Rapture event - Poll

[Christ4Ever]

I typically call it the rapture theory. But you are right , it is a false teaching - it's only purpose is to focus more on the rapture than God.

For those of you that disagree. I consider the Rapture a very selfish teaching. It only focuses a single person to receive the rapture as individuals, and not as a whole community for a whole group because you don't know who's going to be left behind. Another problem is is that you're not preparing those who may be left behind, and how do you deem a person to be unworthy? I mean are we God? Are we the ones that are going to make the decision whether this person's going to go or not go. And based on the scripture that has been posted as reference to those who are left behind there is one little problem to all of that, it doesn't specifically say which person walks in the Lord or doesn't walk in the Lord. It could very well be that both people walk in the Lord, and one taken and one left behind and the one left behind is the one that God chooses to leave behind so that they can help those other people that are left behind has that ever even occurred to anyone

Actually it can be selfish, but it doesn't have to be, or mean to be. I see it as God's Mercy for His Children to not experience His Wrath upon the World.
Am I focused on it...nope. In fact I don't even think about it until I hear someone else talking of it or reading one of these threads. Do I think when bad things are going on in my life, I sure wish the Rapture would happen right about now. Nope.

Don't we comfort each other in the eternal life to come with Jesus?

For God did not appoint us to wrath, but to obtain salvation through our Lord Jesus Christ, who died for us, that whether we wake or sleep, we should live together with Him. Therefore comfort each other and edify one another, just as you also are doing. 1 Thessalonians 5:9-11 NKJV

So, we comfort each other and continue to be about His business. Spreading the Gospel, helping/loving others. If you think that people sit around doing nothing and waiting for the Rapture to happen and that's what they do, then I'd agree! That is if it happens or doesn't, or when it happens, if it does.

There are always problems with interpretation of God's Word Brother. Include prophecy, especially the Book of Revelation, and you have some who won't even view it as being Canon, much less speaking of truth that God wants us to know! If we are wrong in the knowing, I do not believe that our Salvation gets tossed out the window for our lack. Thank God for His Grace and Mercy!!!

So, don't hold those who believe other than how you do in this, too harshly. Maybe just remind them to continue to be about God's business as you have done in your life. It's growing God's Kingdom so be about it!!! If it happens great, if it doesn't great, because we are His and one day whenever that day arrives, we'll be with our Lord and Savior Jesus!

With the Love of Christ Jesus.
YBIC
Nick
\o/
<><

 

[th1bill]

Yes, and with 'Ruah', he still sinned.

Meaning sin is not the problem. The love of sin is. This love is manifested in the degree of sin we commit. Continuing in in mortal sins is a clear sign you do not have the Holy Spirit, are not a true Christian and will most certainly miss the rapture.

If Paul continued in or committed simply one, mortal sin, his preaching would have come to abrupt end. Why do you think that is?

Alright but that does not give rise to one sin being more holy than murder. You're getting off-subject.

 

[Garee]

No disrespect to you but I am getting tired of having to explain this all the time. I have given you and others the passages making the case for mortal and venial sins a number of times now. I really don't see the point in yet another efforted reply when many choose what they want to believe in and ignore.

I gave one such example in the very post you replied to. If you are being sincere, then please answer the following question with a Yes or No:

When Paul typed Rom 7:15 was he referring to still battling with the sin of murdering Christians?

Rom 7:15 I do not understand what I do. For what I want to do I do not do, but what I hate I do.

When did the oral tradition of the dying Catholic fathers divide sins into two categories. Limbo the venial for the younger sinners .and purgatory for the more mature sinner .

Believers receive the end of their newborn again salvation from the first hearing of the living abiding word. His word is Spirit and life giving. . .Dying flesh profits for zero

No need to wonder (limbo purgatory) when a person has sola scriptura

 

[th1bill]

The rapture is a lie and a false doctrine never even mentioned in the scripture in any way and it's best to stop feeding the delusion and stick to the wisdom and truth the Word is teaching us through Jesus' Holy Spirit.

Rapture = Catching away. Because the word, Rapture is not used in the translation you read does not mean it doe not codify catching away which is the common term used. 1 Thessalonians 4:16-17

 

[twcstp]

Rapture = Catching away. Because the word, Rapture is not used in the translation you read does not mean it doe not codify catching away which is the common term used. 1 Thessalonians 4:16-17

Thank you.

Somehow, the way I see it is as being born again,

 

[KingJ]

Alright but that does not give rise to one sin being more holy than murder. You're getting off-subject.

Bill, identifying mortal sin is 100% on topic. Try meditating on the statement that Paul did not continue in mortal sins. We must learn from this truth.

We need to grasp that if Paul did commit and continued in, mortal sins, the following would be true:

1. His career for the Lord would come to an abrupt end.
2. His salvation would be lost. If you believe in OSAS you would say he was never saved, if non-OSAS, he shipwrecked his salvation.
3. He is lucky he is not living in the OT where God ordained a graphic and violent death by stoning for mortal sinners.
4. He would completely and utterly miss the rapture.

God does not change His mind Num 23:19. Today we have many mortal sinners who make most of the phrase 'sin = sin, don't judge me'. Battling with a mortal sin = clearly not a Christian. You will MISS the rapture!!!

Sin is sin AND sin has degrees!

 

[KingJ]

When did the oral tradition of the dying Catholic fathers divide sins into two categories. Limbo the venial for the younger sinners .and purgatory for the more mature sinner .

Believers receive the end of their newborn again salvation from the first hearing of the living abiding word. His word is Spirit and life giving. . .Dying flesh profits for zero

No need to wonder (limbo purgatory) when a person has sola scriptura

Garee, this is mostly conjecture. Degrees of sin is what scripture teaches. Also, not sound teaching on Purgatory. Some mortal sinners can bypass Purgatory and go straight to Hades.

Num 23:19 God is not human, that he should lie, not a human being, that he should change his mind. Does he speak and then not act? Does he promise and not fulfil?

Lev 20:27 A man or a woman who is a medium or spiritist must surely be put to death. They shall be stoned; their blood is upon them.'" “’A man or woman who is a medium or spiritist among you must be put to death. You are to stone them; their blood will be on their own heads''.

Lev 20:10 If a man commits adultery with the wife of his neighbor, both the adulterer and the adulteress shall surely be put to death.

God does not change His mind. If you continue in a sin that He ordained capital punishment for, know that He wants you dead. IE Not in heaven. IE Not a Christian. IE You will MISS the rapture!

Mortal and venial sins is a good rule of thumb when examining yourself before God and working out your salvation.

2 Cor 13:5 Examine yourselves to see whether you are in the faith; test yourselves. Do you not realize that Christ Jesus is in you unless, of course, you fail the test?

Phil 2:12 Therefore, my dear friends, as you have always obeyed not only in my presence, but now much more in my absence continue to work out your salvation with fear and trembling.

 

[twcstp]

I am sorry to say this bluntly, Kingj, but I will speak boldly.

Not a single person here who believes in Jesus will be missing Him. Not one. Jesus knows who's His. Whose are His?

Be very careful telling anybody that they will miss 'this rapture' that isn't written of. Scripture gives us guidelines for living a righteous and blameless life before God the Father and His Son our Savior & Lord Jesus. You don't know who is and isn't going to read this topic, and the right believer with the wrong understanding could feel spiritually forsaken by misinterpreting a conversation of a doctrine that isn't even clearly define, by planting all their hopes in a future event that nobody has a clue about, instead of being planted in Christ, here & now today doing what we can do.

John 3:16​

16&nbsp;For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

What does the scripture tell us about sin?

• Matthew 18:15
  If you see a brother sinning, you should confront him privately and try to resolve the issue. If he does not respond, you can involve others and eventually share the issue with the congregation.

 

[twcstp]

If I am wrong,
please forgive me & correct me.

Something just felt really off.

 

[KingJ]

I am sorry to say this bluntly, Kingj, but I will speak boldly.

No stress . Boldly speak away!!

Not a single person here who believes in Jesus will be missing Him. Not one. Jesus knows who's His. Whose are His?

Agreed. I would just qualify that phrase as ''believe Jesus is Lord and that He rose from the dead'' Per Rom 10:9.

I agree with you as I believe in OSAS. Even David, after his two mortal sins would have repented and still gone to paradise.

A key word I inserted that you may have missed is ''continuing'' in sin. Paul clearly states in Rom 6:9-12 that any who 'continue' in sin will not see heaven. Note how every word mentioning a sinner ends with ''er'', Fornicat ''er'', murder ''er''.

Now I am trying to speak to both OSAS and non-OSAS believers as we have common ground here. We both believe someone continuing in sin unrepentant will not be in heaven.

OSAS = You will not be able to continue in mortal or venial sin unrepentant.

Non-OSAS = You will shipwreck your salvation.

Be very careful telling anybody that they will miss 'this rapture' that isn't written of.

I don't agree. Scripture does speak of a rapture event. Please see post # 1 and post # 86.

Warning people to be rapture ready is the same as warning people to repent of their sin today as tomorrow they could die.

Scripture gives us guidelines for living a righteous and blameless life before God the Father and His Son our Savior & Lord Jesus. You don't know who is and isn't going to read this topic, and the right believer with the wrong understanding could feel spiritually forsaken by misinterpreting a conversation of a doctrine that isn't even clearly define, by planting all their hopes in a future event that nobody has a clue about, instead of being planted in Christ, here & now today doing what we can do.

I don't agree.

As a Christian our job is to be an ambassador for God 2 Cor 5:20.

We need to properly study topics in order to be able to answer controversial questions that can so easily incriminate God as evil.

For example:

I believe that if God does not rescue us, He is evil. Now if I think that, how many unsaved would too?

For the following reasons:

1. Abandoning Christians with an unrestricted devil = Evil.
2. Taking the Holy Spirit from us when He has been part and parcel of 'Christianity, faith in Jesus' from day one = Nonsensical.
3. God dropping His plagues on Christians = Evil.
4. God needing to further test those who have already accepted Him as Lord = Nonsensical.

John 3:16
16&nbsp;For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

What does the scripture tell us about sin?

• Matthew 18:15
  If you see a brother sinning, you should confront him privately and try to resolve the issue. If he does not respond, you can involve others and eventually share the issue with the congregation.

How are you going to believe in Jesus if the Holy Spirit is removed? 1 Cor 12:3 is crystal clear that you need the Holy Spirit for that.

Please re-read my OP.

 

[Bill]

He won't. Thats why we are raptured.



Not sure of relevance.



Speaking to the last days. Those prior to the tribulation. Last days = pretribulation and tribulation.



In the tribulation you can have all the faith you want. If you get the mark of the beast = hell. If you do not endure ten days of torment and death = hell. You will go to hell with all your ''walk by faith not by sight'' thoughts.



I mean this in the nicest way possible. You are not dealing with arguments raised and scripture already presented. You seem to innocently be creating a rabbit trail.

Please would you mind, rather than posting random scriptures, quote my post #1 and post # 86. Explain in point form why you disagree.

Don't worry you're not going anywhere LOL. Unfortunately for you and many like yourself that believe in this foolishness. You are not ready for what is coming. And it is because of this lie that has been perpetrated throughout the churches, that many will leave behind the scripture as you know it to join the One World Church with their new scripture.

They will preach a message that it is okay to receive the mark of the beast. That you are protected because you are a Christian because you follow the One World Church you are protected, LOL.

When you hear these things you will know that those that you have been following are false teachers.

Take heart, because even though you may fall away and follow the One World Church. When the time comes and you hear the preachers talking about it's okay to take the mark of the beast. At that moment you can redeem yourself by getting the heck out of that group. Just remember not taking the mark of the beast will be the hardest thing you've ever done in your life. Especially if you have family. Because you will starve maybe to death. You will not be able to associate anything like anyone else in the world you will not be able to buy in any store you will not be able to get a job you will have no insurance nothing it may become so bad that you'll lose your bank accounts everything will be gone taken away from you because you will not take the mark of the beast.

If you do take the mark of the beast you will not see eternal life with God

 

[Bill]

Actually it can be selfish, but it doesn't have to be, or mean to be. I see it as God's Mercy for His Children to not experience His Wrath upon the World.
Am I focused on it...nope. In fact I don't even think about it until I hear someone else talking of it or reading one of these threads. Do I think when bad things are going on in my life, I sure wish the Rapture would happen right about now. Nope.

Don't we comfort each other in the eternal life to come with Jesus?

For God did not appoint us to wrath, but to obtain salvation through our Lord Jesus Christ, who died for us, that whether we wake or sleep, we should live together with Him. Therefore comfort each other and edify one another, just as you also are doing. 1 Thessalonians 5:9-11 NKJV

So, we comfort each other and continue to be about His business. Spreading the Gospel, helping/loving others. If you think that people sit around doing nothing and waiting for the Rapture to happen and that's what they do, then I'd agree! That is if it happens or doesn't, or when it happens, if it does.

There are always problems with interpretation of God's Word Brother. Include prophecy, especially the Book of Revelation, and you have some who won't even view it as being Canon, much less speaking of truth that God wants us to know! If we are wrong in the knowing, I do not believe that our Salvation gets tossed out the window for our lack. Thank God for His Grace and Mercy!!!

So, don't hold those who believe other than how you do in this, too harshly. Maybe just remind them to continue to be about God's business as you have done in your life. It's growing God's Kingdom so be about it!!! If it happens great, if it doesn't great, because we are His and one day whenever that day arrives, we'll be with our Lord and Savior Jesus!

With the Love of Christ Jesus.
YBIC
Nick
\o/
<><

It won't happen. The rapture will not take place as people see it. The only "rapture" will happen at the return of Jesus.

I am not going to allow people to walk the middle of the road on this false teaching, because so many churches have compromised to do the same as what you're speaking of. Our God is not a god about compromise. It's the same way with those who are gay, lovers of other men or women, or bisexual they are living in sin and there's no if ands or buts about it.

There is no compromise in God when it comes to sin. So why allow this thinking in your own life.

This is what will happen once people realize that they have been fooled into thinking that the Rapture is a real thing. They will leave Jesus they will leave their churches and join the One World Church that will stand there with open arms for them. The One World Church of Satan is what its title should have. That church will be a church of compromise. It will teach its members that it is okay to receive the mark of the beast. It will teach that it's okay to be gay, it will teach that we are all inclusive and coexist with God.

And it is why they will hate the true Christians so much. To be Christian during this time will be worse than it was for the Jews during the time of the Holocaust, with one exception. And that exception is the Holy Spirit which will be our Shield and Sword against the enemys of God

 

[Bill]

There is no doubt that the mark of the beast will be the single greatest struggle for every Christian in the world.

On the one hand you have the scripture before you stating that taking the mark of the Beast is a sin against God

And on the other hand if you do not take the mark of the beast your family will starve, you'll not be able to have a job, you'll not be able to even socialize with anyone else who does take the mark of the beast because they will be separate from you in every way. Social finances even Church, you will not be able to buy or sell. Your bank accounts will be seized because you're an outcast unless you take the mark of course.

Woe to those who take the mark, for the short space of time that you're in this world you may have pleasure but you have traded that all the way to have fire for eternity with the Devil

 

[KingJ]

Don't worry you're not going anywhere LOL. Unfortunately for you and many like yourself that believe in this foolishness. You are not ready for what is coming. And it is because of this lie that has been perpetrated throughout the churches, that many will leave behind the scripture as you know it to join the One World Church with their new scripture.

They will preach a message that it is okay to receive the mark of the beast. That you are protected because you are a Christian because you follow the One World Church you are protected, LOL.

When you hear these things you will know that those that you have been following are false teachers.

Take heart, because even though you may fall away and follow the One World Church. When the time comes and you hear the preachers talking about it's okay to take the mark of the beast. At that moment you can redeem yourself by getting the heck out of that group. Just remember not taking the mark of the beast will be the hardest thing you've ever done in your life. Especially if you have family. Because you will starve maybe to death. You will not be able to associate anything like anyone else in the world you will not be able to buy in any store you will not be able to get a job you will have no insurance nothing it may become so bad that you'll lose your bank accounts everything will be gone taken away from you because you will not take the mark of the beast.

If you do take the mark of the beast you will not see eternal life with God

So, because I believe in a rapture, I will denounce Christianity and accept the mark of the beast?

You are jumping in and out of this thread. Not dealing with posts made or those directed at you. You share your opinion and take no stab at posting a rebuttal to posts # 1 and # 86 or propose a space where God can still be defended as righteous if there is no rapture. You did not even reply to the points made in the very post you quoted.

--------------------------

As for enduring the tribulation and becoming a tribulation saint. Life will be very annoying, but God will make a way as He always does.

There is no ''being ready'' for it. Bunker doesn't work. Stocking up on food won't work. Running to an island won't work.

You just have to regular pray, attend church and as you said, reject the antichrist and mark of the beast. Accepting that you may be among the many that will endure ten days of torment and death Rev 2:10.

Dying as a martyr for Jesus is probably the best way to leave this earth. You will walk into heaven a hero.

 

[KingJ]

I am not going to allow people to walk the middle of the road on this false teaching, because so many churches have compromised to do the same as what you're speaking of. Our God is not a god about compromise. It's the same way with those who are gay, lovers of other men or women, or bisexual they are living in sin and there's no if ands or buts about it.

There is no compromise in God when it comes to sin. So why allow this thinking in your own life.

This is what will happen once people realize that they have been fooled into thinking that the Rapture is a real thing. They will leave Jesus they will leave their churches and join the One World Church that will stand there with open arms for them. The One World Church of Satan is what its title should have. That church will be a church of compromise. It will teach its members that it is okay to receive the mark of the beast. It will teach that it's okay to be gay, it will teach that we are all inclusive and coexist with God.

And it is why they will hate the true Christians so much. To be Christian during this time will be worse than it was for the Jews during the time of the Holocaust, with one exception.

I know in your mind this makes sense but in mine it is very illogical. You have over simplified rebellion to God.

People do not ''deny Jesus'' because they were waiting for a rapture, and it didn't take place.

You are missing the whole 'knowledge of good and evil' facts we discussed earlier in this thread. Each of us have the ability to grasp good and evil. Many will grasp that they missed the rapture because they faked their conversions.

People will grasp that they are choosing what is evil when they choose to accept the mark of the beast. It will not be a case of ''Oh you want food, take this chip implant''. It will be ''Oh you want food, take this chip implant that states you reject Jesus of Nazareth and accept this evil version of him that does signs and wonders''. The antichrist will not only push his mark He will push an acceptance of what is clearly evil. All good people will reject it because of that. Their rejection will be tested by the disadvantages of not having it.

You need to try and understand that many today reject Jesus but do not completely reject what is good and right. It is these people that need to be tested. You have a rather complex situation in the world right now where a large number of people think they are good and right with God. But are not. They are on the fence and no amount of time of keeping things as they are, will take them off. The only way to deal with this, is a Flood type warning or as in our case, a seven-year tribulation event. Please try understand that. Christians who are truly saved do not need this.

I just don't understand how some don't 'get' that it would be evil of God to leave a Christian with the devil. The devil will not seek to test someone who is clearly an enemy. Duh?

Rev 2:10 = Logical scenario:

Devil - ''Joe, you are on the fence. I am going to starve you and have people throw tomatoes at you for ten days. Then put you to death. Unless of course you take my mark that confirms your acceptance of all these evil practices we support.''

Rev 2:10 = Illogical scenario:

Devil - ''Jimmy Swaggart you are clearly not on the fence, but sadly for you God has left you all alone with me and given me permission to kill you. IE Do worse to you than what I did to Job. You have been my enemy for many years, I hope you are ready for payback''.

Conclusion:

People who do not believe in a pretribulation rapture do:

1. Not know who the devil is.
2. Not grasp what the Holy Spirit is on earth for.
3. Not grasp what a Christian is.
4. Not grasp that God is good and righteous in all His ways.
5. Not grasp what leaving and forsaking means.

-------------------------

I think from post 1, I am still waiting for someone to provide a sound rebuttal to scripture and arguments raised.

 

[Garee]

Garee, this is mostly conjecture. Degrees of sin is what scripture teaches. Also, not sound teaching on Purgatory. Some mortal sinners can bypass Purgatory and go straight to Hades.

Num 23:19 God is not human, that he should lie, not a human being, that he should change his mind. Does he speak and then not act? Does he promise and not fulfil?

Lev 20:27 A man or a woman who is a medium or spiritist must surely be put to death. They shall be stoned; their blood is upon them.'" “’A man or woman who is a medium or spiritist among you must be put to death. You are to stone them; their blood will be on their own heads''.

Lev 20:10 If a man commits adultery with the wife of his neighbor, both the adulterer and the adulteress shall surely be put to death.

God does not change His mind. If you continue in a sin that He ordained capital punishment for, know that He wants you dead. IE Not in heaven. IE Not a Christian. IE You will MISS the rapture!

Mortal and venial sins is a good rule of thumb when examining yourself before God and working out your salvation.

2 Cor 13:5 Examine yourselves to see whether you are in the faith; test yourselves. Do you not realize that Christ Jesus is in you unless, of course, you fail the test?

Phil 2:12 Therefore, my dear friends, as you have always obeyed not only in my presence, but now much more in my absence continue to work out your salvation with fear and trembling.

Hi Thanks

I would offer.

Either the word of God as it is written (sola scriptura) or as it is orally transmitted in one's own Catholic book of law their Bible the source of their faith.

They you must call the CCC the sacred the divine word.

no one can serve two good teaching master coming from one unseen Holy father the faithful "Let there be" creator

The appointment is to die once. No limbo for the younger sinners and no purgatory for the more mature sinner. Real salvation the end from the beginning. (1 Peter 1:9 )

Unlike Peter our brother in the Lord who in his jealousy of John went to town to start another of the lying wonders that John would not die, the father gave words to Jesus his prophet declaring the Father's will. That if every time the Spirit of Christ had to expose the oral traditions of dying mankind (CCC) as lies we would need a bigger planet to hold the volumes that could have been written.

John 21:23-25Then went this saying abroad among the brethren, that that disciple should not die: yet Jesus said not unto him, He shall not die; but, If I will that he tarry till I come, what is that to thee?This is the disciple which testifieth of these things, and wrote these things: and we know that his testimony is true.; And there are also many other things which Jesus did, the which, if they should be written every one, I suppose that even the world itself could not contain the books that should be written. Amen.

One warning should be enough. Peter the serial denier 3rd warning not to add to sola scriptura.

Catholicism teaches that only a queen mother named after our blessed sis tin the lord named Mary received the whole cost of salvation the fulness of Christ's grace.

The Pope says. . The rest of the plant an unknowable amount of grace and it off two Limbo for the younger sinners (venial) and purgatory for the more mature (mortal)

Yes, God cannot change his mind. A man or a woman who is a medium or spiritist must surely be put to death.

Catholic Spiritism is the name properly given to the belief that the living can and do communicate with the spirits of the departed, (patron saints his and hers gods (3500 and rising) and to the various practices by which such communication is attempted. Living seeking the dead

In that way there must be difference in opinion called heresy oral traditions as long as they do not do despite to the fullness of grace

2 Peter 2:1 But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction.

No saving grace no salvation.

 

[Garee]

I just don't understand how some don't 'get' that it would be evil of God to leave a Christian with the devil. The devil will not seek to test someone who is clearly an enemy. Duh?

Hi Thanks

I would offer.

The devil has no spiritual understanding. . . (eternal things not seen). nothing nada . Christ alone can look into our new-born again hearts

The liar who adds to the word (sola scriptura) is not subject to the gospel of salvation.

It's a guessing game to him. He has no understanding of faith the powerful unseen eternal things of Christ the husband.

A newly born again believer has more understanding than the devil of old.

The god of this world, the wisdom of this world. . . lust of flesh with lust of eye. two building blocks of false pride. The cause of the fall. Neither shall you touch. . .

It can be viewed at the beginning of the ministry of the dynamic duo (Mathew 4)

Christ the Holy Father working in dying mankind Jesus the Son of man.

The "If" key. . no understanding coming from sola scriptura all things written in the law and prophets

It is always a if you are the son ?. . . then bow down to the lying wonderers as if true prophecy.

Three times with three denoting the end of a matter . the Eternal Father gave His apostle Jesus living words as it is written again power. . , again , again (sola scriptura)

Mathew 4:3And when the tempter came to him, he said, If thou be the Son of God, command that these stones be made bread.
But he answered and said, It is written, (not as it is seen) Man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God.Then the devil taketh him up into the holy city, and setteth him on a pinnacle of the temple,;And saith unto him, If thou be the Son of God, cast thyself down: for it is written, He shall give his angels charge concerning thee: and in their hands they shall bear thee up, lest at any time thou dash thy foot against a stone.;Jesus said unto him, It is written again, Thou shalt not tempt the Lord thy God.Again, the devil taketh him up into an exceeding high mountain, and sheweth him all the kingdoms of the world, and the glory of them;And saith unto him, All these things will I give thee, if thou wilt fall down and worship me.Then saith Jesus unto him, Get thee hence, Satan: for it is written, (sola scriptura) Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God, and him only shalt thou serve.;Then the devil leaveth him, and, behold, angels came and ministered unto him.

Strike three never saw the faith ball coming .Back to the bottomless if he dug out lol

The if who accuses wondering day and night

Revelation 12:10 And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.

 

[th1bill]

Bill, identifying mortal sin is 100% on topic. Try meditating on the statement that Paul did not continue in mortal sins. We must learn from this truth.

We need to grasp that if Paul did commit and continued in, mortal sins, the following would be true:

1. His career for the Lord would come to an abrupt end.
2. His salvation would be lost. If you believe in OSAS you would say he was never saved, if non-OSAS, he shipwrecked his salvation.
3. He is lucky he is not living in the OT where God ordained a graphic and violent death by stoning for mortal sinners.
4. He would completely and utterly miss the rapture.

God does not change His mind Num 23:19. Today we have many mortal sinners who make most of the phrase 'sin = sin, don't judge me'. Battling with a mortal sin = clearly not a Christian. You will MISS the rapture!!!

Sin is sin AND sin has degrees!

Sin is sin, period and you have danced a Irish Jig all around it but you have yet to address the issue, degrees of sin, scripturally. All you have presented, thus far, are the desires and traditions of men. Yehovah is not like us.

 

[th1bill]

Garee, this is mostly conjecture. Degrees of sin is what scripture teaches.

Where?

 

[Admon Mikha'el]

If someone believes that Christ's Church/Body/Bride will go through the Trib in order to get purified, they clearly lack faith in Jesus to have dealt with our sin problem. And this exposes them as phony Christians seeing as they don't have faith in Jesus to have dealt with our sin problem on the cross. And if you lack faith in Jesus, you cannot be saved because we are saved according to our faith in Jesus.

The bowwow was not a part of the Church/Body/Bride. He's clearly a wolf with a poor lamb disguise. He showed his teeth to prove this.

If you read the Word the way it's written, you will see that the church body, and the bride are not the same entity...You will see that the bride has made herself ready...The bride will come out of the church body....The rest? They will go through the tribulation because they were NOT ready Revelation 19:7