they may receive forgiveness of sins, and inheritance among them which are sanctified by faith that is in me.

Eph 1:18

The eyes of your understanding being enlightened; that ye may know what is the hope of his calling, and what the riches of the glory of his inheritance in the saints,

 

[Brightfame52]

Eph 1:4 and 2 Tim 1:9

Eph 1:4

4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

2 Tim 1:9

9 Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,

Those who were chosen in Christ before the foundation [Eph 1:4] are the ones also given to Him by the Father to give unto them eternal life Jn 17:2

2 As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.

He shouldn't give it [eternal life] to all without exception, but to only as many as given to Him Eph 1:4 !

So these would be given to Him as a reward for His suffering, which was the Joy set before Him Heb 12:2, they were given also to come to Him in Faith as for His Reward Jn 6:37

37 All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.

Those who do come to Christ in Faith had been given of the Father, and so it was given to them [who come] to believe on His Name, not for their sakes, but for Christ's behalf Phil 1:29

29 For unto you[That Believe] it is given in the behalf of Christ, not only to believe on him, but also to suffer for his sake;

Notice, it is given in behalf of Christ ! Thats because believers are given to Christ as The Father's Reward to Him for His Cross Work. Ps 2:8

8 Ask of me, and I shall give thee the heathen for thine inheritance, and the uttermost parts of the earth for thy possession.

All Saints are Christ's Inheritance Eph 1:18, neither does it matter if they are the Son's Inheritance or the Fathers because Jesus did say Jn 17:10

And all mine are thine, and thine are mine; and I am glorified in them.

Now those given to Christ by the Father before time, is the foundational cause for which they come to Him in time, so that it comes to past as Per 2 Tim 2:19

19 Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his[His Inheritance]. And, let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity.

BTW this excludes these from ever being the Lords, those He knows Matt 7:23

23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

Now this departing from iniquity as per 2 Tim 2:19 for those who are Christ's and He knows that are His, this departing from iniquity is effected by His Redeeming Death for them as Per Titus 2:14

14 Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.

For it is of the Righteousness of God that the Son of His Love has in possession those he purchased with His own Blood ! And so Faith is allotted to them all 2 Pet 1:1

Simon Peter, a servant and an apostle of Jesus Christ, to them that have obtained like precious faith with us through the righteousness of God and our Saviour Jesus Christ:

Thats why it is said of Paul it is given to believe on Christ on Christ's Behalf Phil 1:29 ! 3

 

[Butch5]

Eph 1:4 and 2 Tim 1:9

Eph 1:4

4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

2 Tim 1:9

9 Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,

Those who were chosen in Christ before the foundation [Eph 1:4] are the ones also given to Him by the Father to give unto them eternal life Jn 17:2

2 As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.

He shouldn't give it [eternal life] to all without exception, but to only as many as given to Him Eph 1:4 !

So these would be given to Him as a reward for His suffering, which was the Joy set before Him Heb 12:2, they were given also to come to Him in Faith as for His Reward Jn 6:37

37 All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.

Those who do come to Christ in Faith had been given of the Father, and so it was given to them [who come] to believe on His Name, not for their sakes, but for Christ's behalf Phil 1:29

29 For unto you[That Believe] it is given in the behalf of Christ, not only to believe on him, but also to suffer for his sake;

Notice, it is given in behalf of Christ ! Thats because believers are given to Christ as The Father's Reward to Him for His Cross Work. Ps 2:8

8 Ask of me, and I shall give thee the heathen for thine inheritance, and the uttermost parts of the earth for thy possession.

All Saints are Christ's Inheritance Eph 1:18, neither does it matter if they are the Son's Inheritance or the Fathers because Jesus did say Jn 17:10

And all mine are thine, and thine are mine; and I am glorified in them.

Now those given to Christ by the Father before time, is the foundational cause for which they come to Him in time, so that it comes to past as Per 2 Tim 2:19

19 Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his[His Inheritance]. And, let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity.

BTW this excludes these from ever being the Lords, those He knows Matt 7:23

23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

Now this departing from iniquity as per 2 Tim 2:19 for those who are Christ's and He knows that are His, this departing from iniquity is effected by His Redeeming Death for them as Per Titus 2:14

14 Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.

For it is of the Righteousness of God that the Son of His Love has in possession those he purchased with His own Blood ! And so Faith is allotted to them all 2 Pet 1:1

Simon Peter, a servant and an apostle of Jesus Christ, to them that have obtained like precious faith with us through the righteousness of God and our Saviour Jesus Christ:

Thats why it is said of Paul it is given to believe on Christ on Christ's Behalf Phil 1:29 ! 3

Instead of pulling passages from all over can you go through the context of these passages and show how they support your claim?