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Figure of speech/colloquialism?

It's very easily taken care of -- any part of a day or night is considered a day or night.

A baby getting born at 4 am Saturday or 11 pm Saturday -- that baby's birthday is Saturday. And the next day , Sunday -- that baby is in it's 2nd day of life.

And all 4 of the Gospels say that he was resurrected very early on the first day of the week. And Mark 16 : 1 specifies that after the Sabbath was past -- and vs 2 -- very early on the 1st day of the week.

So there's really no guess work involved.
 
1. The Messiah said that three nights would be involved with His time in the "heart of the earth".

2. There are some who believe that the crucifixion took place on the 6th day of the week with the resurrection taking place on the 1st day of the week.

3. Of those, there are some who believe that the "heart of the earth" is referring to the tomb.

4. However, those two beliefs allow for only 2 nights to be involved.

5. To account for the discrepancy, some of the above say that the Messiah was using common figure of speech/colloquial language of the time, i.e., that it is was common to forecast or say that a day or a night would be involved with an event when no part of the day or no part of the night could occur.

6. In order for someone to legitimately say that it was common, they would have to know of more that 1 example to make that assertion.


I wonder if there is anyone here that knows of examples?
Sounds like you're using the wrong calendar?
 
You ask if I'm using the wrong calendar. Even if that were germane to this topic, how would I know that I was using the wrong calendar?
It is germane to this topic. And to find out what calendar to use....What calendar did the Jews use in those days....Try. The Jewish Calendar?
 
Admon Mikha'el ,


re: "It is germane to this topic."

What does a calendar have to do with showing examples where a daytime of a night time was forecast or said to be involved with an event when no part of a daytime or no part of a night time could occur?



re: "And to find out what calendar to use..."

That's not what you asked. You asked if I was using the wrong calendar.



re: "....What calendar did the Jews use in those days....:

Since that has nothing to do with this topic how about starting a new topic to discuss it?
 
Admon Mikha'el ,


re: "It is germane to this topic."

What does a calendar have to do with showing examples where a daytime of a night time was forecast or said to be involved with an event when no part of a daytime or no part of a night time could occur?



re: "And to find out what calendar to use..."

That's not what you asked. You asked if I was using the wrong calendar.



re: "....What calendar did the Jews use in those days....:

Since that has nothing to do with this topic how about starting a new topic to discuss it?
You said "

rstrats said:

1. The Messiah said that three nights would be involved with His time in the "heart of the earth".

2. There are some who believe that the crucifixion took place on the 6th day of the week with the resurrection taking place on the 1st day of the week.

3. Of those, there are some who believe that the "heart of the earth" is referring to the tomb.

4. However, those two beliefs allow for only 2 nights to be involved."

If you were using the correct calendar you would SEE the three nights. Or you could simply believe Gods Word when HE said Three nights. Are you born again?
 
Admon Mikha'el ,

re: "If you were using the correct calendar you would SEE the three nights. Or you could simply believe Gods Word when HE said Three nights."

How do you get a 3rd night with a 6th day of the week crucifixion/1st day of the week resurrection?
 
Admon Mikha'el ,

re: "If you were using the correct calendar you would SEE the three nights. Or you could simply believe Gods Word when HE said Three nights."

How do you get a 3rd night with a 6th day of the week crucifixion/1st day of the week resurrection?
IF you were to look at the JEWISH calendar for that year, you would see that there were TWO sabbaths that week. But you don't want to look?
 
Admon Mikha'el,
re: "IF you were to look at the JEWISH calendar for that year, you would see that there were TWO sabbaths that week."

I know that. So since you're not a 6th day of the week crucifixion advocate this topic does not apply to you. It's directed to those who are.
 
Admon Mikha'el,
re: "IF you were to look at the JEWISH calendar for that year, you would see that there were TWO sabbaths that week."

I know that. So since you're not a 6th day of the week crucifixion advocate this topic does not apply to you. It's directed to those who are.

Uh huuuh....and you find it important what day Jesus was crucified? Why? Its not that He died that's so exiting...Its that He rose from the dead!
 
Admon Mikhael,
re: "...you find it important what day Jesus was crucified?"

Yes, but not for the purpose of this topic.
 
1. The Messiah said that three nights would be involved with His time in the "heart of the earth".
2. There are some who believe that the crucifixion took place on the 6th day of the week with the resurrection taking place on the 1st day of the week.
3. Of those, there are some who believe that the "heart of the earth" is referring to the tomb.
4. However, those two beliefs allow for only 2 nights to be involved.
5. To account for the discrepancy, some of the above say that the Messiah was using common figure of speech/colloquial language of the time, i.e., that it is was common to forecast or say that a day or a night would be involved with an event when no part of the day or no part of the night could occur.
6. In order for someone to legitimately say that it was common, they would have to know of more that 1 example to make that assertion.

I wonder if there is anyone here that knows of examples?
Hello @rstrats,

The fact that 'three days' is used by Hebrew 'idiom' for any part of three days and three nights is not disputed; because that was the common way of reckoning. Just as it is when used of years. Three or any number of years was used inclusively of any part of those years, as may be seen in the reckoning of the reigns of any of the kings of Israel and Judah.

But when the number of 'nights' is stated as well as the number of 'days', the the expression ceases to be an idiom, and becomes a literal statement of fact.

Moreover, as the Hebrew day began at sunset the day was reckoned from one sunset to another, the 'twelve hours in the day' (John 11:9) being reckoned from sunrise, and the twelve hours of the night from sunset. An evening-morning was thus used for a whole day of twenty-four hours, as in the first chapter of Genesis. Hence the expression 'a night and a day' in 2 Corinthians 11:25 denotes a complete day.

When Esther says (Esther 4:16) 'fast ye for me, and neither eat nor drink three days', she defines her meaning (being a Jewess) 'night or day'. And when it is written that the fast ended on 'the third day (Esther 5:1) 'the third day' must have succeeded and included the third night.

In like manner the sacred record states that the young man (in 1 Samuel 30:12) 'had eaten no bread nor drunk any water, three days and three nights.'. Hence, when the young man explains the reason, he says, 'because three days agone I fell sick'. He means therefore three complete days and nights, because, being an Egyptian (1 Samuel 30:11-13) he naturally reckoned his day as beginning at sunrise according to the Egyptian manner. His 'three days agone' refers to the beginning of his sickness, and includes the whole period, giving the reason for his having gone without food during the whole period stated.

Hence, when it says that 'Jonah was in belly of the fish three days and three nights' (Jonah 1:17) it means exactly what it says, and that this can be the only meaning of the expression in Matthew12:40 and Matthew 16:4. (Ref: 'The Companion Bible' Index 144)

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris
 
1. The Messiah said that three nights would be involved with His time in the "heart of the earth".
2. There are some who believe that the crucifixion took place on the 6th day of the week with the resurrection taking place on the 1st day of the week.
3. Of those, there are some who believe that the "heart of the earth" is referring to the tomb.
4. However, those two beliefs allow for only 2 nights to be involved.
5. To account for the discrepancy, some of the above say that the Messiah was using common figure of speech/colloquial language of the time, i.e., that it is was common to forecast or say that a day or a night would be involved with an event when no part of the day or no part of the night could occur.
6. In order for someone to legitimately say that it was common, they would have to know of more that 1 example to make that assertion.

I wonder if there is anyone here that knows of examples?
'Then Jesus six days before the Passover came to Bethany,
where Lazarus was which had been dead, whom He raised from the dead.'

(Joh 12:1)

Hello again, @rstrats,

( This is the second of 2 responses by me to your OP)

Considering the six days before the Passover (John 12:1). We are furnished by Scripture with certain facts and fixed points which, taken together, enable us to :-
(1) to determine the events which filled up the days of 'the last week' of our Lord's life on earth'
(2) to fix the day of His crucifixion; and
(3) to ascertain the duration of the time He remained in the tomb.

The difficulties connected with these three have arisen,
(1) from not having noted these fixed points,
(2) from the fact of Gentiles' not having been conversant with the law concerning the three great feasts of the Lord; and,
(3) from not having reckoned the days as commencing (some six hours before our own) and running from sunset to sunset, instead of from midnight to midnight.

To remove these difficulties, we must note:-
(1) That the first day of each of the three feasts, Passover, Pentecost and Tabernacles was 'a holy convocation', a 'sabbath' in which no servile work was to be done. See Leviticus 23:7; Leviticus 23:24 & Leviticus 23:35. Compare Exodus 12:16, 'That Sabbath' and the 'high day' of John 19:31, was 'the holy convocation' the first day of the feast, which quite overshadowed the ordinary weekly Sabbath.

It was called by the Jews 'yom tov' (or 'Good day') and this is the greeting on that day throughout Jewry down to the present day.
This Great Sabbath having been mistaken from the earliest times for the weekly sabbath, has led to all the confusion.

(2) This has naturally caused the further difficulty as to the Lord's statement that 'even as Jonah was in the belly fish three days and three nights, so shall the Son of man be in the heart of the earth three days and three nights' (Matthew 12:40). Now, while it is quite correct to speak according to Hebrew idiom of 'three days' or 'three years' , while they are only parts of three days or three years, yet that idiom does not apply in a case like this, where 'three nights' are mentioned in addition to 'three days'. It will be noted that the Lord not only definitely states this, but repeats the full phraseology, so that we may not mistake it.

(3) We have therefore the following facts furnished for our sure guidance:-

(a) The 'high day' of John 19:31 was the first day of the week.
(b) The 'first day of the feast' was on the 15th day of Nisan.
(c) The 15th day of Nisan, commenced at sunset on what we would call the 14th.
(d) 'Six days before the passover' (John 12:1) takes us back to the 9th day of Nisan.
(e) 'After two days is the passover' (Matthew 26:2; Mark 14:1) takes us to the 13th day of Nisan.
(f) 'The first day of the week', the day of the resurrection (Matthew 28:1 & ch.), was from our Saturday sunset to our Sunday sunset. This fixes the days of the seek, just as the above fixes the days of the month, for :-
(g) 'Reckoning back from this, 'three days and three nights' (Matthew 12:40), we arrive at the day of the burial, which must have been before sunset, on the fourteenth day of Nisan; ie., before our Wednesday sunset.
(h) This makes the sixth day before the passover (the 9th day of Nissan) to be our Thursday sunset to Friday sunset.

Therefore Wednesday , Nisan 14th, (commencing on the Tuesday at sunset), was 'the preparation day', on which the crucifixion took place; for all four gospels definitely say that this was the day on which the Lord was buried (before our Wednesday sunset), "because it was the preparation (day)" the bodies should not remain upon the cross on the Sabbath day, 'for that the day was a high day', and therefore, not the ordinary seventh day, or weekly Sabbath. (See John 19:31)

(4) It follows, therefore, that the Lord being crucified on 'the preparation day' could not have eaten of the Passover lamb, which was not slain until the evening of the 14th of Nisan (ie., afternoon). On that day the daily sacrifice was killed at the 6th hour (noon) and offered at about the 7th hour (1 pm). The killing of the Passover lambs began directly afterwards. Thus it is clear. that if the killing of the Passover lambs did not commence until about four hours after our Lord had been hanged upon the Cross, and would not have been concluded at the ninth hour (3pm) when 'He gave up the ghost'; - no ' could have been eaten at this 'last supper' on the previous evening.

(5) With these facts before us, we are now in a position to fill in the several days of the Lords's last week with the events recorded in the Gospels. By noting that the Lord returned to Bethany (or to the Mount of Olives) each night of that week, we are able to determine both the several days and the events that took place in them. (The Companion Bible Appendix 156)

* Following this are tables of the days laying out clearly the passage of events and the days and times on which they occurred.

- (App. 156)
http://www.markfoster.net/rn/companion_bible_appendices.pdf - (App. 144)

I hope this is helpful to you. Though complex. :)
In Christ Jesus
Chris
 
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Since it's been awhile, perhaps someone new visiting this topic may know of examples.
In my opinion, the confusion comes from the fact that we use out calendar instead of the Hebrew calendar...and the fact that there was two Sabbaths that week. If we looked at the proper calendar.....
 
@ Admon.... -- the difference in the calendars is a factor as well as (there Are those who simply like to nitpic for the sake Of) (finding a pot to stir that doesn't really Need 'stirring') :)
 
I hope this is helpful to you.


Thanks, but I'm afraid that it isn't. I don't see where it provides examples of where a daytime or a night time was forecast or said to be involved with an event when no part of a daytime or no part of a night time could occur.
 
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