False ways to be saved

[Beans]

In my cfase, it was precisely the opposite; it wasn't until I fell in love with God's Word (the Bible) that I became interested in and empowered to do the works God has assigned me to do (Eph 2:10).

SLE

There there are so very many paths up the mountain. I did not mean imply that seeking out the teachings of Jesus is the only way someone could come to the Lord. Love is another path. We are all very different people and the Lord speaks to us in the ways that he knows will be most effective.

 

[Romans 8.28]

I have read quite a few ways to be or not to be saved on this thread and there is but one way, and that is to believe on Jesus Christ.

Acts 16:30 And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved?
Acts 16:31 And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved . . (Does it mention baptism, repenting, or doing or not doing something?)

Acts 4:12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.

What is a warning of belief? 2 John 1:7 For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist. 2 John 1:10 If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into your house. Hebrews 11:6 . . he that cometh to God must believe that he is . .

James 2:23 . . Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness

Acts 4:23 Now it was not written for his (Abraham's) sake alone, that it was imputed to him;
Acts 4:24 But for us also, to whom it shall be imputed, if we believe on him that raised up Jesus our Lord from the dead;

What of these other things. Isn't baptism necessary? We read in John 14:17 Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you. I do not know your experience, but the Holy Spirit fell on the following which just heard the word. If the world cannot receive the Holy Spirit, is it safe to assume they were now saved?

Acts 10:44 While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.
Acts 10:45 And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.
Acts 10:46 For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter,
Acts 10:47 Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?

Are you trying to tell me these were saved before being baptized? Yes, they received the Holy Ghost, didn't they?. Then what does the baptism do? 1 Peter 3:21 First, it does not put away of the filth of the flesh, but it is the answer of a good conscience toward God.

My thoughts.

 

[lioncub]

Acts 16:30 And brought them out, and said, Sirs, what must I do to be saved?
Acts 16:31 And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved . . (Does it mention baptism, repenting, or doing or not doing something?)

My thoughts.

The text does mention the Jailer and his household getting baptised.

 

[Romans 8.28]

The text does mention the Jailer and his household getting baptised.

You are right, and I too believe in being baptized, and was in the name of Jesus. It though was not the means of my being born of God. Hebrews 9:22 . . . without shedding of blood is no remission. Ephesians 5:26 That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word. Romans 10:17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God. All we have is based on the word of God and believing it.

As I previously stated, the world cannot receive the Holy Spirit; one must be born of God first, and those of Acts 10:47 were before being baptized. Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?

Well one might ask; what of the one that cannot hear. I say that God being righteous is not neglect in reaching every soul. Matthew 15:31 Insomuch that the multitude wondered, when they saw the dumb to speak, the maimed to be whole, the lame to walk, and the blind to see: and they glorified the God of Israel.

Thanks.

 

[Beans]

You are right, and I too believe in being baptized, and was in the name of Jesus. It though was not the means of my being born of God. Hebrews 9:22 . . . without shedding of blood is no remission. Ephesians 5:26 That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word. Romans 10:17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God. All we have is based on the word of God and believing it.

As I previously stated, the world cannot receive the Holy Spirit; one must be born of God first, and those of Acts 10:47 were before being baptized. Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?

Well one might ask; what of the one that cannot hear. I say that God being righteous is not neglect in reaching every soul. Matthew 15:31 Insomuch that the multitude wondered, when they saw the dumb to speak, the maimed to be whole, the lame to walk, and the blind to see: and they glorified the God of Israel.

Thanks.

Yes, I agree that we are born by the Word of God (1 peter 1:23) and that JESUS is the Word of God (John1:14, Revelation 19:13), but I think you limit God by saying that he can't use his Holy Spirit to call people out of the World. God speaks to people where they are at and in whatever way HE thinks will be effective. I don't think he cares much about tradition.
I agree that Baptism is a pretty superficial ritual like circumcision was. The real issue is not the baptism of the body but the spiritual baptism of the Truth, much like the circumcision of the heart.

Regarding how many ways there are to be saved. What does the cliche "accepting Jesus" really mean? Does it mean accepting Church traditions? or accepting the teachings of the historical Jesus? or asking Jesus "into your heart"? Or maybe God has a different criteria for saving people that we can't see, like looking at their hearts?

 

[Romans 8.28]

I think you limit God by saying that he can't use his Holy Spirit to call people out of the World.

Dear Beans, if I said that I was wrong, and you are correct in my opinion in saying that the Holy Spirit is used in calling people out of the world and that would entail John 16:8. And when He is come, He will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment. Not all respond.

How ever one would like to express it, the result is like that of Abraham; James 2:23, And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness. What were the magical words? I do not know if there is a given recipe from organized religion better than another as to how we come to the point of understanding, but I do know and feel the result of a life headed for hell like mine was that now has a hope and love of God.

To me, the moment we believe God, we for the first time see, we hear, and we understand through that measure of faith God has given us the hope we have in spiritual things. John 3:3 puts it this way: Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.

I reckon the following scriptures tell it as simple as any, and I know what the word "Believe" means to me. Over time God has produced fruit in my life as He works in me to will, and to do of His good pleasure. Were these things necessary to my salvation? No; they are the product of it. We are God's workmanship and that molding unto the image of His Son will continue until we are face to face with our Savior one glad day.

Acts 16:31 And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved . .

Romans 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

My thoughts.

 

[SpiritLedEd]

I agree that Baptism is a pretty superficial ritual like circumcision was. The real issue is not the baptism of the body but the spiritual baptism of the Truth, much like the circumcision of the heart.

I don't think the apostle Peter saw baptism as a superficial ritual: "Repent and be baptized every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins." (Ac 2:38)

SLE

 

[lioncub]

Sadly, there are many false claims to salvation which leave the recipients with no guarantee of salvation and in uncertainty.

One such claim is the following:

Ro 10:9 "That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved."

1. This letter ("Romans") and all of the other epistles after Acts were written to "saints". That is, those who were already saved ! What relevance, therefore, does the above scripture have for the unsaved ?

2. No where in scripture are we given any example of anyone using these words for salvation.

3. I, and countless others neither, confessed with our mouth and nor did we believe in our hearts that God had raised Jesus from the dead, and yet were saved !! We were saved when we received the Holy Spirit and spoke in tongues. This in itself proves conclusively that the above scripture has no relevance to the unbeliever and therefore offers no guarantee of salvation !!

Those that make such claims as the one above are playing with eternal fire.

I would like to apologise to all members on this forum.

Romans 10:1 Brethren, my heart's desire and prayer to God for Israel is, that they might be saved.

This passage does refer to the unbeliever. Unbelieving Israel, in fact. I said in my haste, that Romans 10:9 has no relevance to the unbeliever. I am wrong !

 

[lioncub]

Don't single out a verse without bringing in the context. Let's start from verse 5:
5 Moses writes this about the righteousness that is by the law: “The person who does these things will live by them.”[a] 6 But the righteousness that is by faith says: “Do not say in your heart, ‘Who will ascend into heaven?’” (that is, to bring Christ down) 7 “or ‘Who will descend into the deep?’”[c] (that is, to bring Christ up from the dead). 8 But what does it say? “The word is near you; it is in your mouth and in your heart,”[d] that is, the message concerning faith that we proclaim: 9 If you declare with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.

The part that I bolded above tells us the context of verse 9, the apostle Paul was summarizing the message that we (saints, Christians) proclaim. Proclaim to whom? the unsaved.

So that part of the passage is indeed for the unsaved.

Make sense?





Where does it say about "spoke in tongues" in John 3:16?

For example, the apostles were already saved before they receive the Holy Spirit at the day of the Pentacost. See the way Lord Jesus pray to God the Father about these disciples in the gospel of John 17:6-12.

Will,

I apologise for my error. You are correct, Romans 10:9 does indeed reference the unsaved !

lioncub

 

[spirit1st]

Eph_2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:


2Pe_3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.


1Th 2:4 But as we were allowed of God to be put in trust with the gospel, even so we speak; not as pleasing men, but God, which trieth our hearts


Joh_6:29 Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.
Joh_10:27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:
Mat_22:14 For many are called, but few are chosen.



Salvation comes from our heart [Spirit] We accept what He already did for us !and HIM as LORD and Master of our lives! Few will allow Him to be ruler of there lives! I known people who really wanted salvation!yet still wanted to be there own LORD! not knowing we really serve one or the other! We never really fully serve our selves!

One poor guy loved porn !Was tricked into thinking it was so important !Not understanding it was destorying Him !

We must be willing to give All we have and are to Him 100%! Because He is LORD already and cannot be less in our lives! We Must understand ? He only wants the best for us always!

 

[Drake]

I was about to post a new discussion about me seeking salvation because i'm confused but i found this thread and after reading just the 1st page this confirms as to the reason why i'm so damn confused.

I am sick and freaking tired of man saying this is how you get saved and no that is not it but this and no no no not that either but this and wait a minute you are wrong but it's like this and no you are all deceived it's like this, I don't just mean here but tons of sites and you tube videos, and the worst part of it all is that people usually have a verse to back up what ever false way that they are saying you must do or not do to be saved. Which is right???????. I am a man who wants to be saved but because of people like all of you and just about all of man i have been confused and hurt because i don't know what to believe in anymore, i think i've heard them all. Do you not realise that many and i mean many and i mean MANY will go to HELL and maybe including myself because of man and there false doctrines, and they all use scripture to back it up and so it makes it that much harder to know which is the true way. My goodness, how fine of a job satan has done to confuse the minds of perhaps billions upon billions to believe this or that. I honestly don't know what to do, my spirit has been beaten so damn much by all of this that if i myself can see it with my eyes it would probably be unrecognizable (not that i actually know what a spirit looks like since it's invisible). I honestly don't know where else to look, a part of me just feels like giving up because there seems like there is no hope with all these different doctrines based on how to get saved. I don't know how to get saved and because of man i will probably never know and go to hell. I mean for goodness sakes there are (according to wikipedia) an estimated "38,000 Christian denominations". and each probably have there own little way of how to be saved and the thing is that alot of em probably have a verse in the bible that they have misinterpreted that fits with there beliefs, and again i ask, which one is right? How divided the body of Christ is that it has been broken into an estimated 38,000 pieces. I can't even imagine Christ himself feels about this. Didn't Jesus say that He wanted his body to be united as one when He was praying to the Father in John 16 and not 38,000 different sections. As i said before i don't know what to do to be saved but o how much i wish i knew. I don't even want anyone to respond to this cause all anyone is going to do is tell me a way to be saved and back it up using scriptures, and perhaps it is the way but how would i know with all these false ways not letting me see the truth. I can't be beaten spiritually any more than what i truly am but my God i just want to be saved.

 

[SpiritLedEd]

I can't be beaten spiritually any more than what i truly am but my God i just want to be saved.

Drake,

Heb 11:6 tells me that God will make sure you connect with Him if you are diligently seeking Him. Christianity is centered on unity, not uniformity. This causes problems because some folks fall into prideful, domineering behavior in an effort to puff up their egos. No one has the authority to decide that you or I or anyone else is going to Hell. That's God's decision, not man's.

Here's a truly non-denominational website that might help you sort things out: Ask Questions about Life and God

Spirit Led Ed (SLE)

 

[Drake]

Drake,

Heb 11:6 tells me that God will make sure you connect with Him if you are diligently seeking Him.

What does it mean to diligently seek and How do i diligently seek Him with all my heart? Can you please answer that for me and please answer it as simple as possible.

 

[Queenie]

Hi Drake. I can certainly understand your frustration. It seems to me that man complicates salvation.

The bible is clear regarding salvation. The book of Romans, chapter 10 tells us that if we believe that Jesus died for our sins, was buried and resurrected, and we confess him as our savior then we are saved. By faith we confess Jesus as our Lord. When you do this, over time you will see changes in your life that are prompted by the Holy Spirit. You will be a new person.

As far as connecting with God, that it done by reading His word and prayer.

 

[Thiscrosshurts]

What does it mean to diligently seek and How do i diligently seek Him with all my heart? Can you please answer that for me and please answer it as simple as possible.

It means doing what your doing,actually paying attention and listening and evaluating whether it matches all scripture.Thats how you havn't been fooled so far.
I threw all opinions and doctrines out long ago,it means I don't know much because if I find a verse that seems to counter dict my notions then I have to put it on a shelf.

Figure this one out.
It's not Gods will that any shall perish.
We are told to pray that his will be done but no one seems to believe it will actually be done.
No they(the experts) say some will burn for eternity,well my God is an all consuming fire so I hope to burn for all eternity.

2 Peter 3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.

So,you think God can pull it off?

 

[SpiritLedEd]

What does it mean to diligently seek and How do i diligently seek Him with all my heart? Can you please answer that for me and please answer it as simple as possible.

The Merriam-Webster dictionary defines diligent as characterized by steady, earnest and painstaking effort. With all my heart simply means as best I can. You seem to be a perfectionist. Perfectionists have problems coming to Christ because they think He, like they, is a perfectionist (He's not). Look at the twelve men He chose to work with Him in the beginning. None of them were flawless and no true Christ-follower today is flawless. Lighten up, my friend. If Christ required flawlessness, I wouldn't be here at TJ. You seem to expect more from yourself than He does.

SLE

 

[Drake]

I'm not a perfectionist. I've just been confused as to how to get saved. In scripture ( i don't remember the chapter or verses) it says that if anyone believes in Jesus and that He being the Son of God came to earth as a man born from a virgin, died on cross for the sins of mankind and 3 days later rose from the dead then you are saved, and thats where it ends. While other parts in scripture says that you must repent to be saved, while other parts say that you must repent be baptised to be saved and so that confuses me. Now i know that the bible does not contradict itself because it is the word of the Living God but they confuse me not too mention these different christian denominations that believe in all these different ways. I just want to be saved but the enemy has caused my mind to be confused and so i don't know what to do, i've prayed to God but i receive no answer, i don't even know what an answer from Him would look like, and i sometimes wonder if i'm ever gonna be saved. I read and hear about God speaking to people either in a small still voice or in a dream and i wonder why can't God speak to me? I know that He is no respecter of persons nor does He have any favorites cause God loves us all the same so i know that if He speaks to others then He can surely speak to me but He doesn't. I truly believe that but i don't know why He won't answer me. I know that i'm the problem because He's perfect but i just can't figure out what it is that i'm doing or not doing. I just want God to help me. Why is it that He allows the enemy to mess with our minds and confuse us? I've been struggling for almost 2 years now and nothing. Sorry if i said too much. Sometimes i feel so over whelmed by hopelessness that thoughts of killing myself comes to mind because i don't see no point in living if i'm never gonna get saved but that is just gonna get me to hell quicker. I'm sorry if i upset anyone.

 

[jari]

Drake look it this way. Jesus came to save us.
ok? we can't save our selfs..
we can't find the truth by our selfs.
we cant believe by our selfs.
we cant please God to make our self saved.
we cant do anything really.

that's why Jesus came to save us.

and i think our prayer should be "Jesus save me".

because I do believe God hears that prayer and maybe the more we put hope in our selfs the less we give room for God. so we should be looking for that God's hand reaching to us instead of trying to get to heaven ourselves...

I hope this helps.

 

[SpiritLedEd]

Drake, a bit over eight years ago I began to sponsor a man in Alcoholics Anonymous who didn't see his perfectionism. He considered his thinking "normal". Over time as his understanding of how big God is grew, his perfectionism was exposed and he began to realize that all along he'd been trying to put expectations on God (which never works) and other people (which are seldom met).

God hears our prayers, but we don't control what He'll do or when any more than we can control other people.

SLE

 

[EphremHagos]

I found this very eye opening to what most preachers teach today on how to be saved.


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Many churches present a salvation invitation or altar call that is not the complete gospel as given in the Bible. Baptismal regeneration is not the gospel in this Dispensation of Grace. The Apostle Paul warned us about other gospels and false gospels. These incomplete gospel messages do not result in eternal salvation for the person responding. The following are some examples of incorrect or incomplete salvation invitations.

• Invite Jesus into your heart This doctrine is not in the Bible
• Believe Jesus died for your sins and be saved Faith in the resurrection is missing
• Come forward and receive Jesus This invitation is not the gospel in the Bible
• Give your heart to Jesus."This is a false gospel that will not bring eternal life
• Come to Jesus to get your sins forgivenYour sins were forgiven 2000 years ago.
• Be baptized for the remission of sins No. Baptism does not remove sin
• Life is in the blood of Jesus."No. Eternal life is by faith in the resurrection
• Personal relationship with Jesus."This phrase is not in the bible. What kind?
• God elects those whom He saves." This false doctrine is not in the Bible.

Corinthians 15:1 Moreover, brethren, I declare to you the gospel which I preached to you, which also you received and in which you stand, 2 by which also you are saved, if you hold fast that word which I preached to you--unless you believed in vain. 3 For I delivered to you first of all that which I also received: that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, 4 and that He was buried, and that He rose again the third day according to the Scriptures

Galatians 1:8 But even if we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel to you than what we have preached to you, let him be accursed. 9 As we have said before, so now I say again, if anyone preaches any other gospel to you than what you have received, let him be accursed. 10 For do I now persuade men, or God? Or do I seek to please men? For if I still pleased men, I would not be a bondservant of Christ. 11 But I make known to you, brethren, that the gospel which was preached by me is not according to man. 12 For I neither received it from man, nor was I taught it, but it came through the revelation of Jesus Christ

Romans 4:25 (Jesus Christ) Who was delivered for our offenses, and was raised again for our justification

Romans 5:8 But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us. 9 Much more then, having now been justified by His blood, we shall be saved from wrath through Him. 10 For if when we were enemies we were reconciled to God through the death of His Son, much more, having been reconciled, we shall be saved by His life (resurrection)


Romans 10:9 If you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved. For with the heart one believes to righteousness, and with the mouth confession is made to salvation. 10 For with the heart one believes unto righteousness, and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation. 11 For the Scripture says, "Whoever believes on Him will not be put to shame

Scripture does not teach that salvation is accomplished by having one's sins forgiven. Most Christian churches teach the false doctrine of effectual forgiveness. They teach that sins are not forgiven until one believes Jesus died for their sins. They falsely believe that having one's sins forgive equates to being saved. The effectual forgiveness doctrine is not in the Bible. Actually, the Bible teaches just the opposite. While we were enemies of God (meaning unsaved) we were reconciled to God by the death of His Son. It does not require faith to be reconciled to God as many churches falsely teach. Reconciliation does not mean one is saved as these churches teach. It means the enmity between man of God as a result of Adam's transgressions has been reversed, and the sins of the whole world have been forgiven. One is saved by sincere faith in the bodily resurrection of Jesus. We are spiritually baptized with the filling of the Holy Spirit upon our salvation to eternal life

Are the sins of all men forgiven?


In Romans 4:25 we see the separation between the forgiveness of sin and salvation. Jesus was delivered up and crucified for the forgiveness of our sin, and He was raised from the dead to provide the way of salvation. The only sin which has not been forgiven is the sin of unbelief in Jesus Christ's death and resurrection. This has been called by some as the "unforgivable sin."[

Many churches teach Romans 10:13 as the gospel, "For 'whoever calls on the name of the Lord shall be saved.'" This verse is a summation of the gospel as presented in Romans 10:9 above but should not be presented as the gospel
The correct and complete gospel is presented in the Bible verses above, not in these common church invitations. We are to have a deep faith and truly believe that Jesus was God in the flesh, conceived by the Holy Spirit, born of a virgin, lived a sinless life, died on the cross for the sins of the whole world, resurrected by the Father to give us eternal life, and Jesus ascended to the right hand of the Father where He is our advocate and makes intercession for us. You are saved by receiving the indwelling of the Holy Spirit upon faith in these gospel truths. For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, not of works, lest anyone should boast

Jesus said, Matthew 7:13 "Enter by the narrow gate; for wide [is] the gate and broad [is] the way that leads to destruction, and there are many who go in by it." 14 "Because narrow [is] the gate and difficult [is] the way which leads to life, and there are few who find it.

Jesus also said, Matthew 7:22 "Many will say to Me in that day, `Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?' 23 "And then I will declare to them, `I never knew you ; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!'


Jesus said the way is "narrow" and "difficult." Who are these people who say "Lord, Lord" that Jesus is referring to? They certainly are not atheists who will obviously spend eternity in hell. Jesus is talking about people who fail to understand His gospel. Jesus is talking about many people who attend church every Sunday but simply think inviting Jesus into their heart was the gospel. Jesus is talking about TV evangelists who beg for money and present an incomplete gospel message that leaves out the resurrection. Jesus is talking about people whose improper prayer is not heard by God. These people are all on the broad way that leads to destruction as Jesus promised.

I could not agree with you more. There is no salvation, whatsoever, without the power of attraction in Christ's Spirit-active, perfect and diacritical death on the cross.

(John 6: 62-65; 12: 32-33; 14: 19; 19:37)