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Why doesn't God heal everyone?

You know? I am sure I gave you the definition of tempted, temptation....I guess it wasn't in English Or maybe I used invisible ink? LOL Actually, my friend, if you'll read my post above, you'll see that temptation is not just seducing someone to sin.

I did read it, which is why I said what I did. The thorn in the flesh was not a test, trial, or temptation. It was a thorn in the flesh given to keep Paul humble. Thus your post [HASH=1946]#(54[/HASH]) does not pertain to what I said.

Quantrill
 
I did read it, which is why I said what I did. The thorn in the flesh was not a test, trial, or temptation. It was a thorn in the flesh given to keep Paul humble. Thus your post [HASH=1946]#(54[/HASH]) does not pertain to what I said.

Quantrill
So you're saying that it was an actual thorn? Ok. Add that to "a messenger of Satan that was sent to buffet me" What to you get now? Do you get that Satan sent a messenger to make Pauls life miserable? Or do you blame God for sending someone who does not even work for Him to make Paul miserable? Where does God get any glory for somebody suffering? All that does is to say God cannot take care of His own. and that His Word is simply a lie... If God says "By Jesus' stripes you are healed, then he makes one of His kids sick....Then He is simply lying....So...Which is it?
 
Greetings brothers @Bendito @Dovegiven

From reading about Joni Earekson Tada.....it is very apparent that she sought the Lord for healing from her paralysis

“I wanted desperately to be healed.” When friends would come into the hospital to visit me and we asked, “Should we read anything to you from the Bible?” I would always, always ask for John chapter 5, “Please read to me from there.” When I read it here, you’ll understand why.

“For there is in Jerusalem near the sheep gate a pool which is called Bethesda and which is surrounded by five covered colonnades, here a great number of disabled people used to lie, the blind, the lame, the paralyzed. One who was there had been an invalid for 38 years when Jesus saw him lying there and learned that he had been in this condition or a long time,” gee, if he thinks 38 years is a long time, I wonder what he thinks of 46?

Then later.....


O God, help me to step into that a no answer, Lord Jesus, to a request for physical healing has meant that I’m depending more on Your grace, but it’s increasing my compassion for others who are hurt and disabled, it’s help me put complaining behind me, it stretched my grope(?), it has pushed me to give thanks in times of sorrow. It has increased my faith. It has strengthened my hope of heaven and it’s made me love You so much more…so much more. It is such a safe wonderful thing to be back in the inner sanctum of the fellowship of sharing in Your sufferings. And I would not trade it for any amount of walking.”
That is the deeper healing. That’s the real healing. When Charles Wesley writes that Jesus has risen with healing in His wings, that’s the kind of healing that you would not trade for anything, no amount of walking.



Do you believe that the Lord has used Joni, or that she is missing out on something she could still receive?

To me her testimony is amazing and through her the Lord has helped many struggling with disability.
 
So you're saying that it was an actual thorn? Ok. Add that to "a messenger of Satan that was sent to buffet me" What to you get now? Do you get that Satan sent a messenger to make Pauls life miserable? Or do you blame God for sending someone who does not even work for Him to make Paul miserable? Where does God get any glory for somebody suffering? All that does is to say God cannot take care of His own. and that His Word is simply a lie... If God says "By Jesus' stripes you are healed, then he makes one of His kids sick....Then He is simply lying....So...Which is it?

I'm saying the thorn was not a trial, or temptation, or test. Whatever it was, it came from God through a messenger of satan. The thorn definitely was troublesome to Paul, as it kept him humble. God gets glory from Pauls thorn because it keeps Paul from glorifying himself instead of God.

Just the opposite of what you say...This is God taking care of His own. The revelation Paul received would have destroyed any man unless God provides the thorn to humble him. No, I don't blame God for that. I praise God for that.

Understand I didn't say the thorn was a sickness either. But, (Is. 53:5) has to do with our transgression, iniquity, and peace with God. Not our physical health. See also (1 Pet. 2:24) And your comments that God doesn't bring sickness upon a person or people has been proven false in our last exchange with Job. So your multiple choice question is inadequate. God is not a liar, and God does bring sickness upon a people. And God can and still does heal, but not always. It is His decision, not ours.

Quantrill
 
Greetings brothers @Bendito @Dovegiven

From reading about Joni Earekson Tada.....it is very apparent that she sought the Lord for healing from her paralysis

“I wanted desperately to be healed.” When friends would come into the hospital to visit me and we asked, “Should we read anything to you from the Bible?” I would always, always ask for John chapter 5, “Please read to me from there.” When I read it here, you’ll understand why.

“For there is in Jerusalem near the sheep gate a pool which is called Bethesda and which is surrounded by five covered colonnades, here a great number of disabled people used to lie, the blind, the lame, the paralyzed. One who was there had been an invalid for 38 years when Jesus saw him lying there and learned that he had been in this condition or a long time,” gee, if he thinks 38 years is a long time, I wonder what he thinks of 46?

Then later.....


O God, help me to step into that a no answer, Lord Jesus, to a request for physical healing has meant that I’m depending more on Your grace, but it’s increasing my compassion for others who are hurt and disabled, it’s help me put complaining behind me, it stretched my grope(?), it has pushed me to give thanks in times of sorrow. It has increased my faith. It has strengthened my hope of heaven and it’s made me love You so much more…so much more. It is such a safe wonderful thing to be back in the inner sanctum of the fellowship of sharing in Your sufferings. And I would not trade it for any amount of walking.”
That is the deeper healing. That’s the real healing. When Charles Wesley writes that Jesus has risen with healing in His wings, that’s the kind of healing that you would not trade for anything, no amount of walking.



Do you believe that the Lord has used Joni, or that she is missing out on something she could still receive?

To me her testimony is amazing and through her the Lord has helped many struggling with disability.
I know that I would have chosen other verses for my healing. I would have taken promises of healing rather than a report of a healing. I can understand why the lady did not believe for her healing.....But can God use her to His glory even with her broken body? He certainly can!
Romans 8:24-30
24 It was in this hope that we were saved. But if we see what we hope for, it isn’t hope — after all, who hopes for what he already sees? 25 But if we continue hoping for something we don’t see, then we still wait eagerly for it, with perseverance.

26 Similarly, the Spirit helps us in our weakness; for we don’t know how to pray the way we should. But the Spirit himself pleads on our behalf with groanings too deep for words; 27 and the one who searches hearts knows exactly what the Spirit is thinking, because his pleadings for God’s people accord with God’s will. 28 Furthermore, we know that God causes everything to work together for the good of those who love God and are called in accordance with his purpose; 29 because those whom he knew in advance, he also determined in advance would be conformed to the pattern of his Son, so that he might be the firstborn among many brothers; 30 and those whom he thus determined in advance, he also called; and those whom he called, he also caused to be considered righteous; and those whom he caused to be considered righteous he also glorified! Look at vs 28-29. Joni Earekson Tada has been used big time by our loving Father.....even as she is....Consider now....how could God have used her if her injuries had been healed, documented?
 
I'm saying the thorn was not a trial, or temptation, or test. Whatever it was, it came from God through a messenger of satan. The thorn definitely was troublesome to Paul, as it kept him humble. God gets glory from Pauls thorn because it keeps Paul from glorifying himself instead of God.

Just the opposite of what you say...This is God taking care of His own. The revelation Paul received would have destroyed any man unless God provides the thorn to humble him. No, I don't blame God for that. I praise God for that.

Understand I didn't say the thorn was a sickness either. But, (Is. 53:5) has to do with our transgression, iniquity, and peace with God. Not our physical health. See also (1 Pet. 2:24) And your comments that God doesn't bring sickness upon a person or people has been proven false in our last exchange with Job. So your multiple choice question is inadequate. God is not a liar, and God does bring sickness upon a people. And God can and still does heal, but not always. It is His decision, not ours.

Quantrill
This does not line up with the Word at all.
 
My husband has very poor eyesight.

He believes that the Lord is abundantly able to heal and willingly accepts healing.

Healing has not occurred.

@Bendito @Dovegiven

He believes
He has faith
He wants the healing

If healing is there to be taken for all .....what does he need to do differently?
 
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My husband has very poor eyesight.

He believes that the Lord is abundantly able to heal and willingly accepts healing.

Healing has not occurred.

@Bendito @Dovegiven

He believes
He has faith
He wants the healing

If healing is there to be taken for all .....what does he need to do differently?
Little sister....You say his healing has not occurred? You must read 1 Peter 2:24 again..aloud...Every single time you feel like saying his healing has not happened, that he is not healed....Read that verse aloud....Who is right? You? Or the Word? Hugs on both of you.
 
"And God allowed this to happen, why?" Nick God did not allow it to happen...Paul did.....Until God told him how to end it. We have dominion in the Earth, God does not..We reign and rule in the Earth...God does not. But thats another thread... What would be Gods purpose in beating on Paul? Really...If God did not want Paul to get all puffed up, all He would do is to show Paul less amazing stuff. Again Nick....This blaming, slandering of God is almost unbearable to me. Why do Christians blame God for Satans work then let Satan off the hook? Who's people are we anyway?!

Hello Bendito,
God allows a lot of things to happen. Otherwise, free will would just be two words and hold no significance at all. I believe, I answered, and Scripture answers why God allowed what happened to occur to Brother Paul. We are just not coming to the same understanding of said Scripture. Which of course will have us going in circles dear brother.

As far as the blaming, slandering of God being unbearable to you. Dear Brother understand that God can take care of Himself, and His Word. So, don't put such a burden upon yourself unnecessarily. I love Him too.

With the Love of Christ Jesus. Peace between us Dear Brother on this thread.
YBIC
Nick
<><
 
Little sister....You say his healing has not occurred? You must read 1 Peter 2:24 again..aloud...Every single time you feel like saying his healing has not happened, that he is not healed....Read that verse aloud....Who is right? You? Or the Word? Hugs on both of you.

(1 Peter 2:24) says nothing about physical healing. "...dead to sins,...live unto righteousness...by whose stripes we are healed." The Word is always right. You however are misapplying the Word.

You leave one with the belief that it is their fault they are not healed...and offer hugs? Please!

Quantrill
 
Why would satan bother Paul in order to keep him humble when it is satan who tries to puff us up?

:smile: This is the problem brother. Do you believe that Satan was able to do this on his own accord or did God allow him to send his messenger?
This is why I bring up Job. God did not do it to Job, nor did He do it Paul. However, He did allow it to happen by giving permission to satan, and though we might not necessarily see it in our frail/faulty human understanding. It assuredly benefited both of them that it was so. Probably to great frustration of satan.

What happens when God Exalts You?
You Shine Bright unto the People.

Agreed!!! Totally.
Don't you believe that God humbles His Servants first before exalting them?

To say God refused to heal Paul is a direct misunderstanding of what is meant by God saying My Grace is Sufficent and in your weakness or infirmities my Grace, Strengths (Power) is Big in YOU!!

I'm glad you wrote the above. For in truth Brother Paul was healed in a manner of speaking. Just not as humanity would see it as being. In truth, call it as I mentioned it in #47, flu shot. At least as it pertains to your words which I placed emphasis above.

I'm lagging behind a bit, in the reading & replies, but wanted to make mention specifically to the above posting of yours. I truly see the issue between us, which is not the Word, but of perspective and the hierarchy of authority also of semantics. Meaning, who allows who to do what, and how we see that which has happened.

With the Love of Christ Jesus Dear Brother!
YBIC
Nick
<><
 
Hello Bendito,
God allows a lot of things to happen. Otherwise, free will would just be two words and hold no significance at all. I believe, I answered, and Scripture answers why God allowed what happened to occur to Brother Paul. We are just not coming to the same understanding of said Scripture. Which of course will have us going in circles dear brother.

As far as the blaming, slandering of God being unbearable to you. Dear Brother understand that God can take care of Himself, and His Word. So, don't put such a burden upon yourself unnecessarily. I love Him too.

With the Love of Christ Jesus. Peace between us Dear Brother on this thread.
YBIC
Nick
<><
Nick, old Nick.....What does it mean to you when God tells you to have dominion over all the Earth? You do have dominion over your part of it. Like it or not, you're in charge. So if a tornado were to come to your neck of the woods, would you allow it to destroy your house and injure people? Or would you shut it down....Would you simply let it do all its damage and then tell God its His doing?

Where does the Bible say God gave permission to Satan to torment anybody? God set restrictions but did not give permission. In the case of Job.....Satan had dominion in the Earth, at that time, so he had a legal right to torment Job.
 
:smile: This is the problem brother. Do you believe that Satan was able to do this on his own accord or did God allow him to send his messenger?
This is why I bring up Job. God did not do it to Job, nor did He do it Paul. However, He did allow it to happen by giving permission to satan, and though we might not necessarily see it in our frail/faulty human understanding. It assuredly benefited both of them that it was so. Probably to great frustration of satan.



Agreed!!! Totally.
Don't you believe that God humbles His Servants first before exalting them?



I'm glad you wrote the above. For in truth Brother Paul was healed in a manner of speaking. Just not as humanity would see it as being. In truth, call it as I mentioned it in #47, flu shot. At least as it pertains to your words which I placed emphasis above.

I'm lagging behind a bit, in the reading & replies, but wanted to make mention specifically to the above posting of yours. I truly see the issue between us, which is not the Word, but of perspective and the hierarchy of authority also of semantics. Meaning, who allows who to do what, and how we see that which has happened.

With the Love of Christ Jesus Dear Brother!
YBIC
Nick
<><
Good grief Nick! The bible does not even hint at Paul being sick. Paul was weakened by his busy schedule, all the wonderful things God had shown him, and then by all the beatings he had taken at Satans behest....But he was not sick. He did not need healing.
 
(1 Peter 2:24) says nothing about physical healing. "...dead to sins,...live unto righteousness...by whose stripes we are healed." The Word is always right. You however are misapplying the Word.

You leave one with the belief that it is their fault they are not healed...and offer hugs? Please!

Quantrill
Mr Quantrill I wish you understood the Word better....You would be much happier.
 
Fragrant Grace...Little Sister....I am not saying that your hugsband isn't getting healed...I'm not saying its his fault he is not healed yet. There is no blame to assign here. And 1Peter 2:24 does refer to physical healing, it refers too to spiritual healing, it refers to emotional healing....By Jesus stripes, you/we WERE healed.
I am simply saying that hugsband needs to steep in scriptures like this one until it clicks in his spirit....For one to say, "I believe that" is to say. "I mentally assent to that" Your spirit needs to receive the Word and when it does, nothing will stop the blessing of God.
 
I did read it, which is why I said what I did. The thorn in the flesh was not a test, trial, or temptation. It was a thorn in the flesh given to keep Paul humble. Thus your post [HASH=1946]#(54[/HASH]) does not pertain to what I said.

Quantrill
You know of course that the Bible does NOT say that God put this thorn on Paul? You're reading that in.
 
It might seem like an insignificant comment, but Isa 45:7 has suffered way too much misinterpretation over the centuries, and is sometimes used in the line of this thread. The subject of verses 1-10 was a prophecy for Cyrus, who wasn't yet born, outlining an event two centuries to come. There was no mention of sin, but of kings and kingdoms to be weakened so they could be vanquished for the sake of Israel. The "evil" there is not the darkness of Satan, or even sin, but is more properly interpreted as "calamity" or "misery" by way of like the curses of the Law in the absence of blessings of the law of God, here more along the lines of God setting up that king above all others as sovereign concerning Israel, untouchable,and disastrous to many kingdoms who resisted. Nobody would be allowed to question Cyrus or God's intentions for him. Only hard times would fall for those resisting that king. Consequences were severe for many armies without God lifting a finger, for He anointed the man for that work, and blessed him with magnificent treasures of those fallen kingdoms.

The consequences of resisting wisdom, for instance, has a person suffering pain of sunburn for being in the sun too long. God doesn't have to create pain or sun damage. It is simply a consequence of bad choice concerning His creation, how things work.

Let me point out that God did not create lying. Satan is the father of that.
John 8:44-45 (KJV)
44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.
45 And because I tell you the truth, ye believe me not.

If not that, what prevents Satan from having introduced other evils as though a creator, sharing in the Creation? I don't see evidence Satan got his ideas from holy God, while God is the father of truth. People often believe Satan's lies while ignoring the known truth. Resisting God leaves only misery behind without misery having to be created. The sun puts light on surfaces, while wherever light is blocked reigns darkness. Darkness is simply absence of light. God perhaps began creation by creating literal darkness until making the sun.

No military accepts disabled candidates for uniformed service. God can use the disabled in ministry like disabled ivilians can find employment with the government. They need a reqired skill, while God provides a calling and anointing. But our God is not part of making or keeping a person in torture or misery so they can be used. He can at least equally use a fit person, and is delighted to be part of healing folks to be better able to serve.

Again, God is not expected to say "No" to healing. Jesus didn't do that. He was and is "Yea". The problem is with those needing healing, though the sick may in fact have come to a point there is no problem with their disability, so will not expect healing for themselves, but can delight in the healing and salvation of others, seeing their disability opens up connections to others suffering. In that way God can receive glory from unhealed ministers.

Lastly, I see comments in the groups and in books that the lack of documentation of miraculous healing in the majority of time since the First Church days indicates healing passed away with the apostles. What really happened was a deep void of knowledge of scriptures prevailed. Priests had control of what congregations could learn. Teaching faith was not one of their favorite subjects. They kept believers even ignorant of what made them believers. Believing for miracles was not known through the Middle Ages until people began to have access to Bibles and accountability of the clergy.

Hello Brother,
I agree with you is that it is prophetic, even though I don't know if Cyrus was in existence yet when this was written. I haven't researched that. I do also see Isaiah 45:7, as God explaining who He is to those who do not know Him, along with many of the other verses included in this Chapter.

We can extract much significance from Scripture outside its obvious application. In this case we also see that He, God, like He did in Job is showing those who do not know Him, who He Is, by the way of what He has done. There are great similarities between Job and what is written in Isaiah Chapter 45. So, I would not limit them to an singular reasoning. To do so would take away great knowledge from the reader.

As to the rest of what you have written in this post. It has more to do with the "free will" aspect that I briefly mentioned to Brother Bendito and "God's will". Disregarding either one, can color how one comes to view as my wife likes to say "Yes, No, Not Now" as it pertains to placing requests to God. What we may see as needing healing, is something that God sees as necessary and ultimately beneficial. Regardless of the answer should we not then Glorify Him that it is to our good that He is doing so?

I tell people not to be so caught up in the temporal which is hard to do, because the ready reply is "You're not going through it, so it's easy for you to say.". My Hope is in the Lord, and the promises written in Scripture. However, I don't isolate them or put them separate from the will of God for me in this life. So, if I'm not healed, I could easily beat myself up that it must be for my lack, for what other reason could there be? Or, I can submit myself to the will of God, so that whatever, condition I find myself to be in, that the ensuing results are to the Glory of God! Sometimes Christians can be the saddest sick people I know. That is why I truly try to lift up their sagging spirits. We have so much to look forward to, because ultimately we're all going to die. Let us die joyfully! For our Lord has conquered death, and there is much to do before our work is done.

I hope this clarifies a little of what I have posted and have seen in your words.

With the Love of Christ Jesus Brother.
YBIC
Nick
<><
 
Good grief Nick! The bible does not even hint at Paul being sick. Paul was weakened by his busy schedule, all the wonderful things God had shown him, and then by all the beatings he had taken at Satans behest....But he was not sick. He did not need healing.

Hello Brother,
I'm breaking my own word/thoughts on this. I wasn't going to continue this with you brother. I prefer a peaceful, separation on conflicting thoughts, that only go in circles.

Now "Good grief..."? I guess "grief" can be cathartic, but I never looked it as being good.....hummm :-)

Sickness as I mentioned to Brother Dovegiven, can be many things. Physical, mental, spiritual.
As far as needing healing.....did you read my flu shot analogy? :-) Yeah, I know...what did I say about analogies before? (Rolling eyes) :-)

Still love me brother?
Love you brother!
With the Love of Christ Jesus.
YBIC
Nick
<><
 
Nick, old Nick.....What does it mean to you when God tells you to have dominion over all the Earth? You do have dominion over your part of it. Like it or not, you're in charge. So if a tornado were to come to your neck of the woods, would you allow it to destroy your house and injure people? Or would you shut it down....Would you simply let it do all its damage and then tell God its His doing?

Where does the Bible say God gave permission to Satan to torment anybody? God set restrictions but did not give permission. In the case of Job.....Satan had dominion in the Earth, at that time, so he had a legal right to torment Job.

Real quick on this one brother. Do you believe that God has authority over satan?

Oh, I'm all about submitting to God's will......though I sometimes fight it tooth & claw, because it's not something I want to do. :(
 
Real quick on this one brother. Do you believe that God has authority over satan?

Oh, I'm all about submitting to God's will......though I sometimes fight it tooth & claw, because it's not something I want to do. :crying:
LOLOL God has authority over Satan, but He also set laws that need to be lived by, and He follows His laws as well as we must. So....He set us in dominion in the Earth....He'll allow us to reign in the Earth because He will not break His Word. God's authority over Satan is actually secondary to His Word. There is no higher authority than His Word. BTW The story of Pauls thorn does not even mention sickness. Of any kind.
 
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