Hi thanks for the reply.
I would agree there are other portions that have the same kind of understanding.
Believer cannot fall away from grace. A person cannot fall away from someone that was not of their own selves to begin with .Our new born again faith as a understanding comes from hearing God previously having no faith that could please him as it is written . Without his faith working in his children no man could please God.
Believers having a new faith not of their own selves cannot fall away from grace. They can deny Christ but Christ cannot deny us if he has given us the power as new creatures
2 Timothy 2:12-13King James VersionIf we suffer, we shall also reign with him: if
we deny him, he also will
deny us:
If we
believe not,
yet he abideth
faithful: he cannot deny
himself.
he is our very confidence till the end
They in hebrew 6 fall short of receiving it as the glory of God, Having tasted of the good word they did not trust it as the word of God. They fell just as mankind in the garden. Believers blessed by God taste and see given the light of his glory that works in our new heart.
Better things come with or along side salvation. with the believer of Hebrews 6 . Our father promises us he will not forget the good works we offer towards his power to both taste and see (trust )
Psalm 34:8 O
taste and
see that the
Lord is good: blessed is the man that
trusteth in
him.
Believers CAN fall away and CAN fall short of God's grace. Would you deny scripture?
Now I want to remind you, although you once fully knew it, that the Lord, who saved a people out of the land of Egypt, afterward destroyed those who did not believe. –
Jude 1:5 (God brought destruction upon His own chosen once they turned away from Him and fell into disbelief)
I am astonished that you are
so quickly deserting him who called you in the grace of Christ and are turning to a different gospel— not that there is another one, but there are some who trouble you and want to distort the gospel of Christ. But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach to you a gospel contrary to the one we preached to you, let him be accursed.
Galatians 1:6-8 (Shows us that even those under the grace of Christ can turn away to a different gospel...they will be "accursed")
For it is impossible, in the case of those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift,
and have shared in the Holy Spirit, and have tasted the goodness of the word of God and the powers of the age to come, and then have fallen away, to restore them again to repentance, since they are crucifying once again the Son of God to their own harm and holding him up to contempt. For land that has drunk the rain that often falls on it, and produces a crop useful to those for whose sake it is cultivated, receives a blessing from God. But if it bears thorns and thistles, it is worthless and near to being cursed, and its end is to be burned. –
Hebrews 6:4-8 (You referenced this verse and seemed to claim that those who have merely "tasted" of the "heavenly gift" and of the "goodness of God" were not fully converted yet; however you fail to address the part that says they have "shared in the Holy Spirit" and have "fallen away." This clearly shows that they were partakers....not outsiders. A person doesn't receive a "part" of the Holy Spirit......it's all or nothing. If you disagree, please show me in scripture where someone only receives a portion of the Holy Spirit that is insufficient to save them. That goes against God's promise to believers. So if these men shared in ANY of the Holy Spirit, then exegetically speaking, they had received the Holy Spirit, and we must believe they were "fully" saved.)
“And to the angel of the church in Sardis write: ‘The words of him who has the seven spirits of God and the seven stars. “‘I know your works. You have the reputation of being alive, but you are dead. Wake up, and strengthen what remains and is about to die, for
I have not found your works complete in the sight of my God. Remember, then,
what you received and heard. Keep it, and repent. If you will not wake up, I will come like a thief, and you will not know at what hour I will come against you. Yet you have still a few names in Sardis, people who have not soiled their garments, and they will walk with me in white, for they are worthy.
The one who conquers will be clothed thus in white garments, and I will never blot his name out of the book of life. I will confess his name before my Father and before his angels.’” –
Revelation 3:1-5
(Here we see part of John's prophecy, from the letters to the 7 churches....a warning to BELIEVERS. These are people who'd heard and RECEIVED the Gospel, and yet their works were incomplete. God warns that he will come against them and that only those who conquer (overcome) will remain in the lamb's Book of Life. This also shows us that God CAN and WILL blot peoples names from the book......otherwise why would he give the church CONDITIONS under which their names would not be blotted out.; see Exodus 32;32-33, also Rev 22:19 "And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the Book of Life....")
Take care,
brothers, lest there be in any of you an evil, unbelieving heart,
leading you to fall away from the living God. But exhort one another every day, as long as it is called “today,” that none of you may be hardened by the deceitfulness of sin. For
we have come to share in Christ, IF indeed we hold our original confidence firm to the end. As it is said, “Today, if you hear his voice, do not harden your hearts as in the rebellion.” For who were those who heard and yet rebelled? Was it not all those who left Egypt led by Moses? And with whom was he provoked for forty years? Was it not with those who sinned, whose bodies fell in the wilderness? And to whom did he swear that they would not enter his rest, but to those who were disobedient? So we see that
they were unable to enter because of unbelief. Hebrews 3:12-19 (to whom is he warning about falling away? It's clear the author is addressing the BRETHREN......believers.....saved people. Those who were lost, were outside the Body of Christ.....they were never referred to as brethren.)
Therefore
do not throw away your confidence, which has a great
reward (salvation). For you have need of endurance, so that when you have done the will of God you may receive
what is promised. For, “Yet a little while, and the coming one will come and will not delay; but
my righteous one shall live by faith, and if
he shrinks back, my soul has no pleasure in him.” But we are not of those who
shrink back and are destroyed, but of those who have faith and preserve their souls.
Hebrews 10:35-39
For when you were slaves of sin, you were free in regard to righteousness. But what fruit were you getting at that time from the things of which you are now ashamed? For the end of those things is death. But
now that you have been set free from sin and have become slaves of God, the
fruit you get leads to sanctification and its end, eternal life. For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord. –
Romans 6:20-23
Judas was a follower and believer but was lost:
“While I was with them, I
kept them in your name, which you have given me. I have guarded them, and
not one of them has been lost except the son of destruction, that the Scripture might be fulfilled.” (Jesus praying) –
John 17:12
In those days Peter stood up among the brothers (the company of persons was in all about 120) and said, “Brothers, the Scripture had to be fulfilled, which the Holy Spirit spoke beforehand by the mouth of David concerning
Judas, who became a guide to those who arrested Jesus. For
he was numbered among us and was allotted his share in this ministry.” (Now this man acquired a field with the reward of his wickedness, and falling headlong he burst open in the middle and all his bowels gushed out. And it became known to all the inhabitants of Jerusalem, so that the field was called in their own language Akeldama, that is, Field of Blood.) “For it is written in the Book of Psalms, ‘May his camp become desolate, and let there be no one to dwell in it; and Let another take his office.’” -
Acts 1:15-20 (Judas clearly fell from the calling and the grace of God)
This charge I entrust to you, Timothy, my child, in accordance with the prophecies previously made about you, that by them you may wage the good warfare, holding faith and a good conscience.
By rejecting this, some have made shipwreck of their faith, among whom are Hymenaeus and Alexander, whom I have handed over to Satan that they may learn not to blaspheme. –
1Timothy 1:18-20 (Paul was actually given the authority to hand brothers who had turned from their faith over, physically, to Satan)
and their talk will spread like gangrene. Among them are Hymenaeus and Philetus,
who have swerved from the truth, saying that the resurrection has already happened. They are upsetting the faith of some. –
2 Timothy 2:17-18
Therefore, my beloved, just as you have always obeyed, not only in my presence, but now even more in my absence,
continue to work out your salvation with fear and trembling. –
Philippians 2:12
“But suppose that servant says in his heart, ‘My master will be a long time in coming,’ and he begins to beat the menservants and maidservants, and to eat and drink and get drunk. The
master of that servant will come on a day he does not expect and at an hour he does not anticipate. Then
he will cut him to pieces and assign him a place with the unbelievers…….. from everyone who has been given much, much will be required; and from him who has been entrusted with much, even more will be demanded.” –
Luke 12:45-48
You will say then, “Branches were broken off so that I could be grafted in.” That is correct:
They were broken off because of unbelief, but you stand by faith. Do not be arrogant, but be afraid.
For if God did not spare the natural branches, He will certainly not spare you either. Take notice, therefore, of the kindness and severity of God: severity to those who fell, but kindness to you, if you continue in His kindness. Otherwise you also will be cut off. And if they do not persist in unbelief, they will be grafted in, for God is able to graft them in again. –
Romans 11:19-23 (Who are the "branches" that have been "grafted in"? We are! And God's Word clearly tells us we can be cut off!)
He cuts off every branch in Me that bears no fruit, and every branch that does bear fruit, He prunes to make it even more fruitful. You are already clean because of the word I have spoken to you.
Remain in Me, and I will remain in you. Just as no branch can bear fruit by itself unless it remains in the vine, neither can you bear fruit unless you remain in Me. I am the vine and you are the branches.
The one who remains in Me, and I in him, will bear much fruit. For apart from Me you can do nothing.
If anyone does not remain in Me, he is like a branch that is thrown away and withers. Such branches are gathered up, thrown into the fire, and burned. –
John 15:2-6 (Hey, whaddaya know, more about us "branches". This time we are warned to "remain in Him" or we risked being broken off and cast into the fire.)
Do you not know that you yourselves are God’s temple, and that God’s Spirit dwells in you? I
f anyone destroys God’s temple, God will destroy him; for God’s temple is holy, and you are that temple. -
1 Corinthians 3:16-17
So the one who thinks he is standing firm should
be careful not to FALL. –
1 Corinthians 10:12
Now, brothers, I want to remind you of the
gospel I preached to you, which
you received, and in which you
stand firm. By this gospel
you are saved,
IF you hold firmly to the word I preached to you. Otherwise, you have believed in vain. –
1 Corinthians 15:1-2 (This is the promise of salvation to believers who are "standing firm" but only IF they hold on. Big IF right there, wouldn't you say? LIttle words oft overlooked in scripture can be so important!)
You who are trying to be justified by the law have been
severed from Christ; you have fallen away from grace.
Galatians 5:4 (being SEVERED from Christ means that they must have once been part of Him. Don't think so? Look up the word in Greek.... It means exactly what the English translation "sever" means: to cut away from)
He must not be a
recent convert, or he may become conceited and
fall under the same condemnation as the devil. Furthermore, he must have a good reputation with outsiders, so that he will not fall into disgrace and into the snare of the devil. –
1 Timothy 3:6-7 (What? You mean a CONVERT can fall and actually face the "same condemnation as the devil??" Seems so.....if you're following God's Word to the letter and rightly dividing it)
Now the Spirit expressly states that in later times
some will abandon the faith to follow deceitful spirits and the teachings of demons, -
1 Timothy 4:1
and thus
will incur judgment because they are setting aside their first faith. –
1 Timothy 5:12
For some have already
turned aside to follow Satan. –
1 Timothy 5:15 (Turned aside? From what? From whom? The lost already belong to Satan. Must be talking about believers here.)
See to it that no one
falls short of the grace of God, and that no root of bitterness springs up to cause trouble and defile many. See to it that no one is sexually immoral, or is godless like Esau, who for a single meal sold his birthright. For you know that afterward, when he wanted to inherit the blessing, he was rejected.
He could find no ground for repentance, though he sought the blessing with tears. –
Hebrews 12:15-17 (Wait, I thought God's grace was sufficient to reach us, to save us, sufficient for ALL? It certainly IS! However; it IS possible, as this scripture illustrates, for us to mess it up and cause ourselves to fall short of it!)
My
brothers, if one of
you should
wander from the truth and someone should
bring him back, consider this: Whoever turns a sinner from the error of his way
will save his soul from death and cover over a multitude of sins. –
James 5:19-20 (So a BROTHER can wander from truth...fall...and be brought back. When this happens, his soul is being SAVED FROM DEATH. He was a brother....already saved, right? Could this possibly mean that by falling, he could have lost his salvation??)
They have
left the straight way and
wandered off to follow the way of Balaam son of Beor, who loved the wages of wickedness. –
2 Peter 2:15
If indeed they have
escaped the corruption of the world through the knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ,
only to be entangled and overcome by it again, their
final condition is worse than it was at first.
It would have been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness than to have known it and then to turn away from the holy commandment passed on to them. –
2 Peter 2:20-21 (So they "knew the way of righteousness" but then turned away from it and back to the world, and Peter says their condition is now WORSE than it was before. Before what? Before they were saved!)
I could go on....and on if you'd like. God's Word is full of warnings....for believers.....against falling from belief and grace and into destruction.
PM me if you're interested in going deeper in truth. I'm willing to host a Bible study via Zoom or Google Meet.
