Speaking in Tongues: Required for Regeneration?.

[God's Truth]

Do you have a scriptural basis for ANYTHING you are saying?
Oh wait, earlier in this thread you said Jesus alone was your teacher. Did Jesus tell you to disregard His Word and to rely more on your own personal feelings and beliefs?

Did He tell you to come up with your own personal meanings for words used in scripture?

You wanted to talk about 1 Corinthians 14. That passage is about if no one is around who understands the language the tongue speaker is speaking.

 

[vhusley]

Give the scriptures that say what you claim about different kinds of tongues.

I’ve already given plenty scripture. Sorry, I’m not going to play these childish games with you.

 

[vhusley]

You wanted to talk about 1 Corinthians 14. That passage is about if no one is around who understands the language the tongue speaker is speaking.

That passage is about A LOT more than just that friend. Keep digging.

 

[God's Truth]

That passage is about A LOT more than just that friend. Keep digging.

If you change your mind and want someone to discuss this with, let me know.

 

[Shaolin]

If you change your mind and want someone to discuss this with, let me know.

You don't "discuss"...you only claim, and that without reasoning...which is why you chose to ignore me when I put you in your place earlier.

..

 

[Waggles]

I was going to add some scripture concerning living water and praying in tongues BUT as this thread has now totally degenerated into a slanging match I will give it a miss.

 

[God's Truth]

You don't "discuss"...you only claim, and that without reasoning...which is why you chose to ignore me when I put you in your place earlier.

..

You won't be able to change my mind if that is what you mean, however, there is no ignoring going on.. A person who wants the truth will have to be humble and not harden their heart. It can be traumatic to realize you have been believing and doing something that is not biblical. Look what the apostle Paul gave up and it was worth it.

 

[GodB4Us]

I think you are confusing me with garee...I did not post that which you are referring to.

..

I tagged you because you were involved in that conversation, but yes, that reply was for Garee.

May God bless you.

 

[GodB4Us]

And @God's Truth, you keep saying that you stand on scripture and that you want to “discuss,” but what of the two simple passages of scripture I posted?
1 Corinthians 14:15
1 Corinthians 14:39

You’ve still yet to address them SPECIFICALLY. You responded by going off on another diatribe on “tongue speaking” in general.
What did Paul mean when addressing the Church at Corinth and instructing them plainly to “not forbid speaking in tongues”? These believers/followers who were obviously not Apostles by the strictest biblical definition?

@God's Truth

Paul also said for everything to be done in decency and order so in that regard, there is a time to forbid someone from speaking when there is no interpretation;

1 Corinthians 14:27 If any man speak in an unknown tongue, let it be by two, or at the most by three, and that by course; and let one interpret. 28 But if there be no interpreter, let him keep silence in the church; and let him speak to himself, and to God.

To discern the message in verse 28, one has to ask the Lord why instruct that person to be silent and yet seemingly still speaking to himself and to God? Is he mad? No. When you apply verse 26 of the practice where one by one, 2 or 3 speak in tongues and another interpret in that church service, a foreign visitor may stand up and speak out of turn in his own language, being unfamiliar with what is going on. This is why when there is no interpretation, he is to be instructed to be silent because he speaks to himself, meaning he understands what he is saying as God does too; not that he is mad talking to himself & to God.

What kind of tongues do you think he was referring to? What kind of tongues do you think they’d be speaking? According to your false claims the “perfect had already come” and the foundation “had already been laid”. So what was the need for the tongues that Paul clearly says shouldn’t be forbidden?

1 Corinthians 14:39 Wherefore, brethren, covet to prophesy, and forbid not to speak with tongues. 40 Let all things be done decently and in order.

And in what language do you believe Paul was praying when he prayed in the Spirit? Obviously it was a language that his mind has no understanding of. He even says so. Was it a known language? If so, why? Because this is just him praying…..individually….not giving a sign to unbelievers. Because he tells us as much. God’s word tells us as much.

in the context of what Paul is writing, he is instructing believers to edify the church so therefore when Paul seas in tongues as manifested by the Holy Ghost, he is praying that someone else will interpret that tongue so he may understand it ad be fruitful to himself, meaning he will be edified as well to benefit from that tongue once interpreted.

1 Corinthians 14:12 Even so ye, forasmuch as ye are zealous of spiritual gifts, seek that ye may excel to the edifying of the church. 13 Wherefore let him that speaketh in an unknown tongue pray that he may interpret. 14 For if I pray in an unknown tongue, my spirit prayeth, but my understanding is unfruitful. 15 What is it then? I will pray with the spirit, and I will pray with the understanding also: I will sing with the spirit, and I will sing with the understanding also.

Tongues are not for private use. Paul sets the precedent for reading chapter 14 in chapter 12 for why believers should stop reading in between the lines as if tongues are also for private use.

1 Corinthians 12:7 But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal.....

Not individually.

And there is no other baptism with the Holy Ghost with evidence of tongues or for that sign of tongues or for any other gifts of the Spirit.

1 Corinthians 12:12 For as the body is one, and hath many members, and all the members of that one body, being many, are one body: so also is Christ. 13 For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit. 14 For the body is not one member, but many.

Those who speak of another baptism or another receiving of the Holy Ghost to get that tongue for private use are separating themselves from that testimony in verse 13 that we are all suppose to share in for why this is a departure from the faith in Jesus Christ ( 2 Corinthians 13:5 ) and taking heed of seducing spirits & doctrines of devils ( 2 Corinthians 11:3-4 & 1 Timothy 4:1-2 & Isaiah 8:19 ).

As it is, there is only asking Jesus Christ for the gifts of the Spirit and no other baptism with the Holy Ghost is required. The phenomenon is real but Biblically, it is apostasy for why it is not of Him at all.

To apply that tongues are for private use to proclaim all those benefits for private use where a tongue speaker needs no other member in the body of Christ to interpret that tongue for him proves it is not of Him at all.

1 Corinthians 12:19 And if they were all one member, where were the body? 20 But now are they many members, yet but one body. 21 And the eye cannot say unto the hand, I have no need of thee: nor again the head to the feet, I have no need of you.

Tongues are not for self edification either when Paul prayed that someone else will interpret that tongue that was being manifested through Paul. Just as tongues of angels was an exaggerated sense ( a hyperbole ) to convey how important love is, so was Paul attempting to use his education in the language to convey why, if any believer sought a spiritual gift, they are to seek the gift of prophesy & then began to comparing tongues with prophesy for why prophesy is better because tongues is not a stand alone gift which many tongue speakers todays seem to miss the intent of his comparison between tongues & prophesy as if tongues by itself can self edify wen in that same chapter, Paul said he would ray that someone would interpret that tongue so that tongue would be fruitful to himself by understanding it and thus edified.

Tongues gained by an extra notable phenomenon is why it is not coming with interpretation because it is not the real God's gift of tongues at all, but the apostasy in these latter days where faith is hard to find.

2 Corinthians 11:3 But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ. 4 For if he that cometh preacheth another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or if ye receive another spirit, which ye have not received, or another gospel, which ye have not accepted, ye might well bear with him.

2 Corinthians 13:5 Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates?

1 Timothy 4:1Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils; 2 Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;

Isaiah 8:19 And when they shall say unto you, Seek unto them that have familiar spirits, and unto wizards that peep, and that mutter: should not a people seek unto their God? for the living to the dead?

 

[vhusley]

@God's Truth

Paul also said for everything to be done in decency and order so in that regard, there is a time to forbid someone from speaking when there is no interpretation;

1 Corinthians 14:27 If any man speak in an unknown tongue, let it be by two, or at the most by three, and that by course; and let one interpret. 28 But if there be no interpreter, let him keep silence in the church; and let him speak to himself, and to God.

To discern the message in verse 28, one has to ask the Lord why instruct that person to be silent and yet seemingly still speaking to himself and to God? Is he mad? No. When you apply verse 26 of the practice where one by one, 2 or 3 speak in tongues and another interpret in that church service, a foreign visitor may stand up and speak out of turn in his own language, being unfamiliar with what is going on. This is why when there is no interpretation, he is to be instructed to be silent because he speaks to himself, meaning he understands what he is saying as God does too; not that he is mad talking to himself & to God.

1 Corinthians 14:39 Wherefore, brethren, covet to prophesy, and forbid not to speak with tongues. 40 Let all things be done decently and in order.

in the context of what Paul is writing, he is instructing believers to edify the church so therefore when Paul seas in tongues as manifested by the Holy Ghost, he is praying that someone else will interpret that tongue so he may understand it ad be fruitful to himself, meaning he will be edified as well to benefit from that tongue once interpreted.

1 Corinthians 14:12 Even so ye, forasmuch as ye are zealous of spiritual gifts, seek that ye may excel to the edifying of the church. 13 Wherefore let him that speaketh in an unknown tongue pray that he may interpret. 14 For if I pray in an unknown tongue, my spirit prayeth, but my understanding is unfruitful. 15 What is it then? I will pray with the spirit, and I will pray with the understanding also: I will sing with the spirit, and I will sing with the understanding also.

Tongues are not for private use. Paul sets the precedent for reading chapter 14 in chapter 12 for why believers should stop reading in between the lines as if tongues are also for private use.

1 Corinthians 12:7 But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal.....

Not individually.

And there is no other baptism with the Holy Ghost with evidence of tongues or for that sign of tongues or for any other gifts of the Spirit.

1 Corinthians 12:12 For as the body is one, and hath many members, and all the members of that one body, being many, are one body: so also is Christ. 13 For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit. 14 For the body is not one member, but many.

Those who speak of another baptism or another receiving of the Holy Ghost to get that tongue for private use are separating themselves from that testimony in verse 13 that we are all suppose to share in for why this is a departure from the faith in Jesus Christ ( 2 Corinthians 13:5 ) and taking heed of seducing spirits & doctrines of devils ( 2 Corinthians 11:3-4 & 1 Timothy 4:1-2 & Isaiah 8:19 ).

As it is, there is only asking Jesus Christ for the gifts of the Spirit and no other baptism with the Holy Ghost is required. The phenomenon is real but Biblically, it is apostasy for why it is not of Him at all.

To apply that tongues are for private use to proclaim all those benefits for private use where a tongue speaker needs no other member in the body of Christ to interpret that tongue for him proves it is not of Him at all.

1 Corinthians 12:19 And if they were all one member, where were the body? 20 But now are they many members, yet but one body. 21 And the eye cannot say unto the hand, I have no need of thee: nor again the head to the feet, I have no need of you.

Tongues are not for self edification either when Paul prayed that someone else will interpret that tongue that was being manifested through Paul. Just as tongues of angels was an exaggerated sense ( a hyperbole ) to convey how important love is, so was Paul attempting to use his education in the language to convey why, if any believer sought a spiritual gift, they are to seek the gift of prophesy & then began to comparing tongues with prophesy for why prophesy is better because tongues is not a stand alone gift which many tongue speakers todays seem to miss the intent of his comparison between tongues & prophesy as if tongues by itself can self edify wen in that same chapter, Paul said he would ray that someone would interpret that tongue so that tongue would be fruitful to himself by understanding it and thus edified.

Tongues gained by an extra notable phenomenon is why it is not coming with interpretation because it is not the real God's gift of tongues at all, but the apostasy in these latter days where faith is hard to find.

2 Corinthians 11:3 But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ. 4 For if he that cometh preacheth another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or if ye receive another spirit, which ye have not received, or another gospel, which ye have not accepted, ye might well bear with him.

2 Corinthians 13:5 Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates?

1 Timothy 4:1Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils; 2 Speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;

Isaiah 8:19 And when they shall say unto you, Seek unto them that have familiar spirits, and unto wizards that peep, and that mutter: should not a people seek unto their God? for the living to the dead?

All of that is great, and I thank you for the effort you put in….and yes, Paul instructed the church to do things in orderly fashion. But back to the point that was being debated and the Bible’s answer: YES, TONGUES ARE STILL FOR TODAY.

Paul clearly instructed the church at Corinth NOT to forbid tongue speaking.

And I really don’t want to start up an argument again, but you are just missing so much because like so many who argue against tongues, you fail to see that there is MORE than just the GIFT of tongues. Paul is not necessarily talking about the Spiritual gift EVERY time speaks of “tongues.”

Two final points:
1. Get filled with the Holy Ghost. You can’t tell people who have been filled with the Holy Ghost and who have sincerely EXPERIENCED speaking in tongues “as THE SPIRIT gave them utterance,” that what they EXPERIENCED was false.

2. Rightly divide the Word of Truth. Precept upon precept, God’s Word stands and does not contradict itself. God is not a God of confusion. His Word was
not written to be so complicated that one has to have a concordance and be a Biblical scholar to find truth in it. Some things are simply meant to be read and taken at face value. And every Biblical truth is connected to and supported by other scripture. Paul plainly instructed the church at Corinth….the Gentiles church, which directly points to us and our churches today….to “not forbid speaking in tongues.” End of story. A person may try and rationalize that scripture away as creatively as they can, but it’s still there, gnawing away at Cessationists, and all of the so-called believers who attend churches that practice small faith or whose faith is dead faith. See James 2:14-26

 

[GodB4Us]

All of that is great, and I thank you for the effort you put in….and yes, Paul instructed the church to do things in orderly fashion. But back to the point that was being debated and the Bible’s answer: YES, TONGUES ARE STILL FOR TODAY.

Paul clearly instructed the church at Corinth NOT to forbid tongue speaking.

But is it God's gift of tongues for God to speak unto the people in their native language ( 1 Corinthians 14:21 ) or pagan's supernatural tongues of gibberish nonsense which can be found in Khunadlini, idolatries, religions, and the occult.( Isaiah 8:19 )? This is why believers are not to believe every spirit but test them and the tongues they bring. 1 John 4:1-6

 

[Garee]

@Shaolin

Your reference did not say Abel was sent to Cain to give him a message. If you wish to infer, God spoke to Cain & warned Cain, but whatever he had talked about in the field was hardly anything God told Cain to tell Abel about.

The irony is on what God had told Cain that Abel's desire is to Cain and that Cain would rule over Abel. Cain was the first born anyway.

As for Abel being a half breed, there is no scriptural basis for that as being of the truth.

Genesis 4:1And Adam knew Eve his wife; and she conceived, and bare Cain, and said, I have gotten a man from the Lord. 2 And she again bare his brother Abel. And Abel was a keeper of sheep, but Cain was a tiller of the ground.

There were no other people on earth when Cain was born first and Abel was born second.

Genesis 3:20 And Adam called his wife's name Eve; because she was the mother of all living.

There were other children by Adam & Eve after Cain & Abel for how, after many generations, Cain was able to find a wife which was a relative of his at the time he had murdered Abel. That was why there was no place for him to go on earth for every one was related to Abel and Cain, but would take vengeance on Cain for killing Abel..

The sons of God are the godly lineage of Seth that had replaced Abel, whom had died. The sons of God is a reference only pertaining to Israel's family tree.

Luke 3:38 Which was the son of Enos, which was the son of Seth, which was the son of Adam, which was the son of God.

Now Christians are the sons of God not by blood lineage nor by Judaism.

John 1:12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: 13 Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

Hi thanks for the reply .Ultimately how we use the word "generation" and "seed" singular has much to do with coming to the gospel truth

Abel talking to Cain has spiritual gospel overtones. Cain resisted the words of the apostle Abel and Cain murdered Abel as the first martyr .

The father of lies a murderer from that very beginning.

The beginning of the unseen spiritual seed of Christ it is given to represent the "second birth ". The genraration of Christ the second birth and not the first birth the generation of Adam called the evil genraration of murders and liars. . . no grace applied '.

Abel the first mention of a person moved by the faith of Christ that worked in Abel to both will and empower him to do the good pleasure of God not seen

Hebrew11-4 By faith Abel offered unto God a more excellent sacrifice than Cain, by which he obtained witness that he was righteous, God testifying of his gifts: and by it he being dead yet speaketh.

Seth having the same spirit of faith passed on from Abel provides the the beginning of the the seed passed on from one earthly generation to the neat .

Seth , first in the genealogy list in Luke . Again the second born is used to indicate the first born of God (the son of circummsion ) our bloody husband Christ

Luke 3 :38 Which was the son of Enos, which was the son of Seth, which was the son of Adam, which was the son of God.

In that way the word generation is used in two ways .One to represent human generation (approx. 20 years) and the generation in respect to the righteous (Christ) the second born, compared again to the evil (Adam) the first of the corrupted flesh .

Just as faithless Cain saw no value in the the unseen works of God .Esau the first born passed on the seed to the second born Jacob
.Esau sold the first born rites for a cup of goat soup . Cain a little rest from hearing the gospel . Onan spilled the seed thinking it had to do with his flesh and blood .

While to life of the flesh is in the blood. Flesh and blood without the spiritual seed unseen the very essence of life is dead without a spirit . Literal flesh and blood did not, could not profit . God is not a man as us

I would offer its never been by what some call Judaism as a law of the fathers (oral traditons of men ) .But again the spiritual seed one not after the flesh of any nation.

Galatians 3:16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.

1 Corinthians 15:22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.

1 Corinthians 15:45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam (Christ) was made a quickening spirit.

 

[vhusley]

But is it God's gift of tongues for God to speak unto the people in their native language ( 1 Corinthians 14:21 ) or pagan's supernatural tongues of gibberish nonsense which can be found in Khunadlini, idolatries, religions, and the occult.( Isaiah 8:19 )? This is why believers are not to believe every spirit but test them and the tongues they bring. 1 John 4:1-6

Sorry. I edited and added to my original comment.

There is only ONE Holy Spirit and HE is the Spirit of God. (Ephesians 4:4-6)
When you are filled with the Holy Ghost and speak in tongues “as the Spirit gives you utterance,”….whether that be praying in a tongue, speaking prophetic tongues that must be interpreted, or the miraculous gift for an unbeliever in which they hear there their own (a foreign) language be spoken when you’ve never spoken that language….either way you WILL know its of God and not of man. No discernment needed there when it’s Gods Spirit working through you.

I agree with the Apostle Paul, “I wish you all spoke in tongues.” Sadly, most will never put aside their “own understanding” and yield enough to truly experience it. Sigh.

 

[GodB4Us]

Hi thanks for the reply .Ultimately how we use the word "generation" and "seed" singular has much to do with coming to the gospel truth

Abel talking to Cain has spiritual gospel overtones.

But again, it was Cain that had talked with Abel after God had spoken unto Cain. It was not written that God had spoken t Abel for which afterwards he came to talk to Cain as if relaying a message from God to Cain.

Cain resisted the words of the apostle Abel and Cain murdered Abel as the first martyr .

No scriptural basis for that motive for murder. God had warned Cain before hand of his jealousy and anger towards Abel for having a better offering to the Lord. It was that sin that served as Cain's motivation to kill Abel.

The father of lies a murderer from that very beginning.

That is referring to Satan and not Cain. Satan in effect "killed" Adam & Eve by tempting them to eat the forbidden fruit.

The beginning of the unseen spiritual seed of Christ it is given to represent the "second birth ". The genraration of Christ the second birth and not the first birth the generation of Adam called the evil genraration of murders and liars. . . no grace applied '.

Abel the first mention of a person moved by the faith of Christ that worked in Abel to both will and empower him to do the good pleasure of God not seen

Hebrew11-4 By faith Abel offered unto God a more excellent sacrifice than Cain, by which he obtained witness that he was righteous, God testifying of his gifts: and by it he being dead yet speaketh.

Hence Cain's motivation for murdering Abel.

Seth having the same spirit of faith passed on from Abel provides the the beginning of the the seed passed on from one earthly generation to the neat .

Seth , first in the genealogy list in Luke . Again the second born is used to indicate the first born of God (the son of circummsion ) our bloody husband Christ

Luke 3 :38 Which was the son of Enos, which was the son of Seth, which was the son of Adam, which was the son of God.

In that way the word generation is used in two ways .One to represent human generation (approx. 20 years) and the generation in respect to the righteous (Christ) the second born, compared again to the evil (Adam) the first of the corrupted flesh .

Just as faithless Cain saw no value in the the unseen works of God .Esau the first born passed on the seed to the second born Jacob
.Esau sold the first born rites for a cup of goat soup . Cain a little rest from hearing the gospel . Onan spilled the seed thinking it had to do with his flesh and blood .

Not sure how one can describe Cain as faithless when God had spoken to him. Carnal for sure, maybe even pride since he was the first born being shown up by his younger brother. but faithless?

While to life of the flesh is in the blood. Flesh and blood without the spiritual seed unseen the very essence of life is dead without a spirit . Literal flesh and blood did not, could not profit . God is not a man as us

I would offer its never been by what some call Judaism as a law of the fathers (oral traditons of men ) .But again the spiritual seed one not after the flesh of any nation.

Galatians 3:16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.

1 Corinthians 15:22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.

1 Corinthians 15:45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam (Christ) was made a quickening spirit.

You may find by His grace & by His help, that your presentations needs some editing.

 

[GodB4Us]

Sorry. I edited and added to my original comment.

There is only ONE Holy Spirit and HE is the Spirit of God. (Ephesians 4:4-6)
When you are filled with the Holy Ghost and speak in tongues “as the Spirit gives you utterance,”….whether that be praying in a tongue, speaking prophetic tongues that must be interpreted, or the miraculous gift for an unbeliever in which they hear there their own (a foreign) language be spoken when you’ve never spoken that language….either way you WILL know its of God and not of man. No discernment needed there when it’s Gods Spirit working through you.

I agree with the Apostle Paul, “I wish you all spoke in tongues.” Sadly, most will never put aside their “own understanding” and yield enough to truly experience it. Sigh.

Only because some may know that tongues for private use as gained by an extra notable phenomenon is not the real God's gifts of tongues. That why that phenomenon is not of Him at all for why many believers want to believe it is of God and thus assumed that tongue not coming with interpretation was for private use instead.

Since they hype that extra notable phenomenon by ascribing it as another baptism with the Holy Ghost with evidence of tongues is why many believers do not "fall" for that..... and some do lose self control & fall backwards in seeking that too.

Proverbs 25:26 A righteous man falling down before the wicked is as a troubled fountain, and a corrupt spring. 27 It is not good to eat much honey: so for men to search their own glory is not glory. 28 He that hath no rule over his own spirit is like a city that is broken down, and without walls.

By having another "drink" of the One Spirit to get that tongues for private use is why tongue speakers today are separating themselves from the body of Christ that share this singular testimony of having only one drink of the One Spirit.

1 Corinthians 14:12 For as the body is one, and hath many members, and all the members of that one body, being many, are one body: so also is Christ. 13 For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit. 14 For the body is not one member, but many.

1 Corinthians 1:9 God is faithful, by whom ye were called unto the fellowship of his Son Jesus Christ our Lord. 10 Now I beseech you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment.

Here at Talk Jesus, they do not adhere to those scripture below;

1 Corinthians 2:2 For I determined not to know any thing among you, save Jesus Christ, and him crucified.

But what have we here? Talk Tongues i.e. Talk Spirit instead. I dare say that tongue speakers today are not testing the spirits because they want to believe that extra notable phenomenon is of God as well as that tongue being for private use and neither one is of Him at all.

They do separate the body of Christ whether they realize this or not.

 

[God's Truth]

All of that is great, and I thank you for the effort you put in….and yes, Paul instructed the church to do things in orderly fashion. But back to the point that was being debated and the Bible’s answer: YES, TONGUES ARE STILL FOR TODAY.

Paul clearly instructed the church at Corinth NOT to forbid tongue speaking.

And I really don’t want to start up an argument again, but you are just missing so much because like so many who argue against tongues, you fail to see that there is MORE than just the GIFT of tongues. Paul is not necessarily talking about the Spiritual gift EVERY time speaks of “tongues.”

Two final points:
1. Get filled with the Holy Ghost. You can’t tell people who have been filled with the Holy Ghost and who have sincerely EXPERIENCED speaking in tongues “as THE SPIRIT gave them utterance,” that what they EXPERIENCED was false.

2. Rightly divide the Word of Truth. Precept upon precept, God’s Word stands and does not contradict itself. God is not a God of confusion. His Word was
not written to be so complicated that one has to have a concordance and be a Biblical scholar to find truth in it. Some things are simply meant to be read and taken at face value. And every Biblical truth is connected to and supported by other scripture. Paul plainly instructed the church at Corinth….the Gentiles church, which directly points to us and our churches today….to “not forbid speaking in tongues.” End of story. A person may try and rationalize that scripture away as creatively as they can, but it’s still there, gnawing away at Cessationists, and all of the so-called believers who attend churches that practice small faith or whose faith is dead faith. See James 2:14-26

Not everyone spoke in tongues, so that nullifies everything you said.

1 Corinthians 14:5 I would that ye all spake with tongues, but rather that ye prophesied: for greater is he that prophesieth than he that speaketh with tongues, except he interpret, that the church may receive edifying.

 

[God's Truth]

Hi thanks for the reply .Ultimately how we use the word "generation" and "seed" singular has much to do with coming to the gospel truth

Abel talking to Cain has spiritual gospel overtones. Cain resisted the words of the apostle Abel and Cain murdered Abel as the first martyr .

The father of lies a murderer from that very beginning.

The beginning of the unseen spiritual seed of Christ it is given to represent the "second birth ". The genraration of Christ the second birth and not the first birth the generation of Adam called the evil genraration of murders and liars. . . no grace applied '.

Abel the first mention of a person moved by the faith of Christ that worked in Abel to both will and empower him to do the good pleasure of God not seen

Hebrew11-4 By faith Abel offered unto God a more excellent sacrifice than Cain, by which he obtained witness that he was righteous, God testifying of his gifts: and by it he being dead yet speaketh.

Seth having the same spirit of faith passed on from Abel provides the the beginning of the the seed passed on from one earthly generation to the neat .

Seth , first in the genealogy list in Luke . Again the second born is used to indicate the first born of God (the son of circummsion ) our bloody husband Christ

Luke 3 :38 Which was the son of Enos, which was the son of Seth, which was the son of Adam, which was the son of God.

In that way the word generation is used in two ways .One to represent human generation (approx. 20 years) and the generation in respect to the righteous (Christ) the second born, compared again to the evil (Adam) the first of the corrupted flesh .

Just as faithless Cain saw no value in the the unseen works of God .Esau the first born passed on the seed to the second born Jacob
.Esau sold the first born rites for a cup of goat soup . Cain a little rest from hearing the gospel . Onan spilled the seed thinking it had to do with his flesh and blood .

While to life of the flesh is in the blood. Flesh and blood without the spiritual seed unseen the very essence of life is dead without a spirit . Literal flesh and blood did not, could not profit . God is not a man as us

I would offer its never been by what some call Judaism as a law of the fathers (oral traditons of men ) .But again the spiritual seed one not after the flesh of any nation.

Galatians 3:16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ.

1 Corinthians 15:22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.

1 Corinthians 15:45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam (Christ) was made a quickening spirit.

The devil is the father of lies, not Cain.
No scripture calls Abel a prophet or a martyr.
Only speak what the scriptures say.

 

[God's Truth]

@God's Truth

Paul also said for everything to be done in decency and order so in that regard, there is a time to forbid someone from speaking when there is no interpretation;

1 Corinthians 14:27 If any man speak in an unknown tongue, let it be by two, or at the most by three, and that by course; and let one interpret. 28 But if there be no interpreter, let him keep silence in the church; and let him speak to himself, and to God.

To discern the message in verse 28, one has to ask the Lord why instruct that person to be silent and yet seemingly still speaking to himself and to God? Is he mad? No. When you apply verse 26 of the practice where one by one, 2 or 3 speak in tongues and another interpret in that church service, a foreign visitor may stand up and speak out of turn in his own language, being unfamiliar with what is going on. This is why when there is no interpretation, he is to be instructed to be silent because he speaks to himself, meaning he understands what he is saying as God does too; not that he is mad talking to himself & to God.

@GodB4Us Hello, and welcome to the discuss.
I don't know how much of the thread you read, but I have explained these scriptures already. There is also another tongues thread going, you might want to check out.

Nice to read about your beliefs about tongues, and so far it looks as if our beliefs are the same about it.

 

[GodB4Us]

@GodB4Us Hello, and welcome to the discuss.
I don't know how much of the thread you read, but I have explained these scriptures already. There is also another tongues thread going, you might want to check out.

I have not read all the way through, but I was only tagging you because you were involved in that conversation with @vhusley

Nice to read about your beliefs about tongues, and so far it looks as if our beliefs are the same about it.

Yes, thanks to the Lord, it does look the same so far. May God cause the increase in recovering some from this snare of the devil, brother. 2 Timothy 2:24-26 1 Timothy 4:1 & Isaiah 8:19

 

[vhusley]

Not everyone spoke in tongues, so that nullifies everything you said.

1 Corinthians 14:5 I would that ye all spake with tongues, but rather that ye prophesied: for greater is he that prophesieth than he that speaketh with tongues, except he interpret, that the church may receive edifying.

Who said everyone WOULD speak in tongues?
Who said everyone would be filled with the Holy Ghost?
Who said everyone would operate in EVERY spiritual gift?
Who said everyone who claims to be saved and to be a believer really is?
What’s your point?

The point for me is, the Bible clearly speaks of more than just the GIFT of tongues…..and so does Paul. Rationalize around it all you’d like. You can’t take away from what God’s Word says and you can’t take away from what so many have already EXPERIENCED for themselves.
You telling me that me speaking in tongues is not real is like me telling you your salvation experience wasn’t real.
How would that make you feel?

You really need to follow Solomon’s (God’s) advice from Proverbs and stop leaning on YOUR own understanding so much.